Syria

I understand everything (and even without your hints).
It looks as you don't understand some essential details.
A year ago 59 cruise missiled that hit Syrian air base were a surprise for Russian military command. Now the situation is different. A year is sufficient time period to prepare. Warships unlikely would approach Syrian shore too close. Approximate route is known - through Lebanon, under cover of Lebanese mountains. 'Most likely' this time some cruise missiles could be downed this or that way.
Of course and I reiterate once again "if you don't think those scenarios have been thought of, I give you more credit than you deserve "

As for it being a 'surprise', the Russians had warnings and could have used their S-400s etc. If it was a 'surprise' it also means your assets weren't keeping a track on US naval assets in the E Med. In effect, I think you're talking pony again
 
Of course and I reiterate once again "if you don't think those scenarios have been thought of, I give you more credit than you deserve "

As for it being a 'surprise', the Russians had warnings and could have used their S-400s etc. If it was a 'surprise' it also means your assets weren't keeping a track on US naval assets in the E Med. In effect, I think you're talking pony again
Sometimes I think that they in Washington first act and only then begin to think (if they have anything in their heads with this functionality).
 
Sometimes I think that they in Washington first act and only then begin to think (if they have anything in their heads with this functionality).
Your 'surpise' bit is rather misleading as you and the agitprop continually told us the Russian defences in Syria were to stop attacks by outside forces. Yet, when the time came they didn't. Same when the SAAF jet was shot down. Same when your mercenaries were defeated. Warnings given and action happens.

I don't think you can say Washington acts first, without thinking about what happens in order for that action to take place. Russia guaranteed Syria had got rid of all of its CW. The JIM said they hadn't and used it. Accordingly, Russia vetoes the JIM findings, its renewal three times and again last night its re-introduction.

The West has two choices (with a few bits inbetween). Ignore Assad's govt's use of CW, so we may as well rip up the CW treaty. Or take action against those assets which are using, storing, delivering and controlling the CW use. The UN won't allow the latter or investigations because of Russian vetoes.

Assad's govt and their supporters have put the West in this position. Nobody else. To ignore, or to take unilateral action. Whatever happens, your agitprop, 'useful idiots', troll farms, Russophiles and conspiraloons will pounce on the decision.

I may have mentioned the Information War a few times previously.
 
I know, it shows your double standards.

Everything is pro Russia/PRC/DPRK. Everything is anti 'the West'

A lot of people think it was illegal. I await the Hague verdict, but I'd rather see Vlad in there first personally.
That's probably as the west is the malicious protagonist more often than not.
There are patterns at play on everyone of these events.
A favorite slogan for the last 20yrs+ has been 'why won't you think of the poor babies and civilians'?

Deception on Capitol Hill
If the Libyan war was about saving lives, it was a catastrophic failure | Seumas Milne

Why would you want to see Vlad in DH?
Because he supports his strategic partner over US interference and smashed the US proxy in theatre??
Russia 'saved Syria as a state', says Putin during Assad meeting

Then there's the gas pipeline that's been green-lit too.
In fact 80 per cent of the gas that Russian state-controlled company Gazprom produces is sold to Europe, so maintaining this crucial market is very important.
The one thing we’ve all missed in Syrian conflict
Russian resolve: Why Syria matters to Putin
Now, what's the bet that the Russians and Syrians would have only accepted non-dollar payments for the gas?
Yuan? Gold? Something else non USD?
Europe would be at the mercy of the enemies of western govts in that case.

The US and European countries (who would otherwise have to pay handsomely for natural gas) are chomping at the bit, wanting to bomb Syria back to the stone-age then you have the Chinese ol/gold/petro yuan scenario also in the mix.
More oil and not a $ going down-range, it's all in their own new petro yuan...all converted into gold.
Then you have all the gold that Russia is sat on which will only increase as the PRC buy more of their oil, Ru is the one of the largest oil exporters on the planet, China is it's main-buyer.
A problem for the US because if KSA move over to the Chinese petro yuan-(convertible to gold if desired) then the US will have serious, serious problems on it's hands.
China will 'compel' Saudi Arabia to trade oil in yuan — and that's going to affect the US dollar

Why wouldn't they all go to war over a multitude of false pretences?
It's happened many times in recent years.
They did it in Iraq and Libya when they tried to get away from USD for their oil.
Iraq nets handsome profit by dumping dollar for euro
Hillary Emails Reveal True Motive for Libya Intervention | Foreign Policy Journal
And it's more often than not the west that starts the ball rolling.

I said that Salisbury was a pretext/trigger to hit Ru and I was right.
(Is it just me or has that ridiculous story fallen off the planet now?)

