The Insurgency - Sun 02 Apr 9.00 pm, BBC2

#1
Heard of this from an ex-RA mate who describes it as "one of the more interesting productions I was involved with recently".

Time Out 'Film of the week".

Radio Times 'Documentary of the week'.

I will be watching. Tomorrow night Sunday 02 Apr.

Insurgency

Sun 2 Apr, 9:00 pm - 10:00 pm 60mins

The chilling image of a ten year old boy holding a Kalashnikov on the streets of Baghdad. Orphaned during the invasion of Iraq, he is now a sentry for one of Abu Musab al Zarqawi's al Qaeda cells. The carnage of a bomb in a Baghdad café.

Some of these images we have seen before, but what we have little understanding of is who the insurgents are. On the eve of the elections in December 2005, this documentary peels back the layers and takes an uncompromising look inside the Sunni-led insurgency against the occupation of Iraq and the Shia controlled government. Using personal video footage and still photographs, two journalists provide a portrait of this resistance. Blindfolded and unprotected, they have travelled into areas of Iraq untouched by the coalition forces to try and understand the Iraqis and foreign fighters who make up the insurgency and what led them to take up arms against the US and British troops in Iraq.

Interviews with military commanders on both sides reveal what the day to day fight is about. From insurgent controlled farmlands on the canals of South Baghdad to the US run town of Tal'Afar taken from al Qaeda on the Syrian border, one thing is certain - the fight is different in each corner of the country and nobody can claim to be winning this unconventional war.

But maybe the true story of the insurgency in Iraq comes from the ordinary people affected by this bitter struggle - the heartbreaking testimony from Iraqis who suffered beheadings and executions at the hands of al Qaeda led insurgents in Tal'Afar; or the proud Iraqis who are willing to put their life on the line to attain freedom for their country for the oppressors from the West.

The mystery of the insurgency in Iraq is examined as never before. Contains some upsetting scenes.
source: BBC TWO LISTINGS
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#2
Don't you feel that this is just another Baghdad Broadcasting Corporation attempt to glorify the terrorist. I'll watch it but I have a feeling that they'll be repeating what they did with the IRA.
 
#3
Biscuits_AB said:
Don't you feel that this is just another Baghdad Broadcasting Corporation attempt to glorify the terrorist. I'll watch it but I have a feeling that they'll be repeating what they did with the IRA.
What do you mean? I've never seen the BBC glorifying George Bush
 
#4
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
 
#5
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
... who like to cut people's heads off and broadcast it on the internet.

and for lots of these insurgents, it isn't "their" country.
 
#6
It sounds like the episode of Frontline (like a spam version of Panorama- but usually weightier than latter day BBC offerings) that ran on PBS here a couple of weeks ago. One of the main characters is Time's Baghdad Bureau Chief- can't remember his name- Mark something I think- but he's Australian.

A fair amount of Footage with Col HR McMaster, of 73 Easting Fame in '91 (then a Capt) too. Now has his own Armourd Cav Regt. McMaster makes a good point that one of the biggest mistakes they made was disbanding the Iraqi army because all of a sudden you have hundreds of thousands of unemployed men with nothing other than military skills. If you're penniless, have a family to support, the economy is in sh1t state, your only skill set is as a soldier and someone offers you a few grand to pick up an RPG and take out a Bradley, what would you do?

If it's the same programme, make sure to take a look. It was bloody good. One of the key points the Aussie (who has lots of contacts within the insurgency) made is that the insurgents started off as being old Iraqi Army/ RG, but are now increasingly being financed by Zarqawi and Zawahri etc. and are starting to pay more attention to the religious crap, rather than it being a nationalist thing. He's not sure if it's lip service though, or if it's something altogether more serious.
 
#8
tricam said:
Think this is the documentary Crabtastic is talking about...
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/insurgency/
The website has lots of extra interviews with the participants.

It could well be the BBC one too since it won't allow "UK/Ireland residents to watch it online due to contractual arrangements with the BBC". Perhaps it'll be viewable to UK/Ireland residents after it is broadcast on BBC 2.

