Tempest Manned Unmanned Fighter Concept

The topic probably belongs on another thread, perhaps one for Australian naval procurement if there is enough interest to sustain one.

However, here's an alternative point of view.
Attack class woes not all that is happening on subs

I get the impression that there is general opposition to the subs in Australia based on two things. One is the cost of the program, with many people thinking it is too expensive. The other is Australian defence industry sources who are afraid they won't get enough of the resulting work share, as this is to be negotiated in phases.

A lot of Australian defence politics revolves around which province and which company gets how much of the defence spending, and less about what the thing actually does. This isn't exclusive to Australia, but on the other hand you aren't going to understand Australian defence policy without it.
Hence why we as a supplier of military equipment dont even bother tendering for projects there.
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Fascinating stuff there.

the role of women is the key to sustainable defence .

What ever happened to focusing on ‘the people’ that make the magic happen.

Andy, I know this must seem strange, considering their behaviour and wiring, but women are people.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
The topic probably belongs on another thread, perhaps one for Australian naval procurement if there is enough interest to sustain one.

However, here's an alternative point of view.
Attack class woes not all that is happening on subs

I get the impression that there is general opposition to the subs in Australia based on two things. One is the cost of the program, with many people thinking it is too expensive. The other is Australian defence industry sources who are afraid they won't get enough of the resulting work share, as this is to be negotiated in phases.

A lot of Australian defence politics revolves around which province and which company gets how much of the defence spending, and less about what the thing actually does. This isn't exclusive to Australia, but on the other hand you aren't going to understand Australian defence policy without it.
A bit like job-creation in Wales, then?
 
The topic probably belongs on another thread, perhaps one for Australian naval procurement if there is enough interest to sustain one.

However, here's an alternative point of view.
Attack class woes not all that is happening on subs

I get the impression that there is general opposition to the subs in Australia based on two things. One is the cost of the program, with many people thinking it is too expensive. The other is Australian defence industry sources who are afraid they won't get enough of the resulting work share, as this is to be negotiated in phases.

A lot of Australian defence politics revolves around which province and which company gets how much of the defence spending, and less about what the thing actually does. This isn't exclusive to Australia, but on the other hand you aren't going to understand Australian defence policy without it.

As an ex-defence company employee in this game, being in Aus this ‘subs’ thing really doesn’t get much airtime, I can honestly say the average and majority of Aussies do not bother about defence spending at all.

The opposition claimed is limited purely to the two or three ship yards and those employed by the defence companies.

Honestly, 95% of Aussies wouldn’t know we have submarines if it wasn’t for the media bagging out the ancient Collins Class, they couldn’t tell you what jets we have or what helicopters we operate outside of the civilian ones.

Zero fcuks are given..mate
 
Andy, I know this must seem strange, considering their behaviour and wiring, but women are people.
I think the point I was trying to make was that like burglary, nobody deserves to be raped. But saying it shouldn’t happen doesn’t mean that it’s going to stop happening.

I do everything in my power to stop being burgled. If o do get burger because I’ve left a window open. It’s no use saying ‘I should be able to leave my window open and not expect to get burgled.’

I know it’s not as simple as that. I’ve now had my awareness raised about crossing over to the other side of the road if you’re walking past a woman from behind her. And I’ve never felt it’s acceptable to cat call women.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
I think the point I was trying to make was that like burglary, nobody deserves to be raped. But saying it shouldn’t happen doesn’t mean that it’s going to stop happening.

I do everything in my power to stop being burgled. If o do get burger because I’ve left a window open. It’s no use saying ‘I should be able to leave my window open and not expect to get burgled.’

I know it’s not as simple as that. I’ve now had my awareness raised about crossing over to the other side of the road if you’re walking past a woman from behind her. And I’ve never felt it’s acceptable to cat call women.
The problem with calling people 'rape apologists' for making sound observations about safety is that it clouds the real issue.

I do a Krav Maga class. It's all about situational awareness - don't walk down that dark alley, read your environment.