Hence why I'm not a massive fan of western govts.

I'm sure most of the world would rather see GWB and the grand-lizard Bliar in prison before Vlad anyway..
How's that for pro-western?
 
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That's probably as the west is the malicious protagonist more often than not.
There are patterns at play on everyone of these events.
A favorite slogan for the last 20yrs+ has been 'why won't you think of the poor babies and civilians'?

Deception on Capitol Hill
If the Libyan war was about saving lives, it was a catastrophic failure | Seumas Milne

Why would you want to see Vlad in DH?
Because he supports his strategic partner over US interference and smashed the US proxy in theatre??
Russia 'saved Syria as a state', says Putin during Assad meeting

Then there's the gas pipeline that's been green-lit too.
In fact 80 per cent of the gas that Russian state-controlled company Gazprom produces is sold to Europe, so maintaining this crucial market is very important.
The one thing we’ve all missed in Syrian conflict
Russian resolve: Why Syria matters to Putin
Now, what's the bet that the Russians and Syrians would have only accepted non-dollar payments for the gas?
Euro? Yuan? Gold?
Europe would be at the mercy of the enemies of western govts in that case.

The US and European countries (who would otherwise have to pay handsomely for natural gas) are chomping at the bit, wanting to bomb Syria back to the stone-age then you have the Chinese scenario also in the mix.
More oil and not a $ going down-range, it's all in their own new petro yuan...or gold.

Why wouldn't they all go to war over a multitude of false pretences?
It's happened many times in recent years.
And it's more often than not the west that starts the ball rolling.
Hence why I'm not a massive fan.

I'm sure most of the world would rather see GWB and the grand-lizard Bliar in prison before Vlad anyway..
How's that for pro-western?
Debating with you is a bit like banging your head against a 'wailing wall' (SWIDT?).

You continually post agitprop and links to conspiracy theory sites.

You 're-set' yourself at every argument, pushing the same lines of 'the West' is bad and 'Russia/PRC/DPRK as good' every day despite the rebuttals.

You fail to acknowledge when you are wrong and the next day, post the same incorrect information.

You're a racist, walting, 'useful idiot', conspiraloon who contributes the sum total of zero, in fact a negative, to the site.

You pretend to have served, but your 'zoot suits' analogy and other failings show you are in fact a Walter Mitty character. You pretended to be a UK citizen, but we know you reside in Australia.

You whine like a stuck pig at being RoP'd or banned for your racist comments or conspiracy inadequacies.

You think the following are conspiracy theories (there's probably more but I haven't picked up on them yet):
Holocaust
9/11
Westminster Bridge
Parson's Green
Salisbury

Seriously, step away from the keyboard and get help. It's not too late: SANE Australia
 
Yes, US/UK/French navies could be located on safe distances from Syrian Bastion missiles. But British bases on Cyprus can not be relocated so easily.
Oh look, a stuck record. ;)
We've been here before and you said the same last time............before the West used cruise missiles against Syria with no come back.
The Russians are now saying that Russia will shoot down any incoming missiles...........it didnt manage to do that within the last seven days so won't if any future attacks are made.

You are saying Russia won't directly attack US forces but Russia are threatening to attack US ships!

Are Russian airbases easier to relocate that the RAF station on Cyprus...........just asking :)

With regard to your point (again) that Russian will not directly attack US forces, don't forget your idea about bombing KSA that has US forces and civilians in quite large numbers.

Why not stop your silly rhetoric as it keeps getting proven completely wrong. Maybe you would seem more credible if you were posting to support the OPCW being brought in to Syria to investigate possible CW attacks, there is NO SECRET that you think this is the correct and only way to move forward..............you have been saying how important OPCW involvement is page after page after page on an other thread :)
 
That's probably as the west is the malicious protagonist more often than not.
There are patterns at play on everyone of these events.
A favorite slogan for the last 20yrs+ has been 'why won't you think of the poor babies and civilians'?

Deception on Capitol Hill
If the Libyan war was about saving lives, it was a catastrophic failure | Seumas Milne

Why would you want to see Vlad in DH?
Because he supports his strategic partner over US interference and smashed the US proxy in theatre??
Russia 'saved Syria as a state', says Putin during Assad meeting

Then there's the gas pipeline that's been green-lit too.
In fact 80 per cent of the gas that Russian state-controlled company Gazprom produces is sold to Europe, so maintaining this crucial market is very important.
The one thing we’ve all missed in Syrian conflict
Russian resolve: Why Syria matters to Putin
Now, what's the bet that the Russians and Syrians would have only accepted non-dollar payments for the gas?
Euro? Yuan? Gold?
Europe would be at the mercy of the enemies of western govts in that case.