Tricam.
That's the one.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#9
frenchperson said:
Biscuits_AB said:
Don't you feel that this is just another Baghdad Broadcasting Corporation attempt to glorify the terrorist. I'll watch it but I have a feeling that they'll be repeating what they did with the IRA.
What do you mean? I've never seen the BBC glorifying George Bush
No you haven't have you and that's bacause Mr Bush stands for eveything that is right in this world.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#10
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
Evil blood thirsty fanatics? What, like those blokes who flew two airliners into the Twin Towers or like that little fella who likes to chop people heads off on TV?

I doubt that they have a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics. Could you give an example please or were you just trying to sound clever?
 
#11
Biscuits_AB said:
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
Evil blood thirsty fanatics? What, like those blokes who flew two airliners into the Twin Towers or like that little fella who likes to chop people heads off on TV?

I doubt that they have a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics. Could you give an example please or were you just trying to sound clever?
Like the Americans were their clear understanding of Iraqi politics? Telling the Shiites that their choice of PM is unacceptable to America is really going to win friends in high places :roll: . The insurgents do not need to be clever, they just have to hope that the occupying powers are stupid, something that in Iraq they have been really luck with. The insurgents have added to American and Iraqi problems, they have successfully created a climate of instability; they have helped to make sure that any civilian government lacks the credibility to operate amongst wide sections of the populace. The creation of a strong, functioning Iraqi government at the moment is a pipe dream thanks in part of the insurgents but more largely due to the incompetence of the Americans.
 
#12
tricam said:
Think this is the documentary Crabtastic is talking about...
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/insurgency/
The website has lots of extra interviews with the participants.

It could well be the BBC one too since it won't allow "UK/Ireland residents to watch it online due to contractual arrangements with the BBC". Perhaps it'll be viewable to UK/Ireland residents after it is broadcast on BBC 2.

Tricam.
The names of the producer, cameraman etc correspond. So it seems that tonight's documentary on BBC2 at 2100 is the same one as seen by Crabtastic and featured on that website. Sounds as if it is going to be worth watching.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#13
castlereagh said:
Biscuits_AB said:
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
Evil blood thirsty fanatics? What, like those blokes who flew two airliners into the Twin Towers or like that little fella who likes to chop people heads off on TV?

I doubt that they have a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics. Could you give an example please or were you just trying to sound clever?
Like the Americans were their clear understanding of Iraqi politics? Telling the Shiites that their choice of PM is unacceptable to America is really going to win friends in high places :roll: . The insurgents do not need to be clever, they just have to hope that the occupying powers are stupid, something that in Iraq they have been really luck with. The insurgents have added to American and Iraqi problems, they have successfully created a climate of instability; they have helped to make sure that any civilian government lacks the credibility to operate amongst wide sections of the populace. The creation of a strong, functioning Iraqi government at the moment is a pipe dream thanks in part of the insurgents but more largely due to the incompetence of the Americans.
I asked for examples of the 'sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics' of this 'savvy group of individuals'. Can you provide one or is spouting off 'everything I've read about Iraq this week' your problem as well?
 

cpunk

LE
Moderator
#14
Insurgency

... the heartbreaking testimony from Iraqis who suffered beheadings and executions at the hands of al Qaeda led insurgents in Tal'Afar; or the proud Iraqis who are willing to put their life on the line to attain freedom for their country for the oppressors from the West.
I'm really looking forward to hearing from a few Iraqis who've been beheaded and/or executed: that has to be a TV first; well done the BBC! :D
 
#16
Biscuits_AB said:
castlereagh said:
Biscuits_AB said:
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
Evil blood thirsty fanatics? What, like those blokes who flew two airliners into the Twin Towers or like that little fella who likes to chop people heads off on TV?

