The most modern and effective bolt action service rifle ever?

Your favourite bolt action service rifle and please explain why

  • Mas Mlle 1936

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Madsen M47

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • M43 Spanish Mauser

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • M43 Spanish Mauser

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • M1944 (Russian)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    60

ugly

LE
Moderator
#1
I had thought of putting this in mil history but here seems a good place. There has been a bit of discussion regarding the latest L85A3 and somebody posted that at least it wasn't the MAS 36.
Heretics, of course due to a lack of exposure I accept that most of you wouldn't have fired the Mas Mlle 1936 but that doesn't matter, it was the best service rifle when introduced.
Think about it, the rifle conformed to a doctrine where chambering a round was only when ordered. The sights are only adjustable for elevation and its only drawback was a 5 shot magazine filled with flimsy chargers. The round was what the US were trying to achieve with the 7.62 x 51 only 20 years earlier and it wasn't actually meant to arm the front line troops, it was an interim issue until the detachable 10 round magazine fed self loader Mlle 1944 was issued.
A robust no nonsense bolt, good sights and a bayonet that you had to hand always.
I'm going to post my top bolt action service rifles in order of importance or seniority. The cut off will be 1950
No1 the Mas Mlle 1936 7.5 x 54
M36_-_complet-11.jpg

No2 The 1947 Madsen M47 - Wikipedia .30-06
11704946_1.jpg
madsenm47parts.jpg

No3 The No4 Mk2 (and any other conversions to this standard) .303 (because its rule .303)
untitled.png


No4 Spanish M43 Mauser 8mm Mauser (got to have a Mauser and this was the least fiddly version)

450px-Vz33-CzM.jpg

There are many others which I wont list but you can choose if you are that way inclined

The reason behind this choice is simplification of a rifle from long development work (apart from the Mas and the Madsen) and the cartridge chosen for them. The 7.5 x 55 Swiss underwent many changes in its lifetime, not sure if the clockwork monsters it fed are worthy of mention though!
 
#2
I had thought of putting this in mil history but here seems a good place. There has been a bit of discussion regarding the latest L85A3 and somebody posted that at least it wasn't the MAS 36.
Heretics, of course due to a lack of exposure I accept that most of you wouldn't have fired the Mas Mlle 1936 but that doesn't matter, it was the best service rifle when introduced.
Think about it, the rifle conformed to a doctrine where chambering a round was only when ordered. The sights are only adjustable for elevation and its only drawback was a 5 shot magazine filled with flimsy chargers. The round was what the US were trying to achieve with the 7.62 x 51 only 20 years earlier and it wasn't actually meant to arm the front line troops, it was an interim issue until the detachable 10 round magazine fed self loader Mlle 1944 was issued.
A robust no nonsense bolt, good sights and a bayonet that you had to hand always.
I'm going to post my top bolt action service rifles in order of importance or seniority. The cut off will be 1950
No1 the Mas Mlle 1936 7.5 x 54
View attachment 332108
No2 The 1947 Madsen M47 - Wikipedia .30-06
View attachment 332109 View attachment 332110
No3 The No4 Mk2 (and any other conversions to this standard) .303 (because its rule .303)
View attachment 332112

No4 Spanish M43 Mauser 8mm Mauser (got to have a Mauser and this was the least fiddly version)

View attachment 332111
There are many others which I wont list but you can choose if you are that way inclined

The reason behind this choice is simplification of a rifle from long development work (apart from the Mas and the Madsen) and the cartridge chosen for them. The 7.5 x 55 Swiss underwent many changes in its lifetime, not sure if the clockwork monsters it fed are worthy of mention though!
Guilty as charged, however, I'm pleased with the debate it spawned :p

That Madsen M47 is a ridiculously good looking rifle.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#3
#4
I call 'foul' and 'fake noos!' :)
  • Mas Mlle 1936
  • MAS Mlle 1936
  • Lee Enfield No4 Mk2
  • Madsen M47
  • M43 Spanish Mauser
  • K31
  • M1944 (Russian)
 
#6
I had thought of putting this in mil history but here seems a good place. There has been a bit of discussion regarding the latest L85A3 and somebody posted that at least it wasn't the MAS 36.
Heretics, of course due to a lack of exposure I accept that most of you wouldn't have fired the Mas Mlle 1936 but that doesn't matter, it was the best service rifle when introduced.
Think about it, the rifle conformed to a doctrine where chambering a round was only when ordered. The sights are only adjustable for elevation and its only drawback was a 5 shot magazine filled with flimsy chargers. The round was what the US were trying to achieve with the 7.62 x 51 only 20 years earlier and it wasn't actually meant to arm the front line troops, it was an interim issue until the detachable 10 round magazine fed self loader Mlle 1944 was issued.
A robust no nonsense bolt, good sights and a bayonet that you had to hand always.
I'm going to post my top bolt action service rifles in order of importance or seniority. The cut off will be 1950
No1 the Mas Mlle 1936 7.5 x 54
View attachment 332108
No2 The 1947 Madsen M47 - Wikipedia .30-06
View attachment 332109 View attachment 332110
No3 The No4 Mk2 (and any other conversions to this standard) .303 (because its rule .303)
View attachment 332112

No4 Spanish M43 Mauser 8mm Mauser (got to have a Mauser and this was the least fiddly version)

View attachment 332111
There are many others which I wont list but you can choose if you are that way inclined

The reason behind this choice is simplification of a rifle from long development work (apart from the Mas and the Madsen) and the cartridge chosen for them. The 7.5 x 55 Swiss underwent many changes in its lifetime, not sure if the clockwork monsters it fed are worthy of mention though!
Strictly speaking is the Swiss K31 a traditional bolt action and did it see combat? with the choices on your list I would have to say the Mosin. It saw more combat and in more places beaten only by the Mauser 98 series

Now Best Bolt action is a different story. What are the parameters?