The US and European countries (who would otherwise have to pay handsomely for natural gas) are chomping at the bit, wanting to bomb Syria back to the stone-age then you have the Chinese scenario also in the mix.
More oil and not a $ going down-range, it's all in their own new petro yuan...or gold.

Why wouldn't they all go to war over a multitude of false pretences?
It's happened many times in recent years.
And it's more often than not the west that starts the ball rolling.
Hence why I'm not a massive fan.

I'm sure most of the world would rather see GWB and the grand-lizard Bliar in prison before Vlad anyway..
How's that for pro-western?
Could you please explain how the US, a country that exports gas, would benefit from lower gas prices if an imaginary gas pipeline were to be built from Qatar through Syria to Turkey?
In fact, there is already an oil pipeline running from Bahrain through Iraq to Turkey. If a gas pipeline is required, the simplest, cheapest and quickest way to build one is to run it next to the oil pipeline.

It seems to me that people have been scrabbling around trying to find alternative reasons for this civil war because they don't like to simplest, most obvious reason - the Syrian people were fed up of being murdered, gassed and oppressed by the al-Assad dynasty.
 
I understand everything (and even without your hints).
It looks as you don't understand some essential details.
A year ago 59 cruise missiled that hit Syrian air base were a surprise for Russian military command. Now the situation is different. A year is sufficient time period to prepare. Warships unlikely would approach Syrian shore too close. Approximate route is known - through Lebanon, under cover of Lebanese mountains. 'Most likely' this time some cruise missiles could be downed this or that way.
Just a hint ;)
The cruise missiles weren't a surprise. Trump phoned Vlad in advance, just thought I'd correct you as you seem to have forgotten.

The attack within the last seven days that the S400s had a partial success against was a surprise.

Why do you keep talking about surface ships, is it to make you feel better?
You know just as much as I do that the surface ships don't have to play any part in any attack and that subs can launch any cruise missiles heading towards Syria.
Are you perhaps saying Russia would risk a far far bigger conflict by attacking USN ships who had taken no part in any attacks?
 
Could you please explain how the US, a country that exports gas, would benefit from lower gas prices if an imaginary gas pipeline were to be built from Qatar through Syria to Turkey?
In fact, there is already an oil pipeline running from Bahrain through Iraq to Turkey. If a gas pipeline is required, the simplest, cheapest and quickest way to build one is to run it next to the oil pipeline.

It seems to me that people have been scrabbling around trying to find alternative reasons for this civil war because they don't like to simplest, most obvious reason - the Syrian people were fed up of being murdered, gassed and oppressed by the al-Assad dynasty.
It's all about control, that's why saddam and Gaddafi were removed.
If one gets away with changing from US petro$ they're all going to want to getaway from the petro$.
The US$ is just worthless bits of paper.
China are offering actual gold for oil.
And as for your last sentence?
You aren't aware of much if you think that it's all about killing civvies and babies (just like the Gaddafi scam).
 
It's all about control, that's why saddam and Gaddafi were removed.
If one gets away with changing from US petro$ they're all going to want to getaway from the petro$.
The US$ is just worthless bits of paper.
China are offering actual gold for oil.
And as for your last sentence?
You aren't aware of much if you think that it's all about killing civvies and babies (just like the Gaddafi scam
Debating with you is a bit like banging your head against a 'wailing wall' (SWIDT?).

You continually post agitprop and links to conspiracy theory sites.

You 're-set' yourself at every argument, pushing the same lines of 'the West' is bad and 'Russia/PRC/DPRK as good' every day despite the rebuttals.

You fail to acknowledge when you are wrong and the next day, post the same incorrect information.

You're a racist, walting, 'useful idiot', conspiraloon who contributes the sum total of zero, in fact a negative, to the site.

You pretend to have served, but your 'zoot suits' analogy and other failings show you are in fact a Walter Mitty character. You pretended to be a UK citizen, but we know you reside in Australia.

You whine like a stuck pig at being RoP'd or banned for your racist comments or conspiracy inadequacies.

You think the following are conspiracy theories (there's probably more but I haven't picked up on them yet):
Holocaust
9/11
Westminster Bridge
Parson's Green
Salisbury

Seriously, step away from the keyboard and get help. It's not too late: SANE Australia
 
It's all about control, that's why saddam and Gaddafi were removed.
Right. Saddam was removed, therefore the pipeline route through Iraq would be secure. So the alternative "theory" is: "we have a secure route, so let's start a fight next door".
What part of that makes sense.

