TA SNCOs

#1
I believe both the regular and TA CoC don't want us, they want IRs or TA officers. Are we just going to allow this?

Edited

I apologize for not posting this without the reasons, this was due to England actually looking ok at rugby yesterday........
 
#2
"Allow"? And the choice is?

All depends on one's usefulness. In my unit it's the other way round. I even volunteered for Afghanistan as a JNCO and was not required! Now, they would e more interested.. but now it's not such a great time for me. But that's another story and another thread...
 
#3
Perhaps you would like to substantiate your 'beliefs'...

msr
 
#9
Loads of vacancies on FTRS and Mob for SNCO's. Requirements seem to change from month to month, they do, they dont, they do, they might, they might not.......... This month they want infantry types, next month medics another time something else and the infantry types and medics are out on their ears.

Crisis management I think its called or it might just be ineptitude.

Cardinal
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#10
Cardinal said:
Loads of vacancies on FTRS and Mob for SNCO's. Requirements seem to change from month to month, they do, they dont, they do, they might, they might not.......... This month they want infantry types, next month medics another time something else and the infantry types and medics are out on their ears.
Crisis management I think its called or it might just be ineptitude.

Cardinal
You could also call it advertising posts that need to be filled, which means that they will change once they get filled and new shortfalls arise.

It is not all a big conspiracy, and good TA SNCOs are vital to the operation of the TA. They just might not be treated well in some units, but I would avoid tarring all units with the same brush.
 
#11
msr said:
Perhaps you would like to substantiate your 'beliefs'...

msr
The TA has changed with the regular element of the army wanting the TA to generate a number of better 'trained' reserves. Its been mentioned plenty of times that this helps create a mobilisation culture. So once training is complete, many newly trained soldiers then mobilise (and leave).

The TA CoC (I may be wrong here may have been regular) has also used recent years to increase the standards of its officers with their initial training and continuation training (or so it appears to be).

Then take the SNCO's nothing has really changed, suppose you could say CLM but that tends to be existing courses renamed. You could take the view that SNCO (& Cpls) courses were fine but other courses were fine and had to go through the b*gger*tion of this one army concept.

...but then the truth comes out. SNCO's are inadequately trained and to convert them to officers requires them to undertake officer recruit training (maybe not now but I see the writing on the wall - its been mentioned in a couple of recent threads).

also why haven't SNCO's had the b*gger*tion of this one army concept?? I wouldn't be suprised someone somewhere asked what do we need from TA SNCO's?
A. Someone to drive recruits/TAPO's to their training, count blankets, train recruits and run stores. We don't really want to mobilise them, many won't want to anyway, we can always let a select few through.
 
#12
several sncos from my regt were mobilised on various telecs including a bsm, several also in bosnia plus various other ops
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#13
We do not have a single SNCO in my company that has not deployed - several of them twice - to Iraq an various TELICs and Afghanistan on Herrick 4 with 3 Para.

Most of them have deployed in multiple commander/pl Sgt or relevant roles. As had been said before, the use of SNCOs is very dependant on units. Some do, some don't. If yours doesn't, and you want to mobilise - put your transfer papers in.
 
#15
Bailey said:
Too right. I've seen a TA WO2 and TA Sgt (actg C/Sgt) operating very effectively as CSM and CQMS of a 50/50 mixed Foot Guards and TA company.

However I think that in general there is if anything more reluctance on the part of the regulars to use TA WO/SNCOs in the CoC of regular soldiers than for TA officers to do the same.

Yep!!!

The CSgt is doing that job again, for another regular unit, in the same place.

I think the possible reluctance to use WO/SNCO may be due to the fear factor.

As we all know the WO/SNCO is seen to be both God incarnate and the font of all knowledge, so there could be a fear that to use a TA version will show up gaps in either operational knowledge, experiance or general ability.

(Dont get me wrong, I dont adear to that line of possible thought, and have been present when regulars both OR's and officers have found out/realised that people who they thought were regulars like themselfs for the past x months let them know the truth.)

It is a shame, and I hope that eventually reason will overcome fear and the WO/SNCO pool will be greater used for thier role (CSM/Plt Sgt etc) and not extra watchkeepers and general extra bods.
 
#16
The_Duke said:
We do not have a single SNCO in my company that has not deployed - several of them twice - to Iraq an various TELICs and Afghanistan on Herrick 4 with 3 Para.
Not unexpected, a unit with your ethos, I wouldn't have expected anything less. If I'd remained in the infantry I may have felt compelled to do the same.
Its different with units further back from the front end, that ethos is less apparent.

I'm concerned that the OR's deploying and some then leaving will have a cumulative effect of destroying the Sgts mess. Whereas all the extra training officers receive justs reinforces their mess.

The TA will end up with an American Army model structure, weaker Sgts mess and officers dominating. Its not very one army and it won't be in all units, it will just reinforce demands that OR's deploy because the Sgts mess has been weakened.
 
#17
Let's be honest here, it's a capbadge lottery. Some capbadges train the TA properly, trust them and use them. Others rape the TA for warm bodies to fill Pte slots.

When I got mobilised it was with a group of mostly seniors and officers because that's what the Corps needed at that time. My Bn is still mobilising all ranks to fill slots, with around 1/3 of everyone on Herrick being TA.

If your capbadge isn't then either make a fuss, leave or put up with it. You do have a choice.
 
#18
polar said:
Whereas all the extra training officers receive justs reinforces their mess.
HA HA HA.

msr
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#19
msr said:
polar said:
Whereas all the extra training officers receive justs reinforces their mess.
HA HA HA.

msr
Agreed, our WOs & Sgts mess is thriving, our officers mess is feeling the pinch at the 2Lt/Lt level, along with the rest of the TA.

My personal belief is that by the time you get to be a SNCO, you already have the bug and you put up with the shortcomings in the system. To get a new 2 LT you have to find a keen young person at the early stage of their career, and then beat the life out of them using the officer training system. Those few that survive are what you get as PL/Tp commanders.

We then further beat the life out of them with MS issues, "study days", MK1&2 etc. We know what we are letting ourself in for, but my time as a SNCO was definately more hands on and fun than my time as an officer (post Pl comd).
 
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