The IMF, Greece and the End of Euro-Chauvinism

Discussion in 'Economics' started by jumpinjarhead, Apr 2, 2010.

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  1. Interesting set of articles in the Globalist this week on the ramifications of the Greek economic meltdown on and for Europe:

     
  2. seaweed

    seaweed LE Book Reviewer

    Decent of the US taxpayer to cough up so that the Greeks can continue to slop around in the sort of self-indulgent Socialism the US would never tolerate at home! Why the Greeks should be saved from their own gibbering misgovernment is beyond me.
     
  3. Biped

    Biped LE Book Reviewer

    My bold

    or the EU for that matter.
     
  4. The US is not far behind.....

    According to the BBC, the gross national debt of Greece is now about 125 percent of its gross domestic product. This number may seem preposterous, but this figure was at 86 percent for the United States in 2009, according to the Congressional Budget Office!!!

    And this from the New American several weeks ago Linky

     
  5. Those in Europe knew Greece 'cooked'the books in order to ascend into the Eurozone.Therefore this crisis was inevitable.

    I guess the Greeks and others thought the Germans would come to the rescue.Unfortunatly for them Germany did not play ball.
     
  6. Yes, Greece is high with debt at 125% of GDP but Italy runs a significant second with 103%. Of course, the basket case of Zimbabwe at over 240% is ridiculous but Japan has 170% of debt to GDP.
    UK is around the 50% mark which is much lower than the great depression of the 20s and 30s where it was over 150% and after WW2 where it went to over 200%.
    http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html
     
  7. I do not think it is just limited to the Greeks however. There is a lot of chatter about Spain, then Italy etc. I suppose it is the new version of the "domino theory" and it should not go unnoticed that the common thread of these economic cataclysms is a socialist (generic meaning) construct whereby the people have been taught to rely more and more on their respective governments for "entitlements" in a surreal context that there is a bottomless bucket of money miraculously available to pay for it all.

    This (IMHO) irrationality is increasingly taking over in the US such that there will no longer be anyone left to bail the others out. The incredible growth of the so-called "unfunded mandates" of the burgeoning benefit programs in the US simply cannot be paid even if the government were to confiscate all wealth. One would think our brilliant leaders would simply "do the math." Even the (supposedly) non-political Congressional Budget Office now estimates our deficit to metastasize to $12.7 trillion by 2020.

    As one of your lot, Lord Thomas MacCauley wrote on May 23, 1857, in a letter to an American friend:

    A democracy cannot survive as a permanent form of government. It can last only until its citizens discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority (who vote) will vote for those candidates promising the greatest benefits from the public purse, with the result that a democracy will always collapse from loose fiscal policies, always followed by a dictatorship.
     

  8. This, for me, is the key issue with the EU as it is currently structured. Integrity (at all levels) is sacrificed for political expediency and 'done deals'.

    Until that is sorted the whole thing is just plain crooked.

    The economic debacle that is Greece is just the latest example.
     
  9. My gut tells me you are correct and thus we are, to use the vernacular, screwed.
     
  10. seaweed

    seaweed LE Book Reviewer

    Lord M's point was put succinctly by a voter approached by Admiral Cochrane when he was standing for Parliament in 1806: "I votes for Mister Most."
     
  11. Indeed!
     
  12. Hello,

    never mind the economics,what about the writing!
    Whoever edited that piece should be sacked.
    I am guessing Stephan Richter and Alfred Steinherr got paid by the column inch.
    They appeared to reuse at least seven sentences.


    tangosix.
     
  13. Decent of the US taxpayer to cough up so that the Greeks can continue to slop around in the sort of self-indulgent Socialism the US would never tolerate at home! Why the Greeks should be saved from their own gibbering selfishness is beyond me.
     
  14. Give us time WC, give us time...... :(
     
  15. Britain's already lost. It's only time before the pseudo-socialist virus reaches across the pond. :(

    Your mid-nineteenth century quote is almost precisely what stimulates the British voter in deciding which box to scribble his/her X.

    Still, I can't complain. I live in a country where I have no vote and thus claim no reponsibility for the pseudo-socialist shower now ruling the heap.