TA - are most of you just wasting your time ?

Discussion in 'Army Reserve' started by greenspot, Jan 6, 2003.

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  1. now now MG, there was no need for abuse, greenspot has asked a valid question and deserves to be answered in a grown up manner.

    {edited by Humph}
     
  2. Seconded......(MG's original post that is) ;D

    If the MOD see fit to have an organisation of "Militia" ready to fill in gaps in manpower etc, then who am I to argue.

    Though it feels like a waste of time when you're watching hexi-telly in an OP near farm 13, the people you're with, and feeling like you do a worthwhile job, that sets you apart from the rest of Civ Div makes up for it.

    What's your point GreenSpot?
     
  3. PTP (and MG Gunner...whose original post I didn't see) - go and see the thread on the Current Affairs board...there is the start of a debate there about the structure and role of the TA....

    It might be one thing to feel as if you are doing a worthwhile job - but perhaps you should ask yourself the question whether you really are.   That is NOT a personal criticism of you, or anyone else in the TA; just a suggestion that some honest self-aware thought might be in order in some parts of the organisation.  I may be wrong - but I suspect that some bits of the TA have been given roles for which they will never be fit.  Is that a good use of resources....resources that could be redeployed to units that do make sense....
     
  4. Disillusioned

    Know the feeling, been there and done that.

    My position, is slightly different to yours, in that I sacrificed a career for the honour of the Wedgeiment, but that's another story.

    When I was on recruit training, I was also working in Germany,which meant having to leave Gutersloh early doors friday morning, to be at the TAC for the off on Friday night.

    Surprisingly enough, the waste of space arschloch officer in charge of recruits at the time, questiioned my motivation for being in. My motivation was a family history in the regiment, but I think that wound him up even more. I was subjected to a shedload of abuse, by him and his gang of "old style" recruit trainers,including being made to stand to attention in the rain for an hour and a half, in full CeFO with bergan on, for the crime of being late for an RV at Dixies corner, having driven from germany the previous night.

    I felt like giving up a lot of times, but I just thought "You'll never fcuking beat me you fat drongo".

    Getting the budgie, and reading my course report were among the prodest moments of my life, but not quite as wonderful as seeing the look on the TNUC's face, when I passed into the Company proper.

    That's the background....

    The TA , is full of hurry up and wait. Promotion and advancement are difficult, especially since SDR, and a lack of courses, unless you want to do JNCO cadre, Junior and Senior Brecon, or whatever your unit equivalent is.

    You just have to hang in there, unless you feel, that your original choice is not for you. Don't be afraid to jump ship, if you feel you'd fit in better elsewhere. Conversely, don't be afraid to push yourself forward. I'm suffering from a lack of self-confidence in my military life right now, and it's hacking me off, because I need to get a grip.

    Yes, sometimes it feels like Groundhog day, a lot of the time it feels unfair, but you must persevere. Look at the options open to you. Have you done JNCO's yet? Push yourself forward, because in my experience, especially since SDR, no other bugger is going to do it 4 you. Don't give up, you may be better than you believe, don't do as I do disillusioned, etc etc etc

    Best of luck, if you want to chat in depth, PM me off board, I'll see what I can advise

    Best regards

    PTP
     
  5. Mr Happy

    Mr Happy LE Moderator

    I believe that I'm wasting my time.  

    If the cost of call up for me puts me outside the govt.s range of acceptable costing then shouldn't I be leaving?

    Willing to volunteer but reference mortgage etc I need to be met half way here and if this is still outside the governments banding then I must be wasting my time and would like my weekends back now please.

    Roughly my mortgage is twice my Mil salary so we're looking at 2.5 - 3 x my mil salary to get me out on the ground.  As I've said - I suspect I'm wasting my time.
     
  6. My list of 10 most useful TA Units:

    RAC (Yeomanry)
    RA
    RE
    Inf
    RSigs
    REME
    RLC
    AGC
    AAC
    SAS
     
  7. I have to say that joining the TA was one of the best things I ever did. I have made many great new friends, get a welcome break away from work and the family, learn skills I could never otherwise do (from trade courses to skills to even giving presentations), and keep very fit.

    Added to this much of my unit has already been mobilised in the last year and no doubt many more of us are yet to. I think that makes us a very useful addition to the national defence overall.