Accuracy?
Ergonomics?
Battles won using it?
Ease of manufacture?

SMLE and No 4 series would likely be atop or very near than a post war Madsen
 
#7
I call No4 Mk2. I've only had experience of the examples quoted,of the Mauser (only K98 ) and the Enfield.

I prefer the Enfield bolt cycling for more rapid fire and frankly seems 'easier' but that's probably to do with familiarity as I own a SMLE and Envoy. I also prefer to have a detachable magazine, a magazine that holds ten rounds and a safety catch.
 
#8
#9
Goldbricker has already referred to it, why no Mauser K98 on the list? Don’t you rate it?
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#10
Strictly speaking is the Swiss K31 a traditional bolt action and did it see combat? with the choices on your list I would have to say the Mosin. It saw more combat and in more places beaten only by the Mauser 98 series

Now Best Bolt action is a different story. What are the parameters?

Accuracy?
Ergonomics?
Battles won using it?
Ease of manufacture?

SMLE and No 4 series would likely be atop or very near than a post war Madsen
Battles are rarely won by rifles alone
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#11
Goldbricker has already referred to it, why no Mauser K98 on the list? Don’t you rate it?
Indeed the K98k is not really a good rifle, the Spanish M43 is a better rifle and almost the same design but if you can show why its a good rifle then post it. The choices are mine, there by the way is no such thing as a Mosin Nagant. Nagant was involved with the 1890 rifle design, Mosin wasn't! The Russians called it by the year of introduction. The M44 is a reasonably simple version of it.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#12

ugly

LE
Moderator
#13
Strictly speaking is the Swiss K31 a traditional bolt action and did it see combat? with the choices on your list I would have to say the Mosin. It saw more combat and in more places beaten only by the Mauser 98 series
The K31 uses a bolt, its a straight pull but then again many others are. I personally don't rate them, my choices aren't based on the wars they fought in as the Madsen allegedly didn't fight in any, the MAS didn't win any either but both were technological leaps ahead of the opposition. The Spanish Mausers were mainly left overs from German support although they had Mausers in 7x57 which shocked the Americans in Cuba and Puerto Rico.
 
#14
I'm struggling to remove it!
So I see :) There's now 2 x M1944 Russian entries. I thought you were a Mod? ;)
  • Mas Mlle 1936
    Votes: 00.0%
  • MAS Mlle 1936
    Votes: 00.0%
  • Lee Enfield No4 Mk2
    Votes: 583.3%
  • Madsen M47
    Votes: 00.0%
  • M43 Spanish Mauser
    Votes: 00.0%
  • K31
    Votes: 116.7%
  • M1944 (Russian)
    Votes: 00.0%
  • M43 Spanish Mauser
    Votes: 00.0%
  • M1944 (Russian)
    Votes: 00.0%
 
#15
Can I ask a stupid question? Lots of those rifles seem to have been designed quite a while ago. Is the modern rifle design industry as prolific in banging out new designs as they were back then?
 
#17
Indeed the K98k is not really a good rifle, the Spanish M43 is a better rifle and almost the same design but if you can show why its a good rifle then post it. The choices are mine, there by the way is no such thing as a Mosin Nagant. Nagant was involved with the 1890 rifle design, Mosin wasn't! The Russians called it by the year of introduction. The M44 is a reasonably simple version of it.
I wouldn’t have a clue, just knew it was a widely used rifle, think I fired one at Shriv many moons ago, but you can never tell with only a couple of rounds.
 
#18
@ugly -

I did not vote as the choices did not include the M1903 Springfield.
I actually used one when a ROTC member. The next year ROTC switched to M1
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#19
Can I ask a stupid question? Lots of those rifles seem to have been designed quite a while ago. Is the modern rifle design industry as prolific in banging out new designs as they were back then?
That's a difficult question to answer. Look at Sako, sold the Canadians the design for the new rangers rifle but its not a new design, most things have been tried in most combinations, the Madsen was an example of too late, the Czechs had been designing self loaders before and during the war even whilst occupied. We still had massive conscript armies and WW2 had showed us that we needed a lighter cartridge in a self loading/selective fire weapon.
That effectively killed bolt action rifle design for the Military, rehashing service sniping rifles was about all we did. The US went down two roads, civilian bolt action rifles accurised for sniping (USMC) and accurizing the M14 to become the M21. The Soviets developed the Dragunov. The Germans accurised the G3 but we let Olymppic gold medal winning shooters design ours! Thank feck
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#20
@ugly -

I did not vote as the choices did not include the M1903 Springfield.
I actually used one when a ROTC member. The next year ROTC switched to M1
Fiddly sights and a not brilliant copy of a crap Mauser.
 

Similar threads

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top