I doubt that they have a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics. Could you give an example please or were you just trying to sound clever?
Like the Americans were their clear understanding of Iraqi politics? Telling the Shiites that their choice of PM is unacceptable to America is really going to win friends in high places :roll: . The insurgents do not need to be clever, they just have to hope that the occupying powers are stupid, something that in Iraq they have been really luck with. The insurgents have added to American and Iraqi problems, they have successfully created a climate of instability; they have helped to make sure that any civilian government lacks the credibility to operate amongst wide sections of the populace. The creation of a strong, functioning Iraqi government at the moment is a pipe dream thanks in part of the insurgents but more largely due to the incompetence of the Americans.
I asked for examples of the 'sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics' of this 'savvy group of individuals'. Can you provide one or is spouting off 'everything I've read about Iraq this wek' your problem as well?
Izzat Ibrahim al-Douri - leader of the Ba'athist insurgency, traditional nationalist insurgency tactics now using Islamic facade to attract more support.
Abu Musab al-Zarqawi - using radical Sunni Islamic rhetoric to try and push Iraq into religious-ethnic civil war based on Sunni and Shiite lines.
Moqtadar Al Sadr - Shiite resistance used violence against the coalition to create a political mandate.
That good enough for you, just because they may be non-Europeans doesn't mean that they are stupid!
 

cpunk

LE
Moderator
#17
Biscuits_AB said:
It's amazing what you can do with 'Photo Shop'
Do you suppose they're doing it like 'Walking with Dinosaurs' but with CGI corpses claiming that they would have been much better off if the Americans hadn't come to town?
 

cpunk

LE
Moderator
#19
castlereagh said:
Izzat Ibrahim al-Douri - leader of the Ba'athist insurgency, traditional nationalist insurgency tactics now using Islamic facade to attract more support.
Abu Musab al-Zarqawi - using radical Sunni Islamic rhetoric to try and push Iraq into religious-ethnic civil war based on Sunni and Shiite lines.
Moqtadar Al Sadr - Shiite resistance used violence against the coalition to create a political mandate.
That good enough for you, just because they may be non-Europeans doesn't mean that they are stupid!
Hmmm, well I'll bet you a tenner they'll all be dead in two years. High stakes risk-taking doesn't equal sophistication.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#20
castlereagh said:
Biscuits_AB said:
castlereagh said:
Biscuits_AB said:
Taz_786 said:
Biscuits AB and his ilk are probably worried that far from being evil bloodthirsty fanatics, the insurgents might turn out to be a rather savvy bunch of individuals with a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics and society who simply want Whitey out of their country.
Evil blood thirsty fanatics? What, like those blokes who flew two airliners into the Twin Towers or like that little fella who likes to chop people heads off on TV?

I doubt that they have a sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics. Could you give an example please or were you just trying to sound clever?
Like the Americans were their clear understanding of Iraqi politics? Telling the Shiites that their choice of PM is unacceptable to America is really going to win friends in high places :roll: . The insurgents do not need to be clever, they just have to hope that the occupying powers are stupid, something that in Iraq they have been really luck with. The insurgents have added to American and Iraqi problems, they have successfully created a climate of instability; they have helped to make sure that any civilian government lacks the credibility to operate amongst wide sections of the populace. The creation of a strong, functioning Iraqi government at the moment is a pipe dream thanks in part of the insurgents but more largely due to the incompetence of the Americans.
I asked for examples of the 'sophisticated understanding of Iraqi politics' of this 'savvy group of individuals'. Can you provide one or is spouting off 'everything I've read about Iraq this wek' your problem as well?
Izzat Ibrahim al-Douri - leader of the Ba'athist insurgency, traditional nationalist insurgency tactics now using Islamic facade to attract more support.
Abu Musab al-Zarqawi - using radical Sunni Islamic rhetoric to try and push Iraq into religious-ethnic civil war based on Sunni and Shiite lines.
Moqtadar Al Sadr - Shiite resistance used violence against the coalition to create a political mandate.
That good enough for you, just because they may be non-Europeans doesn't mean that they are stupid!

Nobody said that they were stupid just as nobody said anything about the American understanding of the situation (your previous post). Where do you get it from?

You and French Person need to get together mate. It must be lonley there getting all angry on your own.
 

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