    Having said that I had problems initially during the CMS phase because the ex reg training staff (PSIs) and some of the SNCOs that had been in a while didn't give a toss. In fact most dissppointed with PSIs' attitudes generally. Once through it though it has been onwards and upwards.

    As mentioned above I would stick with one of the 'trade based' units though as opposed to infantry

    ....and yes I earn far more than my Mil salary and just had to realise that I had to deal with it under mobilisation or leave. I think that is reasonable.
     
  8. it would seem to me that you lot really do need to get a decent set of PSI's ffs :(

    i cant honestly fathom how a SNCO sent from a regular unit to train the TA could give anything less than 100% in the job, i love it to bits and enjoy working wit hthe TA guys i administer, if there training is worthwhile and rewarding and they go away smiling and having learnt something then my job is done and i am chuffed to bits.

    Sadly i know it isnt the case and more often than not these days people tend to get lazy in their jobs, but having never paid for a Beer in my Troop bar in 2 years of being a PSI i imagine i am doing something right :D

    It really is a shame that you have landed PSI's that arent throwing themselves int othe job 100% i am sure if they pulled their fingers out and tried to get rid of the "me me me " attitude they would actually find it rewarding and realise they got paid for doing their job and not keeping their feet on the desk.

    Dont lose faith in it guys, the TA for the most part do a more important job in the grand scheme of things than some of you obviously realise.
     
  9. Given that several PSIs have (not doubt with reason) been criticised of late, just felt the need to point out that I've never had any major probs in that area. Our PSI left recently - on promotion - and we're all confident that the new PSI will maintain the same standards of professionalism and enthusiasm.  

    Any would be TA recruit reading these posts shouldn't allow the (not huge) possibility of an indifferent PSI to put him/her off.

    Any would be PSI reading this should remember that we're not stupid, we know when someone doesn't give a damn,  but we really do appreciate the efforts made by a genuinely enthusiastic PSI. (See LP's post re mothballing his wallet  :) )
     
  10. having watched this post develop i am very pissed of 1.with the arabs(arrogant regular army bastards) and 2.with the powers that be with in the TA and MOD who really have allowed this to develop.

    ARABS first with the retention crisis in the army who the hell do you think you are gobbing of at the people who stop you doing back to back Bosnia/Kosovo/Afganistan tours a third of troops in thease theaters are TA/Reserves. You complain about how they aren't well trained well remember you train for 11 months of the year  they train for 30days maximum. You treat us as second class citizens well your average TA soldier is more inteligent than you better motivated and more eficient than you. Why is he better motivated and more efficient he has to sort out his training time and fit it in round his work and his family comitments(yes we have those to). You simply role into work at the time your told with the kit your told to be in and get on the truck. No worrying about getting time of work or going in on monday after a weekend training and not getting additional days off. Whilst the regulars moan and gurn if they're asked to work at weekends.
    As for the powers that be where is the extra resources promisied with SDR and options for change all i've seen is cuts in MTD'S &  training resources. Thirty MTD'S is ridiculous yes any more and we become part time employees with rights. You are expecting us to do more to pull the regular army out of the smelly stuff with alot less than is required.

    AS to a list of 10 units that are of use to the ARMY:
    1: Army medical services 2/3 of the total strength is TA.
    2. Royal Logistic Corps
    3. Royal Signals
    4. N.B.C elements of Yeomanry
    5.Royal Engineers
    6.Royal Military Police
    7.Inteligence Corps
    8.SAS
    9.watch keepers pool
    10.media ops pool
     
  11. Nurse,

    This isn't really about ARABS - though they exist. In a way I share exactly your sentiments. In other words, if your allowance is only 35 days a year (or whatever) then how can the TA ever hope to come up to scratch ?  In my book, it can't.  Who knows if there is going to be a war in the Gulf - but if there is, what are the odds on the time between mobilisation and the war being longer than the readiness level of most of the TA ? Slim I would think.

    So what IS the point ?  Aren't most of you wasting your time, if you are in units with very low readiness and not enough training ?  I actually think your list is a very good stab (no pun intended) at what is worthwhile; I would have written a similar list - though the watchkeepers and especially the media ops I would put closer to the top of the list since te latter are specialists you need a lot of occasionally and who make sense to be civilian experts brought in from outside.  I think I would add the civil affairs people high on that list too.

