The downfall of Joe Biden and US-UK politics disintegrating...

It certainly hasn't been looking good in Afghanistan over the last few days regarding Joe Bidens hurried withdrawal, especially now that enticing requests from the Taliban has led to them now being in a position to make demands the US and UK may not find acceptable with the mounting pressure to evacuate more and more eligible personnel and the the news this morning the Tailiban are not willing to grant an extension

There was news of a gunfight involving German, US and Afghan Security Forces.

Joe Biden is sticking to his guns about his decision to withdraw in a hurry the right and I don't see him willing to entice any requests Bojo makes.

His ratings at home and the international community may well have taken a hit seeing the unorganised pandemonium going on at Hamid Karzai airport.

Maybe we finally have a guy who is more about "putting America first" than Trump?

It looks like those legendery ties we have are taking a heavy blow under Biden...
 
The reasoning for bringing the troops home is driven, as always, by domestic politics and the next election. This is a key weakness of the Western Democratic System, it is hard to take a long-term strategy.
It will be interesting to see how he is polling in the USA at the moment.

The G7 are meeting soon (today?) over Zoom or whatever, I suspect that there will be some expletives being used and I would love to be a fly on the wall.

Creepy Joe can take the fall, retire, and pass the ball to his 2i/c, leaving her 'clean' and blameless of the disaster for the next election.
Meanwhile tens of thousands of people are at risk of death from this decision, and millions are being cast back to the 14th century having been teased with a glimpse of the 20th cenury.

In better news, the spirit of Ahmed Shah Masood is alive and well in the Panjshir! I remember watching Sandy Gall reporting from there in the 80's, it part inspired me to join the TAs and I never thought that I would end up over there 20 years later!

I'm still livid over what has happened and I hope Joe Bidet gets a kicking over it.
Thankfully, one of my terps has landed in the UK and is safe.
 

Truxx

LE
It certainly hasn't been looking good in Afghanistan over the last few days regarding Joe Bidens hurried withdrawal, especially now that enticing requests from the Taliban has led to them now being in a position to make demands the US and UK may not find acceptable with the mounting pressure to evacuate more and more eligible personnel and the the news this morning the Tailiban are not willing to grant an extension

There was news of a gunfight involving German, US and Afghan Security Forces.

Joe Biden is sticking to his guns about his decision to withdraw in a hurry the right and I don't see him willing to entice any requests Bojo makes.

His ratings at home and the international community may well have taken a hit seeing the unorganised pandemonium going on at Hamid Karzai airport.

Maybe we finally have a guy who is more about "putting America first" than Trump?

It looks like those legendery ties we have are taking a heavy blow under Biden...
If anyone seriously thinks that the links and relationships the UK has with the US are "legendary" they need their head examined.
 
The reasoning for bringing the troops home is driven, as always, by domestic politics and the next election. This is a key weakness of the Western Democratic System, it is hard to take a long-term strategy.
It will be interesting to see how he is polling in the USA at the moment.

The G7 are meeting soon (today?) over Zoom or whatever, I suspect that there will be some expletives being used and I would love to be a fly on the wall.

Creepy Joe can take the fall, retire, and pass the ball to his 2i/c, leaving her 'clean' and blameless of the disaster for the next election.
Meanwhile tens of thousands of people are at risk of death from this decision, and millions are being cast back to the 14th century having been teased with a glimpse of the 20th cenury.

In better news, the spirit of Ahmed Shah Masood is alive and well in the Panjshir! I remember watching Sandy Gall reporting from there in the 80's, it part inspired me to join the TAs and I never thought that I would end up over there 20 years later!

I'm still livid over what has happened and I hope Joe Bidet gets a kicking over it.
Thankfully, one of my terps has landed in the UK and is safe.
Its not a weakness, but our strength. If our leaders had followed the popular will of the people, we would have left Afghanistan in say 2010-2014 in a far better state.. The key weakness was the mission itself was a luxuriant colonial adventure and anyone on the outside was discouraged to wind in necks and toe the party line.
 
If anyone seriously thinks that the links and relationships the UK has with the US are "legendary" they need their head examined.
Churchill came up with the phrase “special relationship” in 1946. It was quite appropriate at that time.
 

Yokel

LE
Churchill came up with the phrase “special relationship” in 1946. It was quite appropriate at that time.

It is still appropriate.

The United States adapted our common law system, is one of the few countries with whom we have a trade surplus, and are our neighbours across the Atlantic. The intelligence and defence ties, including industrial and technological, are very real.

The participation of the UK in the F-35B project, and the key technology for the V/STOL variant being British designed and built demonstrates this. UK/US advanced V/STOL research was coordinated since the early eighties. The embarkation of USMC jets for the CSG21 deployment demonstrates this.

I think that the UK has some sort of designation as a trusted source for components for US DOD projects.
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted 139028

Guest
I have no problem with Biden pulling his troops and diplomats etc out of Afghanistan, where I do have a problem is his complete and utter failure to plan for it in advance and include the other participants in said planning.

Trump was intent on pulling the USA out but I very much doubt he wouldn't have had planned it much better by his Top staff and military.
 
The reasoning for bringing the troops home is driven, as always, by domestic politics and the next election. This is a key weakness of the Western Democratic System, it is hard to take a long-term strategy.
It will be interesting to see how he is polling in the USA at the moment.

The G7 are meeting soon (today?) over Zoom or whatever, I suspect that there will be some expletives being used and I would love to be a fly on the wall.

Creepy Joe can take the fall, retire, and pass the ball to his 2i/c, leaving her 'clean' and blameless of the disaster for the next election.
Meanwhile tens of thousands of people are at risk of death from this decision, and millions are being cast back to the 14th century having been teased with a glimpse of the 20th cenury.