If I get drunk and pick a fight with a bunch of bikers, I've invited what happens. Solution? Don't get drunk and pick a fight with a bunch of big blokes.

The 'feminist' lobby takes the naive view that all men should be honourable. Most are. I've been in situations in my youth, late on at a taxi rank for example, where some bloke's been chancing his arm and I've made out that the girl he's chatting up is with me. White-knighting, in fact... put her in a cab and said, loudly, "I'll call you in the morning." No idea who she was.

Most guys would do what I did, and in fact all that was happening was that she was being chatted up by a drunk. He wasn't really doing much, it was just uninvited.

But back to awareness. Most guys are honourable, even with a skinful. But, you have to account for the ones that aren't.

Getting drunk and incapable, wearing something that is provocative and ending up in the wrong place is putting yourself in danger.

It, rape, shouldn't happen. But the world is not an ideal place.

That's not being an apologist. It's being a realist.
 
All big chunks.

I suspect that politics, and US pressure, won't allow a fuller merger. That's a shame - there's lot of common ground and crossover potential.
Any possibility that the U.K. May end up operating the FX?

I suspect with China becoming a growing threat, politics and US pressure might become less of a problem.
 
...
Honestly, 95% of Aussies wouldn’t know we have submarines if it wasn’t for the media bagging out the ancient Collins Class, they couldn’t tell you what jets we have or what helicopters we operate outside of the civilian ones.

Zero fcuks are given..mate

The way China/CCP is behaving towards Australia at the moment may serve to sharpen their interest.
 
Any possibility that the U.K. May end up operating the FX?

I suspect with China becoming a growing threat, politics and US pressure might become less of a problem.


Like the UK and Australia, Japan hasn't forgotten or forgiven the issues with the F-22 (and F-35).

No one wants to be in on a US led 6th Gen 'as long as some idiot Senator doesn't ban its export' fighter.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
Any possibility that the U.K. May end up operating the FX?

I suspect with China becoming a growing threat, politics and US pressure might become less of a problem.
Lord knows. We seem to be very bullish in terms of getting Tempest from screenshot to reality. But, as @Magic_Mushroom pointed out repeatedly, we have a lot of crossover with the Japanese in terms of defence/equipment requirements.
 
Lord knows. We seem to be very bullish in terms of getting Tempest from screenshot to reality. But, as @Magic_Mushroom pointed out repeatedly, we have a lot of crossover with the Japanese in terms of defence/equipment requirements.


We're not staring from a plain sheet of paper. The UK has a whole wealth of R&D and experience going back to REPLICA and even further back in materials.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
We're not staring from a plain sheet of paper. The UK has a whole wealth of R&D and experience going back to REPLICA and even further back in materials.
Absolutely. REPLICA bounced us into F-35.

Much of stealth is about manufacturing tolerances as much as shape. Some comparisons with panel fit on Russian aircraft might be made here; I don't know about Chinese.

I was shown at first hand over 25 years ago what BAE was doing with DB/SPF. It was very impressive.
 
Absolutely. REPLICA bounced us into F-35.

Much of stealth is about manufacturing tolerances as much as shape. Some comparisons with panel fit on Russian aircraft might be made here; I don't know about Chinese.

I was shown at first hand over 25 years ago what BAE was doing with DB/SPF. It was very impressive.


Russian panel fit is 'interesting'
Chinese panel fit? Its often very good, but that's because they employ lots of diligent chaps with files to make them fit perfectly - what? You wanted the parts to be interchangeable!
 
Just thinking that the tiniest electronic components are manufactured in China these days. OK, a lot of crap, but also most of the best of consumer goods. If there's a will to do quality control,the Chinese can do precision.
 
Much of stealth is about manufacturing tolerances as much as shape.

I was amazed by the impact of 'steps' on panels even from a performance point of view let alone stealth.

A guy on a aircraft group I am part of did a nice example highlighting issues on russias latest attempt at a single seat stealth aircraft mock-up. It seems to shows either a complete misunderstanding of your comment I quoted or its just vapour wear, I suspect equal amounts of both.
 

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