Teachers to stand and watch little Johnny get thumped

#1
Linky

A teachers' union is planning to write to all of its members warning them not to intervene in playground fights.

The move follows Glasgow City Council's decision to reject a request for £2,500 compensation from a teacher who was injured in an incident last year.

The Scottish Secondary Teachers' Association said staff would now be less inclined to break up disputes.

Glasgow council said it judged claims on their individual merits and advised staff to not put themselves at risk.

The SSTA's move comes six months after a 58-year-old teacher was accidentally punched in the mouth when she intervened between two children at a special school.

An inevitable result of compensation culture?

Don't teachers have a duty of care, something about being the legal guardians of the kids? In which case, if wee Johnny gets injured whilst a teacher stands by, won't the parents have a case for prosecuting?
 
#2
For fecks sake, they should man up and grow a pair, wade the feck in, and rip the tw@s apart. Get a couple of sly digs in themselves and then the expell the sub normal little cnuts for fighting. Fecking compen fecking sation!!! You liberal wnakers. No wonder the country is on its knees
 
#3
If she was hit in the face such that her teeth were broken then why has the child not been arrested and subjected to the full force of the law.


We know that if she had used any form of physical force on a pupil she would have been suspended pending disgrace and dismisal.
 
#5
If I had belted a teacher in the gob at school my father would have thrashed me to within an inch of my life! Teachers should wade in to break up fights, but if this teacher's teeth have been broken in doing so I think it is only fair that he/ she should have it fixed in work time at the expense of the ejerkation authority.
This is nothing to do with compensation culture, this is bad management.
 
#6
depressing isn't it.

I got in one fight ever at school....I was even winning as the PE Teacher walked round the corner. 10 seconds later both 'combatants' were seperated and dragged off to stand outside his office. Half an hour later we were given the biggest verbal dressing down I ever got in school (corporal punishment having been banned by then).

The best bit was I got the verbal for starting the fight - the other kid got the verbal for being involved and losing the fight to a 2nd team winger (me) when he was the first team prop....put everything into perspective.

S_R
 
#7
I have worked at a "Special" school for autistic adults (18-35) and if these namby pamby teachers reckon they have it tough with someone who is just a bit of a bad egg and underachiever they should try a day or two in one of those places. Both female and male staff were often attacked without prejudice, having widescreen tv's thrown out of first floor windows, knives and glasses thrown, whole dining tables. These were young people with severe autism and boy when they aint happy and if you don't spot the signs initially you will soon find out the hard way. I had to personally drag one young chap off a young female carer as his teeth were sinking into her neck and he had half her hair in his hand. Not one of us ever went screaming for compo or anything as it was an occupational hazard. If you try to tell a toddler no, you will get a tantrum and maybe a few kicks, put that mental age and reasoning in an 18 year old 18 stone bloke who has not taken his medication and tell him no!!!!........ Go on I double dare ya!!! All this compensation stuff really winds me up.
 
#8
Mrs Baiter is currently teaching in a Speshul School. While most of the pupils have the basic knowledge of right and wrong and don't fight, you would be hard pressed to break them up when they start - mongs can be very strong and pretty determined when their blood is up.

In a mainstream school they should be dragged apart, cuffed round the head and made to hold a piece of rough grade sandpaper to the wall using their noses only for 2 hours like I had to at school. Certainly reinforced the point.
 
#9
The other option is always the fire hose.....no physical contact, safe distance for the teacher and punishment fo r fighting included by having to spend the rest of the day in school soaking wet.

S_R
 
#11
Yes the teacher should wade in and break it up.
But,
please remember...

They have no training of any sort in dealing with this sort of thing. None at all.
They don't have the kind of experience a soldier has had. None at all.
They don't stand a chance when any kind of weapon is being used, as it often it. None at all.
They know that if they get at all physical, they face investigation, and if there is a complaint from a child (and there will be) that teacher will be presumed guilty till prooved innocent.
Frankly, I can't blame any teacher standing back and waiting till they've got help in the form of at least one more teacher. Preferably more than one, so there's plenty of witness statements to back you up.
Particularly in a secondary school, many of the studemnts are bigger, heavier, and tougher than many of the teachers.
I have broken up a very violent fight before now, and have had to write a detailed statement. And then sweated buckets till it was clear that I was going to be exonerated form all blame.
 
#12
PapaGolf said:
For fecks sake, they should man up and grow a pair, wade the feck in, and rip the tw@s apart. Get a couple of sly digs in themselves and then the expell the sub normal little cnuts for fighting. Fecking compen fecking sation!!! You liberal wnakers. No wonder the country is on its knees
If the teacher was any good, he'd have used this as an opportunity for an impromptu practical lesson:-

Physics : Conservation of momentum in inelastic collisions.
Maths : How odds work at the bookies.
Biology : Teeth. Could have passed his own round for the kids to look at.
Law : Difference between common assault and GBH.
PE : Boxing tips. How best to land that knockout blow.
 
#13
abeaumont said:
Yes the teacher should wade in and break it up.
But,
please remember...

They have no training of any sort in dealing with this sort of thing. None at all.

My wife teaches at a local primary, and yes you may think harmless little darlings, far from it. They have all undertaken a course provided by the local authority in safe intervention and mild restraint. Some techniques as demonstrated by Mrs RM after were all basic aikido joint lock techniques and methods of putting distance between yourself and the stroppy kid, quite good I thought.

They don't have the kind of experience a soldier has had. None at all.