In better news, the spirit of Ahmed Shah Masood is alive and well in the Panjshir! I remember watching Sandy Gall reporting from there in the 80's, it part inspired me to join the TAs and I never thought that I would end up over there 20 years later!

I'm still livid over what has happened and I hope Joe Bidet gets a kicking over it.
Thankfully, one of my terps has landed in the UK and is safe.
As has been pointed out elsewhere,The Korean War ceasefire was in 1953...the US are still there as 'Peacekeepers' ?
 
The reasoning for bringing the troops home is driven, as always, by domestic politics and the next election. This is a key weakness of the Western Democratic System, it is hard to take a long-term strategy.
It will be interesting to see how he is polling in the USA at the moment.

The G7 are meeting soon (today?) over Zoom or whatever, I suspect that there will be some expletives being used and I would love to be a fly on the wall.

Creepy Joe can take the fall, retire, and pass the ball to his 2i/c, leaving her 'clean' and blameless of the disaster for the next election.
Meanwhile tens of thousands of people are at risk of death from this decision, and millions are being cast back to the 14th century having been teased with a glimpse of the 20th cenury.

In better news, the spirit of Ahmed Shah Masood is alive and well in the Panjshir! I remember watching Sandy Gall reporting from there in the 80's, it part inspired me to join the TAs and I never thought that I would end up over there 20 years later!

I'm still livid over what has happened and I hope Joe Bidet gets a kicking over it.
Thankfully, one of my terps has landed in the UK and is safe.
Wasn't Sandy Gall's book about the Panshir slated because he'd never set foot in the place?
 
Trump was intent on pulling the USA out but I very much doubt he wouldn't have had planned it much better by his Top staff and military

Trump had delegated planning of the evacuation withdrawal to the Contingency and Crisis Response Bureau, a subdepartment within the State Department. Sometime between February and June this year (reports vary) Biden de-funded and abolished this department. Whatever plans they made were probably shredded, or perhaps are still in a filing cabinet somewhere but noone knows where.
 
Trump had delegated planning of the evacuation withdrawal to the Contingency and Crisis Response Bureau, a subdepartment within the State Department. Sometime between February and June this year (reports vary) Biden de-funded and abolished this department. Whatever plans they made were probably shredded, or perhaps are still in a filing cabinet somewhere but noone knows where.
Too bad it's
1629731163241.png


A State Department spokesperson said it "is important to note that not only would the proposed Contingency and Crisis Response Bureau not have introduced any new capabilities to the Department, it was never formally established,"

Fox News pushes false story that Biden “dismantled” an agency to evacuate Americans​

Right-wing media are also attempting to credit Trump — as well as current Fox News contributor Mike Pompeo — for a State Department program first established under Obama

WRITTEN BY ERIC KLEEFELD

Right-wing media, are pushing a story that the Biden administration shut down a Trump-era program to protect Americans such as those now trapped overseas in Afghanistan. But the network doesn’t seem to have checked whether this program actually existed in any real form. And moreover, the State Department’s capabilities to coordinate evacuations already existed — including a program that was initially set up under President Barack Obama, but which right-wing media are now attempting to attribute solely to President Donald Trump.

Fox ran an article online Wednesday night, with the seemingly damning headline “Biden admin moved to dismantle protections for citizens trapped overseas months before Kabul’s fall: memo.” The article referred to a State Department memo in June for the “discontinuation of the establishment, and the termination of, the Contingency and Crisis Response Bureau (CCR).” The article said that this bureau was “formed under Trump-era Secretary of State Mike Pompeo” — who is also a Fox News contributor and a possible presidential candidate.

Of course, the fact that the memo discontinued the “establishment” of an agency ought to have called into question whether the agency had actually been “formed” yet.

The article was updated a few hours later, inserting at the sixth paragraph a comment from a State Department spokesperson, explaining that the State Department already had all the capabilities that this agency supposedly would have provided.
A State Department spokesperson told Fox News in a Wednesday email that it “is important to note that not only would the proposed Contingency and Crisis Response Bureau not have introduced any new capabilities to the Department, it was never formally established.”
“Some administrative steps were taken before its establishment was paused, but the day-to-day operations of the team have not changed,” the spokesperson said.
“Every requirement the Department delivered on last year, and since the proposed establishment of the bureau, can be delivered on today in the same manner if appropriate to do so,” they continued.
One of the earliest mentions of this supposed agency having been abolished came during an appearance on Fox Business Cavuto: Coast to Coast, during an interview with Robert Charles, a former State Department official during the George W. Bush administration.
 
Wasn't Sandy Gall's book about the Panshir slated because he'd never set foot in the place?
I don't know, but he made a documentary where he met with Masood (couldn't find it on youtube but there is another- 'Afghanistan, war without end' which is very good)
 
As has been pointed out elsewhere,The Korean War ceasefire was in 1953...the US are still there as 'Peacekeepers' ?
A very valid point, but is there any pressure to bring troops home from there? There are few who remember troops coming back from Korea in body bags, plenty who remember such events for Afg.
 
A very valid point, but is there any pressure to bring troops home from there? There are few who remember troops coming back from Korea in body bags, plenty who remember such events for Afg.
Sadly, that's what happens when history moves on.

Whether it's apathy,indolence and/or politics,certain parts of contemporary history are forgotten !

The other interesting point is...in the last 12 months,no American serviceman has been killed by 'enemy action', in Afghanistan !
 
‘**** that, we don’t have to worry about that. We did it in Vietnam, Nixon and Kissinger got away with it.’
IF
the polls are accurate then, although his ratings are underwater he's still got 40% or more. Amazingly to me as it he seems to demonstrate difficulty with learning from history, hell difficulty with learning from personal experience, he was in the corridors of power since Saigon, hell, he was VP during the withdrawal from Iraq.

 
Top