The Future of Alpine Skiing in the Army?

Discussion in 'Sports, Adventure Training and Events' started by RangiRam, Feb 9, 2004.

?
  1. You bet. It takes nerves of steel to ski the wall.

    25.0%
  2. Why not? Every other bugger gets a piece of the action.

    14.1%
  3. Skiing is a physically demanding, adventurous training activity that deserves its share of funding.

    37.5%
  4. Bollocks. It is an elitist sport catering only for officers and the spoilt brats of the Army.

    10.9%
  5. Remove all Public money and let's all join the Cav in Verbier. Hector will pay.

    12.5%

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  1. Has it got one? It seems that in the rounds of offering up the usual 'they wouldn't dare take this' savings measures, a jobsworth in a suit has taken up the offer of saving squillions of pounds of the public purse by removing all public funding of Alpine skiing from Apr 04. Some of you will recall that it has, for some time, not been in the BWT/Adventurous Training category. It is, currently, therefore exceedingly unlikely that any significant money will find its way back in the sport for next Winter, albeit that Jacko, COMARRC and some other top brass spent a few days surveying the scene at Serre Chevalier recently and announced what a fine, challenging, knicker wetting pursuit it was. CGS then made a hasty retreat back to work...via St Moritz for the Combined Services Bobsleigh Competition...

    Should any of us care? Should these chinless twits with wallets more capacious than an elephants scrotum be subsidised by the tax payer? Or do you really need stunning courage or simply no brain to throw yourself down a mountain at 125 kph?

    Notwithstanding all this, congrats to 28 Engr Regt on winning the Princess Marina Cup (overall Army Champions) ahead of 1 GS Regt RLC and the Hldrs...enjoy your 9 months off until the next punishing winter ordeal.
     
  2. I think its all going downhill mate ..i really do :(
     
  3. I'm not going to bang on about the requisite size of one's balls for a downhill event but I would say it is less and less the case that Alpine skiing is solely the persuit of ruperts.

    I don't think alpine skiing should have funding withdrawn when there are equivilent sports that continue to be funded by the government. It is an expensive sport but to cut funding entirely seems rash. Idealistically speaking, it's competitions like Spartan Hike and The Army Championships along with those in other sports are in part responsible for making the army what it is.

    Even if you don't agree with that, it's sure to compound the firm's present retention and recruitment problems.
     
  4. Bin the Alpine, keep Nordic. There are actually two totally different competitions, although everyone pretends they're the same. Alpine - officers/Nordic - toms. Alpine - 2 mins of fun/Nordic - 2 hours of brutal thrashing.
     
  5. With the exception of the fact that there are two competitions (and ne'er the twain shall meet- Alpinistes look down on/through the "sweaties" as they describe Nordic skiers) this is rubbish!

    Anyone present at Spartan Hike 2004 will have seen a pretty good spread of ranks across the Nordic and Alpine disciplines, including those winning prizes.

    Many of those who had been hurtling down the slopes on the Alpine had strapped on skis for the first time six weeks before. I'd like to get those who say Alpine doesn't deserve the cash to stand at the top of a downhill run and tell me it's a swan.

    It seems that Nordic will survive but in what format we can only guess: at the current rate of spending cuts Spartan Hike 2005 will probably be on roller skis round the range road at Sennelager...
     
  6. Not only are they pulling the public funding for exercises such as S.HIKE but they are removing funding via stealthy option too - have they been taking lessons from Gordon Brown????? I say this because LOA and LSSA for these collective military trg exercises has now been revoked - i can already hear the cries of 'quite right too' but this is exactly how most of the toms afford to go. These allowances merely reimburse some of the hefty personal contributions required to compete in this sport.

    Additionally, it is often the highest calibre soldiers who benfit from thsi sport as they seem to be the only ones willing to get off their arses and sign up. 'nuff said :twisted:
     
  7. I am a JSSI (A) but more imprtantly a BASI (A) instructor and for the purists, ski tour trained. Before we review the should factor we should look at he aims of AT and do we achieve them and with the current operational commitments are the aims outdated.

