Tech/CSE Class 1

Discussion in 'Royal Signals' started by J_B_, Sep 20, 2009.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Hello,

    Can anyone here give me some info on the course content of the Tech Class 1 now? I'm on it soon and have no idea what to expect as I've heard and been told so many different things.

    Also, what recognised qualfications are obtained after completion? Heard its an MCSE and CCNA now, but not sure how true that is. If these are the only quals then where does that leave us for our foreman? No HND? How can we be expected to jump from one level to the other?

    Any information would be great.

  2. There was some stuff published to ArmyNET sharepoint some time ago - not sure if it's been superseded. Check out There is MCSE and CCNA stuff on there but that's only vocational, rather than academic skillset-based. Your chain of command should be able to browse the defence intranet for information. The intranet link is but it all too often seemes to be FUBAR.

    A little birdie told me that the course MIGHT be in the process of being accredited with a foundation degree. Again, not sure where that leaves the FofS course. 18 year olds manage to go to university and study at degree level without an HND to prepare them, albeit in three years and smashed out of their tree on snakebite and weed, but who knows?
  3. Whilst we are on the topic of MCSE etc, I'm currently in the Officer application process. I've got a fair few MS certs and a few others, just wondering if I were to commission into the Signals whether I would get the chance to box the last few off?

    As I was told 'if you want to be up to your elbows in an engine, don't join as an Officer' - presumably it is the men who are fully technical and the Officers who have a broader understanding but manage them?
  4. Probably not. Unless you are very lucky and find yourself in a unit with a ridiculous training budget (pretty much unheard of even a few years ago) you are out of luck. It is also worth pointing out that any MS quals won't really count for anything as an officer in the Signals. You won't be hands-on implementing any ICS systems. You will however be managing those that do. Your technical input will be minimal however.

    Sorry if I'm bursting a few bubbles here fella, but there is no requirement for officers in the Royal Corps to have any technically orientated qualification. Essentially any degree will do. Given that someone with a commission and a degree in David Beckham could (potentially) become a Royal Signals officer, it seems a little counter-intuitive to allow them to have input into technical matters.

    If you want to manage men, become an officer. If you want to learn and apply a trade become a soldier.
  5. A bit harsh on the Tech Adjts out there, Friday90?
    I do agree, though, there aren't many DE R Signals officers who are hands on although some of them do tend to stick their noses in (amazing how the basket weaving degree qualifies them to show a liney how to roll up a length of coax). Most LEs still manage to keep in their trade and are selected for the input they have into the technical or operating sides of the business which is a plus for the Corps.
  6. Totally agree, if you want to do techie stuff involving plugging kit together, hands-on enginering, troubleshooting, IT, repairs etc join as a CS Engr. As years go by you start to get more involved with the management disciplines; project management, capability management and big picture stuff but that's a long way off - at least 10 years away. Officers never touch any of the kit or have anything to do with designing network / system architecture, but after what you might call an apprenticeship (2Lt and Lt) they start to get involved in the good clever stuff at Captain and above, as Ops Officers and then as SO3 staff officers or Technical Adjutants.

    Ask yourself what you want to be doing in 10 years time - do you want to be in an engineering support / technical wizard role or do you want to be the boss out front making the decisions and calling on the 'wizards' as your specialist advisors? A bit of a blunt way of describing it but I think it's fair. You don't see officers leaving the mob to be network engineers, installation engineers or IT engineers - it's all about management and leadership, keeping the plates spinning while navigating your way around some egomaniacs who are intent on tripping you up.

    Image is also very important. If you dress like a tramp, the life of an officer could be for you.
  7. Thanks guys, pretty much confirms what I thought. :)

  8. But they can spend ALL their time in constructive study (if they want too) Not having to stag on as guard commander, get their study time miss managed by the RSM as he needs 12 men to pick up fag ends cos Brig XYZ is coming to visit, do PT and all the other crap (character building and being part of the team - its the Army you know :D Nope its the Royal Signals /SF/Bullshit Corps)

    Saying that I still would take my hat off to anybody who attempted the FofS course let alone passed it. (If I was wearing one that is).
  9. I heard from a mate at Blandford that the first "cohort" of the CS Engr Class 1 course just all passed their CCNA. I wonder if anyone of the course can corroborate it and let us know. Apparently the training was around 7 weeks (but spread over a slightly longer period).

    That's actually quite interesting - the Corps churning out nearly 150 CCNA-qualified people per year into the field. Interesting to see how it will all pan out and, even more interestingly, the average percentage score was extremely close to the scores on the FofS course.

    (er...I've probably over-used the word "interesting" there...)
  10. The qualification in question is NOT a full CCNA, however, it is an official Cisco Academy qual, I forget what it's called, but it's just below the CCNA.

    The CS Eng Class 1 course is still in the process of attaining Foundation Degree accreditation from Bournemouth University.

    As for the MCSE, you can certainly attain MOST of the modules required during the CS Eng C1 course, but you'll have to do the last couple off your own back.

    And those lovely 2 to 1 workbooks that everyone got sent at their unit and were told they HAD to fill them in otherwise they'd be RTU'd on day one of the course? Throw them away, no-one's interested.
  11. Remember it's a foundation degree (FdSc) not a full honours degree (BSc). That would probably mean that it would reduce the APEL bill on the FofS course and potentially either cut the TMAs out (used to justify the first 120 credits) or cut the course length by a year. Or both, I dunno, the guys at Blandford might have heard rumblings from the palace of destruction and can possibly enlighten us.

    We should try to resists the temptation to automatically and directly compare a purely vocational qualification (which is a level 4 NVQ under a new name) with the academic rigours of the FofS TES BSc (Hons). I don't think it's necessarily devalued, it just sounds wrong because they are both referred to as "degrees" despite being chalk and cheese. But it is still a 240-pointer, so there absolutely has to be knock-on for the next course(s) up.

    Not true. Cisco also has its certified entry networking technician qualification CCENT. CCNA sits at level 3 on the national qualifications and skills framework, so it is a standalone level 3 qualification which sits inside the overall level 4 FdSc.

    By the way, if CCNA is Janet and John, then why is it still a module on the 2 year FofS TES BSc (Hons) course? Perhaps they should be doing more advanced design and architecture stuff etc rather than programming switches and routers. A level-3 course as part of a level-5 programme? Sounds a bit daft but what do I know.

    I think Binary Warfare might be mistaken - the Class 1 course completed all 4 modules of the entire CCNA Exploration syllabus, but I don't know if the MoD is paying for their exams.