Taliban offered to hand over Osama - BEFORE 9/11....

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Goatman, Sep 28, 2006.

  1. Obviously - next dumbass question ?

  2. If not the WTC another target would have been hit

  3. A free society cannot defend itself from this kind of attack

  4. This is fake - nobody warned the White House

  5. Even if they had - we get 10 such warnings a day


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  1. Goatman

    Goatman LE Book Reviewer

    This is a 9 minute clip.....it examines claims that the Clinton administration
    (and their appointees in the Int community) passed Bush/Cheney clear, stark and unambiguous warnings relating to Al Quaeda

    It's worth watching just for the quote from Paul Bremer - an insider, in 2001:

    ' What they will do is stagger along until there is a major incident and then say 'Oh my God, shouldn't we be organised to deal with this ? '


    ( I doubt DII will cope with it - use a stand alone)

    If I read this right ( and I have in mind that in the wake of 9/11 commission report there is an element of blamestorming to this) then 3,000 people from all over the world died in Manhattan needlessly.

    God rest them.

    Don Cabra
  2. I believe that negotiations with Taliban are possible right now. Moreover that...


  3. From a Nato press release issued yesterday: "Tuesday’s suicide attack in Lashkar Gah brings the total number of attacks this year to 56. These 56 suicide attacks have killed 131 Afghans, 27 Afghan security personnel and 13 international soldiers, and ended 56 lives that should have been better spent."

    So what actually constitutes terrorism then?
  4. Goatman

    Goatman LE Book Reviewer

    Were you able to access YouTube from autumnal Mocba then Sergey ? Or just commenting on your perception of the Taliban 'Way ahead' ?

    The clip does not dwell on the alleged Taliban overture in 2001....more on whether the signposts were clearly marked for Bush and his V-P and whether anyone in the White House bothered to take any notice.

    It's worth reading some of the comments on the YouTube page:

    Wow real journalism- I thought it was extinct.

    scorp2007 (8 hours ago)
    This video needs to be on every bloggers site in existance!

    mmckee44 (8 hours ago)
    Thank you Keith. This was excellent.
    Olbermann-Stewart in "08?

    judah (7 hours ago)
    lol. nothing subtantive from the cons. somehow i'm not suprised the remaining republicans on the internet are all fvcking trolls.

    ricbear (7 hours ago)
    This is great! And you know NONE of the trolls here will talk about the FACTS Olbermann brings up - ALL they will do is dump insults.

    frostymxer (6 hours ago)
    There has to be a catch here. I think they are gonna let the Bush Regime go down with the 911 ship and play it off as the answer when in fact its not.

    AngryBob666 (6 hours ago)
    'Bout damn time somebody told the truth. Bush's web of lies is finally falling apart.

    karldpeters (6 hours ago)
    Damn, damn, damn!! For all their attempts to blame someone else, we now know it's because they think it's their own fault. Damn. Impeach those sons of bitches.

    spacespace (4 hours ago)
    Outstanding!! Let's make this go huge viral. . . the world needs to see this.

    mmeettaann (4 hours ago)
    The guy is Bush`s best friend,making him look incompetent instead of criminal.Everybody with an IQ above that of yeast knows by now that 911 was an inside job.

    revivalizt (3 hours ago)
    I hate liars .. why would they lie?? I'm so voting this for 5 STARS ..

    PLEASE make this a FEATURED video guys.

    oanatrif (3 hours ago)
    Revivalizt, I second that opinion. Make this a FEATURED video on youtube!

    mipian (3 hours ago)
    I third it! The truth needs to get out there.

    bugmen0tplease (2 hours ago)
    George W. Bush - Worst President In American History

    now, in a little while the USA wakes up....I suspect the GOP will urge it's supporters to post some more measured responses.....

    As an interested non-involved observer of US politics since Lyndon Johnson's day, I cannot remember anyone who has divided the exceptional state to the same extent....Roll on the November mid-terms.....

    Don Cabra
  5. There was a lot of suicide attacks during WW2. Soldiers with grenades detonated them just being under a tank. Many covered (by their bodies) a hole in bunkers to stop machine gun firing. Many Soviet pilots on damaged planes didn't bale out but instead commited a suicide directing their planes to enemy targets. There were suicide attacks, but can we call the soldiers as terrorists? I think that no. I have never heard that Japanese kamikadzes were regarded as terrorists.

    So a suicide attack itself is not equal to a terror act. It depends on many factors.