What a pointless sweeping statement, it's a school, not Belfast, what do you suggest send them down to tin city? They do not need to be trained to any military standard, what an absurd thought.

They don't stand a chance when any kind of weapon is being used, as it often it. None at all.

Neither does anyone if caught off guard unless you happen to possess Steven Seagal sleeping weasel responses, it doesn't matter if you are the worlds finest combat machine, a knife or any other weapon is still going to hurt.


They know that if they get at all physical, they face investigation, and if there is a complaint from a child (and there will be) that teacher will be presumed guilty till prooved innocent.
Frankly, I can't blame any teacher standing back and waiting till they've got help in the form of at least one more teacher. Preferably more than one, so there's plenty of witness statements to back you up.
Particularly in a secondary school, many of the studemnts are bigger, heavier, and tougher than many of the teachers.
I have broken up a very violent fight before now, and have had to write a detailed statement. And then sweated buckets till it was clear that I was going to be exonerated form all blame.


The only bit I fully agree with in the whole post I'm afraid, and this has happened to my Mrs, thankfully it was all dropped after the child admitted to making it all up, especially as all her classmates grassed her up for lying about it all and even the childs mother said "she tends to elaborate on the truth!" true what you say this was somebodys career and livelihood on the line.
 
#14
Anyone stopped to ask if little johnny might deserve it?
 
#15
smartascarrots said:
Anyone stopped to ask if little johnny might deserve it?
He does, he's a wee Ned.
 

Command_doh

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
This is a great idea.

When someone's child is beaten to paralysis or death, then people will start to wake up and take the requisite measures. It will become COMPULSORY for Teachers to intervene, on fear of losing their jobs. On another reactionary and confrontational note, I'm all for compulsory knife detectors in all Schools and for private plod to be carrying stunguns and plasticuffs (like the U.S. system allows for).
 
#17
Rapierman.... You wife is very lucky. A teacher who has had some self-defence training. That is virtually unheard of. I've never had any in relation to school and don't know any teacher who has. I'm very aware how rough it can be in a primary school - I've spent enough time in them over the past 25 years.

I appear to have made myself rather unclear. Apologies for that... In my comment about lack of experience I was trying to indicate that a very high proportion of teachers have never even seen a fight before they first find themselves confronted with a nasty playground confrontation. That might sound a sweeping generalisation but it is a reality in many schools. Its the kind of life and background so many of them come from. For many teachers, the first time they see something of the sort it is a hell of a shock and they are unable to cope. Even bigger when, as happened here a couple of years ago, two mothers decide to sort out a third using hammers at the end of the school day as all the children were leaving. And yes, teachers were criticised for wasting time calling the police when they should have been getting stuck in. Lack of experience comes in another form too. Such fights are not an everyday occurence for most teachers. I taught in challenging schools for nearly all my career, yet only had to face two such fights in the last 20 years.
 
#18
It's all upside down and back to front.

A teachers' union is planning to write to all of its members warning them not to intervene in playground fights.

The move follows Glasgow City Council's decision to reject a request for £2,500 compensation from a teacher who was injured in an incident last year.
- Teachers are not only there to teach, but to enforce discipline. Part of their job is breaking up playground fights.
- Unless it was for money she lost as a result of her injuries, she should not be entitled to 'compensation'.
- The union needs to grow up. It seems they've spat their dummy out over the compo and resorted to petty threats - instead of tackling the root causes.
 
#19
DeltaDog said:
It's all upside down and back to front.

A teachers' union is planning to write to all of its members warning them not to intervene in playground fights.

The move follows Glasgow City Council's decision to reject a request for £2,500 compensation from a teacher who was injured in an incident last year.
- Teachers are not only there to teach, but to enforce discipline. Part of their job is breaking up playground fights.
- Unless it was for money she lost as a result of her injuries, she should not be entitled to 'compensation'.
- The union needs to grow up. It seems they've spat their dummy out over the compo and resorted to petty threats - instead of tackling the root causes.
Indeed. I agree with you. But make sure that the root causes are being dealt with, and that teachers have the training to deal with such situations. However, in this particular case the spat out dummy has been brought about by the local authority refusing to allow the teacher time off from school to have surgery to repair the damage. That was the final straw, not the refusal to refund the dental bills.
 
#20
DeltaDog said:
It's all upside down and back to front.

A teachers' union is planning to write to all of its members warning them not to intervene in playground fights.

The move follows Glasgow City Council's decision to reject a request for £2,500 compensation from a teacher who was injured in an incident last year.
- Teachers are not only there to teach, but to enforce discipline. Part of their job is breaking up playground fights.
- Unless it was for money she lost as a result of her injuries, she should not be entitled to 'compensation'.
- The union needs to grow up. It seems they've spat their dummy out over the compo and resorted to petty threats - instead of tackling the root causes.
DeltaDog, the full details of the story were not posted on ARRSE - she's claimed the amount her dental treatment has cost.

Her dental surgery has so far cost about £2,500.
The union said the "final straw" came when Glasgow City Council refused to let an injured teacher take time off to complete dental surgery.
Seems reasonable to me - if she stepped in break up a fight, and her teeth were damaged, her employer should stump up the cost to put them to how they were before the fight. This should also be done during work time. .

Also, I don't think the union is in the wrong. Sounds like they're applying pressure to make the council pay for her dental surgery. I think that's supposed to be one of the benefits of a union - to be able to apply mass pressure in unfair situations. So good for her, I wish I had that sort of backup if I ever had any problems at work.
 

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