The Cavalry Memorial ~ Hyde Park Corner

#1
Some interesting (to me anyway) bumf on The Cavalry Memorial.


File WO 32/5896 held at The National Archives has some interesting background information on the Cavalry Memorial at Hyde Park Corner which was one of Adrian Jones’s best works.
The Cavalry Memorial , which originally stood at Stanhope Gate, was unveiled on the 21st May 1924, by Field Marshal Lord Ypres. A photograph in file WO 32/5896and taken from the “Times” of 22nd May 1924, shows Adrian Jones standing next to Lord Ypres as the statue is unveiled.
The file includes details of the regiments who were represented at the unveiling ceremony and has a detailed description of the Memorial itself.
Interesting to note that the bronze statue was cast from guns taken by the Cavalry in the Great War and that advice was taken from Major Victor Farquharson, an armour expert and Sir.H.Farnham Burke, Garter King-at–Arms on the detail of the work. We learn that much of the armour was copied from the famous bronze effigy of the Earl of Warwick, dated 1454 and that the design for the horse and its furniture was adopted from the picture of St.George painted by Albert Durer.
We are also informed that four Cavalry Officers were promoted to the rank of Field-Marshal during the war, and this led to four “batons” being placed between the columns of the names of the Regiments which formed the Empire’s Cavalry which stand at the rear of the Memorial.
WORK 20/251 covers the arrangements to add an inscription to cover World War II (1939-1945).
Jones specialised in equestrian figures. He was born in Ludlow, Shropshire, studied at the Royal Veterinary College, qualifying in 1866 as a veterinary surgeon, and enrolling in the Army as a veterinary officer in the Royal Horse Artillery the following year.
Jones served from 1867 to 1890 and saw service during the Abyssinian Expedition of 1868 before joining the 3rd Hussars in 1869. From 1871 to 1881 he served with the Queen’s Bays in Ireland and was then attached to the 7th Hussars and fought with them in the Anglo-Transvaal war in 1881. In South Africa he was attached to the Inniskilling Dragoons. In 1884 Jones served in Egypt where he selected camels for the Nile Expedition of 1884 and finally joined the 2nd Life Guards and retired in 1890 with the rank of captain.
It was only in 1890, having achieved the rank of captain, that he retired, and in 1891 set himself up in Chelsea, London, as an artist. He had no formal art training, but prospered with commissions for horse portraits. Jones had a profound knowledge of equine anatomy. His most important work is the 40-ton “Peace in her Quadriga” (i.e. four-horsed chariot), dating from 1912 and on top of the Arch at Hyde Park Corner, his Cavalry Memorial has long been regarded as one of the best pieces of sculpture to be seen in London.
The inscription reads:

[align=center]ERECTED
by the
CAVALRY of the EMPIRE
in memory of
COMRADES
who gave their lives
in the war
1914 1919
also
in the war
1939 1945
AND ON ACTIVE SERVICE THEREAFTER[/align]


My question is:

Why are the WWI dates 1914-1919 and not 1914-1918?
 
#3
11th November 1918 was a cessation of hostilities, the paperwork was settled in 1919 at the Paris Peace Conference.
 
#4
THere was still fighting in Murmansk northern Russia against the Bolshies in 1919
 
#6
tropper66 said:
THere was still fighting in Murmansk northern Russia against the Bolshies in 1919
Involving the Cavalry of the Empire?

Where any Cavalry soldiers actually killed in 1919 or could it refer to those who died from wounds received in 1918?
 
#7
tropper66 said:
THere was still fighting in Murmansk northern Russia against the Bolshies in 1919
In the Brigade Brigends book. The final chapter mentions the RTC going off with the Iron monsters to give the Ruskies a battering
 
#8
easesprings said:
tropper66 said:
THere was still fighting in Murmansk northern Russia against the Bolshies in 1919
In the Brigade Brigends book. The final chapter mentions the RTC going off with the Iron monsters to give the Ruskies a battering
I know Iv'e read it ,In fact my father was there, in the Army Service Corps
 
#9
The 1914 to 1919 dates are the official dates of the War and have nothing to do with the deaths of Cavalry soldiers or operations against the Reds in Russia.
 