    I believe that any attack (even suicide one) against foreign solders on own soil can't be regarded as a terrorism.

    Gatman, thank you for additioan info. I'll try to watch the clip at home where I have unlimited Internet access. Now I haven't much time (am writing a proposition to impove telemetry system on one power station).
  6. When are not in uniforms and they attack civilians . They are terrorist
  7. Uniforms? Btw, Afghans that attacked Soviet troops in 80's also didn't wear uniforms, but they were not called terrorists but rather 'freedom fighters' and they were indeed freedom fighters that had full rights to fight against enemy on their own soil using any possible measures including suicide attacks. And Afghans on their own soil must not to wear any stupid uniforms. They wear their traditional clothes of warriors. It along with a machine guns in their hands is their 'uniform'.

    As for attacks against civilians then I'm unaware about corresponding example.
  8. If you mount an attack, suicide or otherwise, that kills innocent civilians in an attempt to intimidate them - in this case into not giving any support or backing to people sent to help reconstruct your country - you are a terrorist and no amount of verbal manouevring is going to change that.
  9. 'Those that were sent' to my country without my invitation can be killed by me using any means moreover that 'those that were sent' killed a lot of civilians themselves.


    Edited to add. Writing 'me' I meant to demonstrate a logic of a typical 'freedom fighter'.
  10. Terrorism is a tactic waged when conventional military action is not possible or desirable. It's not something inherently evil, it depends on why you're doing it.

    For instance, using your definition the strategic bombing campaigns waged during WW2 were terrorism. Such raids killed many, many civilians for the express purpose of breaking the will of the home front to resist. (For the record, I believe it was the right thing to do - then.)

    Another WW2 example, ever heard of the Auxunits ? These were stay behind units set up to wage a terrorist campaign against the Germans should they have invaded. The activities of Soviet partisans or the French maquis are other examples. Should the inhabitants of those occupied countries have refused to fight their occupiers using terrorist methods and tactics ?

    Of course in such cases where we agree with the aims of the terrorists we call them freedom fighters. And therein lies the reason we consistently fail to stop people becoming terrorists, we refuse to acknowledge that they reject what we are trying to do for them and would rather shoot at us than accept it. We refuse to acknowledge that what we think of as "collateral damage" they see as "innocents murdered by foreign terrorists".
  11. I said civilians ,so if you don't have uniforms and you attack cilivans in order to frighten them into submission you are a terrorist. Its really very simple. If you don't wear uniforms but you limit your attack to military targets than you are guerrillas fighters. If you do both you are a terrorist . If you believe in what the guerrilla fighters are fighting for than they are freedom fighters if not they are guerrilla fighters if they limit their attacks to military targets.
  12. Alright, stop trying to change the subject of the thread. You're a worshiper of this inept Daddy's boy and his cabal- so just tell us how you would respond to the assertions made in the vid.
  13. I wouldn't want to negotiate with the Taliban, to me they are too much like Nazis (this is not Neocon talk, this is how I see them). Their twisted ideology is a shame to the region, to islam, and humanity. The only deal I want to see is one where they disarm, stop forcing women to wear burkhas, and stop burning schools. For too many years we've been making deals with people like that. Too long the Taliban and the Baathists have been aided by the west. I long for the day when the earth is purged of fundamentalism and extremism.
  14. Goatman

    Goatman LE Book Reviewer

    Concur.....however, may I direct you to Kipling's poem 'Them'.

    or as I have seen it put in another place:

    ' It is not given to us to master the tides of the World....we can only struggle in the time wherein we are set, to uproot the evil in familiar fields...that those who come after may have clean earth to till. ''

    Crabs - well said...this thread concerns WHETHER or NOT Mister Bush and Mister Cheney had early warning, from both the outgoing administration and their own security apparat, of a 'clear and present danger' from Al Quaeda on US soil ?

    By all means digress (Sergey and Peter) but that is the central question.

    Given that so much death has sprung from that day, 11th September 2001 is relevant to all of us.

    Don Cabra
  15. Do you think that if you wear an uniform but attack civilians then you are not a terrorist in any case? Can American rapists be regarded as terrorists? They didn't wear uniforms during their alleged crime. But if they would wear uniforms then would it matter? As I understand, according to your logic it is sufficiet for Taliban to wear uniforms and that's all. They can attack anybody but (wearing uniforms) they would not be terrorists.

    From my point of view an uniform is absolutely irrelevant, more important what you have done exactly.