The ACF and Assault vests, some clarification.

#1
Having been bugged by kids in my detachment who have acquired these bloody things and then being told they can't use them, does anone know what the official line is?

The duty rumour at the moment is;

1) Cadets can't use assault vests becasue they don't set them up properly and it hurts their backs.
2) Cadets arn't allowed to use them because of Health and Safety when using weapons.


On another note, the other latest one is:

3) Cadets can't use bungees anymore when setting up poncho's because one might ping off and take someones eye out.


Has anyone got the official answers to these questions, as I keep getting different answers from different people in my county!

Regards,

Rab
 

slab

Old-Salt
#3
Hiya Mate

Assault Vests No official line to my knowledge, especially as the kids have to buy the kit themselves. As part of AIs duty of care, they should ensure as far as possible that kit is properly fitted prior to exercise and the kids aren't wandering around with unnecesary kit. A properly planned (and documented) lesson on "admin in the field" should sort this one.

Bungees. Sounds a bit silly to me. If you are worried, put it in the risk assessment. Simple control measures would be a. brief the cadets b. AIs site bashas c. lay comms cord for night movement d. any bug-out to be well controlled.

Would county really get involved in minor detail like this, unless TSWO identifies a problem. Suggest you speak to him as these guys are really useful.
 

HS12

Old-Salt
#4
I think somebody at a high level in your county doesn't like Assault Vests and bungees. Perhaps somebody should point out the health and safety points of using weapons. Until the red book is amended or an official directive comes from Land or Frimley, let the little darlings use them.
 
#5
Cadets can't use bungees anymore when setting up poncho's because one might ping off and take someones eye out.
Laughable but posible in fact has happened to a guardsman who was on Ex Iron Lance, Belize mid 80's, went by the name of "Bungeye".

Its that little extra "Twitch" of the wrist on a substandard "pound shop" bungee that is made when under pressure /light fading that can cause this horror.

Cadets should be on "Hard Routine" not seen or heard and have there wrists shackled to prevent them robbing anything DPM or with a crows foot.

Hope this clears up any "Grey Areas"......
 
#6
I was working with the my old ACF battalion last summer and they were still allowed bungees in fact they were issued them. I still say a number of cadets wearing assault vest and the AIs had no problem with them as long as they are correctly fitted.
 
#8
We had an 'official line' from county about bungees last year - some kids had developed good torture techniques with them on annual camp, so they were banned by two out of the three companies.

But then try to get them to put basha's up with string... doesn't work, especially when you want them to bug out. So now, bungees are back on the menu.

As for the assault vests, there is no official line at the moment, chances are someone took a dislike in your county.
 
#9
But then try to get them to put basha's up with string... doesn't work, especially when you want them to bug out. So now, bungees are back on the menu.
My arrse, do they have velcro fastners on there sand shoes and zips on there boots?

Bugging out from who? Uncle Billy trawling the woods for kids with his bloodhounds? Or angry Regs wanting there pilfered kit back?

Instead of teaching the cadets the fighting skills of Walter Mitty, get back to basics and teach them to tie some useful knots, A round turn and two half hitches on strong nylon cord has served me worldwide when the "Basha" bird is heard.
 
#10
surely most people would agree webbing is far better to suited to ACF fieldcraft/ range work and it's use should be promoted???

Personally I think assault vests are pointless in the ACF, don't even get me started on blo8ody chest rigs :x
 
#12
Outstanding said:
illbeamonkeysoon said:
don't even get me started on blo8ody chest rigs :x
But they are great!?
For tankies... Cadets seem to think that Chest Rigs and tac vests make them look more warry - which for most of them is what its all about. Some of the more swicthed on cookies, tend to ditch the chest webbing after the first exercise esp. when lots of time is spent on their belt buckles.
 
#13
There are many rumours on the bungee question. However, nothing has appeared in black and white (check your red book).

Similarly, there is no official line on assault vests (or even chest rigs).

Of course some Commandants and Coy. Commanders may put out their own local instructions (the ACF is still the closest thing to a legal private army that we see in this country)
 
#14
I havent heard an official line on the assualt vests but i agree with illbeamonkeysoon and say they are not well suited to cadet type activity.
The powers that be did however put a ban on the south african webbing because it could break the little ones ribs apparently?! Anyone else heard this?
 
#16
Not heard of it happening but do understand their thinking, even if it could be construde as a RA gone crazy.

Thing is SA webbing is a cheap alternative to purchasing PLCE for cadets, but a lot more comfortable and easier to use than the 58' stuff they are issued, therefore incredibly popular. Same for webtex (shite) assault vests.
 
#18
The SA shit is a bag of ****, i was however referring to the web-tex vests, and in some cases the non-web tex ones that the little ones have shelled out for.

So the general consensus is, my county are going a bit mad on RA's.


Regards,

Rab
 
#19
just the counytsgone mad,mine went through a phase of banning gas cookers,metal mugs,glow sticks,chest rigs, no movement in green fleet ,no lsw, and im sure there were a few more but ive lost count,oh and the latese t one to save on rubbish bills get the cadets to take home there rubbish!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
#20
Dante said:
Outstanding said:
illbeamonkeysoon said:
don't even get me started on blo8ody chest rigs :x
But they are great!?
For tankies... Cadets seem to think that Chest Rigs and tac vests make them look more warry - which for most of them is what its all about. Some of the more swicthed on cookies, tend to ditch the chest webbing after the first exercise esp. when lots of time is spent on their belt buckles.
However....
Issue chest rigs can be got for the same price as webtex webbing. The ccf unit i help out with had a rn cc for years and no real army oc. he bought webtex and not surprisingly it is in rags v quickly. Although chest rig gash for infantry soldiering, for the amount of time that cadets spend crawling in a training year (it may be far more in acf, i don't know) I would rather the contingent buy the sturdy issue kit that will last years and not need to be immediately replaced.
 

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