    Sack the rest; they're a waste of money. Inf ?  Artillery ?  They will NEVER be used. If you have to keep any, keep a small increment of Inf to backfill with FTRS.

    Perhaps the current exercise will cause some people in both the Regular Army and TA to take an honest look at what genuinely is useful. Forget cap-badges and history, and structure the organisation so the little jam there is isn't spread thin on regiments with roles that really hark back to the cold war - so the units that do make the grade - the ones on your list Nurse - are properly supported.
     
  12. The plans for the TA at options for change and SDR where specifically about making the T.A. a useable asset to the regular army the emphesis in the original planning was TA to take on a more logistic and support element role. But politicans intervened to 'save' local infantry and yeomanry units. Most of the Royal artillery is now provide inividual reinforcements. 103 re-roled to light gun last year giving the army a 3rd light gun regt(although i doubt it'd be used as such). The infantry are ment to be guard force for supply areas hospitals etc bt they still beleive they are a front line force.
    But the real problem is lack of training and resources the TA need to go back to the MTD levels that existed when I first joined like 100+ days. Units need to be properley equipped. We need access to ranges and trianing areas not helped by block booking by the regulars who know they won't A. use it or B. use it at weekends. The TA also has to loose the chip on its shoulder and realise that in some areas we are as good  as the regulars and in some areas better but also remember we in many areas we are not so good. And the regulars need to help us to improve.
    In my meetings with the regular army I 've met some who to be honest are in for a very nasty shock when they leave the army and many who I know couldn't do what I've done for the last 17 years.
    The T.A is a support arm to the regular army not seperate from it and IMHO should be completley integrated not kept seperate and should have to work along side the regular army regularly that would mean the regular army having to work weekends sometimes and the TA having to adopt a more professional outlook.
     
  13. TO ALL THE STABS

    YOU ARE A WASTE OF MONEY AND EQUIPMENT THAT COULD BE PUT TO BETTER USE IN THE REGULAR ARMY
    I WISH I COULD GET TAX FREE BOUNTYS WE DO GET BOUNTYS BUT THE SMALL PRINT AT THE BOTTOM SAY WE GET TAXED.NOW THERE IS A CALL UP OF TA AND RESERVE PERSONAL FOR A POSSIBLE WAR YOU ARE ALL CRYING ABOUT YOUR JOBS AND FAMILYS. ALL THE TA DO IS TURN UP TO THE SO CALLED TRAINING NIGHTS PLAY A LITTLE SPORT THEN GET DRUNK IN THE BAR WHEN THEY DO GO ON A TOUR YES YET AGAIN ON THE PROMISE OF MORE MONEY THIER TRAINING IS THAT OF A RECRUIT WHO HAS JUST WALKED THROUGH THE GATES OF A TRAINING CAMP.SO LADS COME AND JOIN THE REAL ARMY WERE WE ARE AWAY MOST OF THE YEAR ON TOURS AND EXERCISE HAVE TO WORK WITH BROKEN DOWN VEHICLES BECAUSE THE TA GET ALL THE SPARES HAVE NO PROPER UNIFORM TO WEAR BECAUSE THE TA GET IT ALL.TO SAME OF US THE ARMY IS NOT JUST A JOB IT IS OUR LIFE TO YOU IT IS JUST A HOBBY
     
  14. The fact is the regular army needs the TA and Regular Reserves because there is a lack of manpower and skills in certain areas.

    Yes, there are a few whingers about, complaining about being mobilised but the vast majority who are being called up are reorganising their lives at short notice to go and do their duty (7 days is not very long to sort out cover at work, make arrangements for your family and deal with all the admin from putting your normal life on hold for a year) .

    The level of training and readinesss is often a significant issues - this is more likely to be due to lack of proper investment in training not a reflection of the people who give up their limited free time to train at weekends and during their annual holiday from their civvie job.

    It's government policy and lack of investment that has led to the current state of affairs in the British Army - don't go taking it out on the TA with misguided and generalised comments. Just remember, you may be relying on a TA medic to save your life one day when you're been brought into a field hospital or on the  TA RLC to get your supplies in.