TA Infantry assigned to BAOR 1989


Hi all, wondering if I can get some help. I found a bit in an old Hansard but a FOI to the MOD has not been answered ( along with a request for the MARILYN Report ). I'm doing some research and trying to find out the wartime assignments and roles of the TA Infantry assigned to BAOR. This is what I have so far( from Hansard):
4RGJ- 1 Armd Div (7 Armd Bde)
4 Para- 1 Armd Div (Div tps)
10 Para- 1 Armd Div (Div tps)
15 Para- 1 Armd Div (Div tps)
1/51 Highland- 4 Armd Div (11 Armd Bde)
2/51 Highland (Milan Pln)- 4 Armd Div (11 Armd Bde)
1/52 Lowland (Milan Pln)- 4 Armd Div (11 Armd Bde)
5 Queens- 4 Armd Div (20 Armd Bde)
5/8 Kings (Milan Pln)- 4 Armd Div (20 Armd Bde)
3 RRW (Milan Pln)- 4 Armd Div (20 Armd Bde)
6 RRF- 2 Inf Div (15 Inf Bde)
1 Y&C- 2 Inf Div (15 Inf Bde)
2 Yorks- 2 Inf Div (15 Inf Bde)
7 Li- 2 Inf Div (15 Inf Bde)
8 Li- 2 Inf Div (15 Inf Bde)
5 R Anglian- 2 Inf Div (49 Inf Bde)
7 R Anglian- 2 Inf Div (49 Inf Bde)
3 Staffords- 2 Inf Div (49 Inf Bde)
5 Li- 2 Inf Div (49 Inf Bde)
5 RRF- 2 Inf Div (49 Inf Bde)
5 RGJ- 2 Inf Div tps/Corps tps
4 R Irish (Milan Pln)- 2 Inf Div tps
5 R Irish (Milan Pln)- 2 Inf Div tps
4 QLR- 2 Inf Div tps/Corps tps
4 WFR- Corps tps
Thanks in advance.

1 Y&C - should this read 1 Yorks?


Yes it should, I just cut and pasted from the Hansard page. That's why I'm looking for help :D .

px4llp said:
Sure 4 PARA was 15 INF Bde at the time...
They were in the 15 Bde area for admin et cetera and patrols comps et cetera but their deployment was always as Div Tps - the divisional reserve.


1/51 were the non armoured bit of 11 Amd bde. geography escapes me at the mo but it was right close to the IGB we were the mob who got to stay behind and die in vast numbers
Peeler and Putts - 1Yorkshire and Cleveland caused more trouble than enough.

When the Yorks were going to four Bns there was all sorts of bright ideas floating around about the best way to do it. Three HQ Coys and 13 Rifle Coys need to expand to 4 HQs and 16 Rifle Coys. Unfortunately all sorts interested parties came crawling out from under rocks remembering when town A had supplied a Bn Hq and rifle coy. Huge amounts of lobbying went on from people who would have been better employed looking at photos of the good old days.

A solution was worked out by the Regular Army which looked to everyone as possibly the worst one available (unless they were getting the Yorks ready to be carved up for Christmas). At the very last minute a member of the House of Lords Defence committee, insisted that the 1st Bn which was to recruit predominately in North Yorks and Cleveland should have the title 1Yorks and Cleveland, whilst the rest of the Regiment would be Yorks. Amazingly not only did the MOD agree they agreed without reference to the Regt.

To say there was an outbreak of hellish indignation would be an understatement. Senior officers were lobbied at every occassion (Director TA and Cadets at a Q&A session at a JDSC9(v) started the session by stating that any officer that mentioned 1Y&C would be thrown out), and GOC 2Div once asked one of the Coy Comdrs what he thought of the new name and was told "Not very much but it doesn't matter as we don't intend to use it",

By the time the new Bn was actually formed in November 87, the MOD saw sense/got fed up of arguing, and the official title of the Bn was 1st Bn Yorkshire Volunteers (Cleveland). I cannot recall anyone ever using the bracketed Cleveland bit and the shortened form was 1 YORKS. Certainly checking documents from that period the CO was writing to people on notepaper headed Yorkshire Volunteers, without any reference to Cleveland.

It was never ever referred to as 1Y&C except by the peer whose bright idea it was.

Cleveland county has no thankfully gone to that particular place in history that holds all the bad ideas. All that's left is Cleveland Constabulary and the Lord Lieutenant.
Do you reckon they would have got there in time? I remember the training wing briefs and it's more than likely we would've been wiped off the map before you could have arrived. Maybe held Norway / Turkey on the flanks thoughh.


another one with odd role and title may be wrong, not sure who the Bn came under
8QF - Nuclear Escort & Protection
How many men could we have deployed in total if the Warsaw Pact had attacked all out with conventional forces; Regular Army, TA and ex soldiers called back to the colours?


Book Reviewer
The Wessex regt had a role as well, dont know if it was 1st or 2nd bn though, way before my time.


dave_swimminton said:
Do you reckon they would have got there in time?
Well I would have got there, unless the plane got shot down. I had the only airportable FFR in 8(Y)LI. I remember the plans, 2 reg Divs forward, another regular one behind and 2 Div to mop up what had broken through 3 regular divisions.......

What Sigs units were assigned to these formations, I understand that 64 Sig Sqn became 15 Bde Sig Sqn as did 46 Sig Sqn for 49 (Polar) Bde (all part of 38 Sigs Regt) but I'm sure that happened after 2 Div got broken up.

Wasn't it some ropey looking Scouse Sigs? Was not impressed with the RLD dets I had to work with in BG HQ, seemed a little apprehensive about having to work with the infantry.
For many years 1 Yorks RLD were a scouse sigs sqn (55 rings a bell but it was a long time ago). Good Sqn, good blokes and very competent.
chrisg46 said:
The Wessex regt had a role as well, dont know if it was 1st or 2nd bn though, way before my time.
1 Wessex were part of 1 Inf Bde (as it was then), the role of which was to deploy as part of the United Kingdom Mobile Force (UKMF) to Denmark should 3(?) Shock Army ever come over the IGB.

Not 1 Wessex myself but had a mate in it, I was in 43 (Wessex) Sig Sqn (V) which was then part of 37 (Wessex & Welsh) Sig Regt (V). Sorry for going off thread slightly but this has transported me back 20 odd years. So many memories - a different world.

The mobilisation plans were pretty comprehensive and thorough. No need to go into detail here. Having been the Bn mobilisation officer in 1989 and then going through Chilwell in 2003 I was disappointed that a fully funded and practised organisation appeared to be below the standard which we aspired to in the 80's. I have been assured that Chilwell is more competent now.
That would certainly fit in with the whole 'thowing the baby out with the bath-water' concept that successive Governments adopted when the Cold War ended: 'No need for any of THIS stuff anymore, rip it up and start again'.
Peeler don't know why you want the information, nor indeed what is or isn't still secret.


War Hero
px4llp said:
Sure 4 PARA was 15 INF Bde at the time...
Nope, the lack of a 2nd airborne bde was recognised ca 1987-8 and the "Parachute Regiment Group" was created to componsate. "Bde" HQ was based around RHQ Para, and 4, 10 and 15 Para with a lack of arty etc.

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