    We can argue (PT Corps) keeps a few bods in a job.) but, at some point we must train our own instructors. Why not outsource completely? I believe outsourcing is a finacially viable soloution, however we in the "miiltary" want to push our soldiers to the limit and civilian organisations will not achieve this. Yes we need AT we need it more now than in the past where soldiers were more robust. The current soldier needs it to instill the ethos of teamwork and leadership. Has AT a role in the future? Yes, but for different reasonsso all of you PT Corps cruisers get your finger out before you lose your jobs and evaluate what we need. By the way the rest of the JS use SAT (Systems Approach to Training). Wy are you here ? Level 4 Trg civis ca o it cheaper
     
  8. If AT is to develop teamwork and motivation through arduous phsical activity then Alpine skiing is a great way to do it. Combined with ski touring you get the best of both worlds. The touring is extremely arduous but also reinforces navigation in difficult surroundings and also avalanche awareness, cold weather survival etc. Once you have toured to the top of a peak you need to be a bloody competent downhiller to get down in one piece. Especially if your legs are knackered and you have a rather heavy pack on your back!

    Even if purely skiing downhill, it's easy to bimble about and meander your way down a blue run. But ask any keen skier just how physically demanding it is to ski hard down a good long red or black and they will tell you how exhausting it can be. I've been skiing for nigh on 28 years (mostly funded by myself) and come the evening, I am ready for my bed by 9 o'clock (big jessy!!). More yongsters should be encouraged to participate so that they can find out just what an amazing activity skiing is. Unfortunately, many of the youngsters cannot afford to pay the full amount and so it must be subsidised.
     
  9. I have competed in Services skiing for a while now and it needs every penny it can get. Anyone saying that Alpine is two minutes of fun has never stood in the start gate of a world cup downhill run after a ski career consisting of five weeks of training.

    It is a good job the race suits are tight!! Current race camps are 7 hrs training per day, 6 days per week at altitude - that is not a jolly. If you want an example of courage, commitment, determination and effort just stand next to the start gate on any Alpine race. The toms who had the energy to sign up and train stand there sometimes ready to go in the knowledge that the guy in front of them is being scraped up into a helicopter yet still they go.

    In alpine you conquer your fear, on nordic you conquer your fatigue. (Although having said that I could hardly walk after a Super Giant Slalom).

    F*** all skiing in Iraq mind you !!!!!!
     
  10. If they cut funding to Alpine skiing may be they should cut funding to Netheravon (Tri service Parachute school).

    If you look at the "whos been who boards" in the main packing hall at Nethers, youll find Jackos name up there as president of the Army parachute something or other. Maybe there lies the answer.
     
  11. competed in spartan hike 2002, and to those saying that:

    A) it's an officers sport I'm a JR, as were all but one of the team

    B) it's two minutes of fun some runs, yes, the majority of competition runs, 2 mins of thigh shattering, pants filling terror insterspersed with amounts of huge pain as you miss a turn and go bouncing off over frozen snow taking out a few passers-by at the same time

    C) it's overly subsidized already for the pre-spartan hike corps ski camp (5 weeks in austria) personal contributions amounted to 100quid a week. as a just-out-of-training billy on 33quid a day this is a large amount, not leaving alot over for adventure pish-ups

    doing that is one of the main reasons I've enjoyed my time in the army. however I have witnessed alot of apathy amongst the ranks. for example, when asking for volunteers for aforementioned skiing trip most of the lads were dismissive of it, either cause they 'couldn't be arsed paying the money' or simply 'don't want to be away from family for so long'.
     
  12. Damn right that skiing, and all the other AT activities, should carry on subsidised. All work and no play makes Jack a pamphlet-head bore.
     
  13. When on Frosted Blade recently and had a great time. Also worked quite hard and pushed the good old fear envelope. One of the few bits of Army sports/ AT I've been lucky enough to get. I had to pay a considerable sum to go and agree it should be partially funded by the system. The team I went with was 75% ORs (as it should be) and to offer that opportunity to an 18 year old Tom is what we should be doing. After all, they spend so much time being shot at by Iraqis, if we don't give them something in return then who can we justify our outrageous claims to support sports.

    I'm sure that we could also be done for false advertising when we lie to the sods at the recruiting office.
     
  14. Total wa*k if you ask me. I've seen troops who only learned to snow-plough three days before (a certifiably insane RWF lad in this case) stand in an starting gate in Lillehamer and then throw themsleves off down the Olympic run, simply because it was hard, dangerous and he fancied having a go because he was in the Army. AT opportunities like that reinforce the mentality we engender in people with the training and allow us to achieve some of the almost impossible tasks we somtimes get given on ops, exercises or whatever. Besides, this lad deserved a gong for doing it on a pair of planks that were older than me and not breaking a leg in the process (we did find him in a snow drift about 300m further down, however). :lol:
     
  15. Given that you are all old handers at this, can anyone point me in the direction where the best places are for total beginners? Looking at the moment at Iceland, France, Spain and Italy but Iceland really appeals. December is our slot courtesy of the Blair/Bush "initiative".

    Many thanks in advance.