#10
western said:
The 1914 to 1919 dates are the official dates of the War and have nothing to do with the deaths of Cavalry soldiers or operations against the Reds in Russia.
yes, the treaty was not signed until 1919 but British troops where still in action after the signing
 
#11
But not as part of WW1 against the Germans and Austro Hungarian Empire.
 
#12
Although copepod and Tropper are quite correct about deaths from wounds in 1919 and fighting in Russia, the reason for 1919 is as Western says - although fighting stopped on 11 November 18, Britain remained at war until 1919 when the Germans signed the peace treaty.

From a British point of view, the war lasted from the official declaration until the signature of the official peace settlement, and a large number of memorials carry what might be called the 'official' dating of the conflict.

However, since the fighting stopped in 1918, it became increasingly common to refer to the war of 1914-18 rather than being punctillious about observing the dates recognised by officialdom.
 
#13
Archimedes said:
Although copepod and Tropper are quite correct about deaths from wounds in 1919 and fighting in Russia, the reason for 1919 is as Western says - although fighting stopped on 11 November 18, Britain remained at war until 1919 when the Germans signed the peace treaty.

From a British point of view, the war lasted from the official declaration until the signature of the official peace settlement, and a large number of memorials carry what might be called the 'official' dating of the conflict.

However, since the fighting stopped in 1918, it became increasingly common to refer to the war of 1914-18 rather than being punctillious about observing the dates recognised by officialdom.
The last Germans to stop fighting where in East Africa who surrenderd on the 13th of November
 
#14
Archimedes said:
Although copepod and Tropper are quite correct about deaths from wounds in 1919 and fighting in Russia, the reason for 1919 is as Western says - although fighting stopped on 11 November 18, Britain remained at war until 1919 when the Germans signed the peace treaty.

From a British point of view, the war lasted from the official declaration until the signature of the official peace settlement, and a large number of memorials carry what might be called the 'official' dating of the conflict.

However, since the fighting stopped in 1918, it became increasingly common to refer to the war of 1914-18 rather than being punctillious about observing the dates recognised by officialdom.
That answers my question then. Archimedes, you sir remain Encyclopaedic as ever.............Thanks. :wink:
 
#15
Was there any fighting on the 12th and 13th Nov?

Lettow-Vorbeck's troops were marching towards their next objective when he got a message from Deventer on the 13th informing him that Germany had agreed to an armistice two days before - I wasn't aware of any action taking place in Africa between the 11th and Lettow-Vorbeck agreeing terms?
 
#16
tropper66 said:
Archimedes said:
Although copepod and Tropper are quite correct about deaths from wounds in 1919 and fighting in Russia, the reason for 1919 is as Western says - although fighting stopped on 11 November 18, Britain remained at war until 1919 when the Germans signed the peace treaty.

From a British point of view, the war lasted from the official declaration until the signature of the official peace settlement, and a large number of memorials carry what might be called the 'official' dating of the conflict.

However, since the fighting stopped in 1918, it became increasingly common to refer to the war of 1914-18 rather than being punctillious about observing the dates recognised by officialdom.
The last Germans to stop fighting where in East Africa who surrenderd on the 13th of November
nd the last Japanese came out of the Jungle in the 1970s or 80s but it did not alter the fact that the Second World War was over.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
#17
Archimedes said:
Was there any fighting on the 12th and 13th Nov?
Damn right. You should have SEEN the queue for the NAAFI!
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
#18
TheBigUn said:
Where any Cavalry soldiers actually killed in 1919 or could it refer to those who died from wounds received in 1918?
Last November the BBC showed a short series about people whose grandparents had served in the Great War. Somebody (I have Eamonn Holmes in my head but I could be wrong) had a grandfather who died of his wounds about 1935 IIRC. A gut shot, never healed, no proper treatment, no antibiotics, it festered for 20 years before it killed him.
 
#19
Anyone going on Sunday?
 
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