If one gets away with changing from US petro$ they're all going to want to getaway from the petro$.
The US$ is just worthless bits of paper.
China are offering actual gold for oil.
I take it this is one of your little distraction tactics. Throw some other random, controversial statements into the mix to muddy the waters.

And as for your last sentence?
You aren't aware of much if you think that it's all about killing civvies and babies (just like the Gaddafi scam).
Yeah, that convinces me. Just like the "clever" memes you through in. How about some of that much vaunted evidence you always bang on about?
 
Russia warns any U.S. missiles fired at Syria will be shot down
Russia has upped the rhetoric. Whether they will intercept any missiles (as does whether the West fires any) remains to be seen. Not that KGB collective have had a brief :rolleyes: , but mention is also made of the launchers:
“If there is a strike by the Americans, then ... the missiles will be downed and even the sources from which the missiles were fired,” Alexander Zasypkin, the Russian ambassador in Beirut, told Hezbollah’s al-Manar TV, speaking in Arabic.

He said he was referring to a statement by Russian President Vladimir Putin and the Russian armed forces chief of staff.

The Russian military said on March 13 that it would respond to any U.S. strike on Syria by targeting any missiles and launchers involved. Russia is Assad’s most powerful ally and its devastating air power has helped him wrest back large swathes of territory from rebels since 2015.
Doubleplusgood doublethink. They're also saying that the US and Russia won't clash over Syria. They want to hold negotiations. Yet they veto the renewal and re-instigation of the very mechanism which proves Assad's govt are using CW:
The Russian military said on March 13 that it would respond to any U.S. strike on Syria by targeting any missiles and launchers involved. Russia is Assad’s most powerful ally and its devastating air power has helped him wrest back large swathes of territory from rebels since 2015.

Zasypkin also said a clash between Russia and the United States over Syria “should be ruled out and therefore we are ready to hold negotiations”.

Earlier in the week, Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Mikhail Bogdanov said there was no threat of the situation in Syria spiralling into U.S.-Russian hostilities. TASS news agency quoted him as saying he believed common sense would prevail.
OPCW have asked for arrangements to be made for their reception. Russia has already said their teams have investigated and found no trace of CW. Russia have already denounced CW findings by OPCW FFMs. Russia has already said that they won't respect the findings of OPCW on the Salisbury incident. Some more Doubleplusgood doublethink.:
The Hague-based Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons said Assad’s government had been asked to make necessary arrangements for an OPCW investigation team to visit shortly.

The mission will aim to determine whether banned munitions were used but not assign blame.

The Assad government and Russia both urged the OPCW to investigate the allegations, a move by the two countries that was apparently aimed at averting any U.S.-led military action.
 
Right. Saddam was removed, therefore the pipeline route through Iraq would be secure. So the alternative "theory" is: "we have a secure route, so let's start a fight next door".
What part of that makes sense.
Did you click on the linky?
My posts only make sense if you look at the links and the usually very plausible endroits from which they hail.
There was no pipeline proj in Iraq back in the day and the invasion had nothing to do with a pipeline either although the Kuwaitis had almost finished construction of one from KWT to the Rumaila oilfields back in 03 before the invasion.
Saddam sold oil in Euros( for a bit anyway), I was in Baghdad just after we invaded, while the country was burning the CPA changed oil sales back to $... The country continued to burn and still continues to burn.
Gaddafi was this close to launching the gold-backed dinar as currency for his oil, he intended it to go pan-African for all oil sales out of Africa.
Never got launched as he ended up invaded and dead.
I take it this is one of your little distraction tactics. Throw some other random, controversial statements into the mix to muddy the waters.
China and the petro yuan is the big picture.
#petroyuan hashtag on Twitter
It will take away the US's monopoly of oil being traded 99% only in USD.
USD $ that is backed by nothing whereas the PRC system will be backed by yuan convertible to physical gold.
Massive difference between the two, they are polar-opposite.

Syria is another version of Iraq/Libya, configured slightly differently but with the same wrapping paper.
This time it's to get to Russia and China.
Hopefully it won't get that far but the US has always done what it wanted in the past.
Ru/PRC aren't Iraq/Libya by a long chalk.
 
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I was listening to a British spokesman earlier* on the radio and he referenced the Russian claim to not only shoot down any incoming missiles, but to target the launchers. He added that he hoped the Russian (the chap who made the statement) had chosen his words very carefully.
The British spokesman then went on to say that targetting the launchers meant sinking ships or subs and if that happened then 'THAT'S WAR'

Mentioning the 'W' word is pretty serious stuff, and especially so after commenting that he had hoped Russia had chosen its words very carefully!

*I can't remember the British chaps name right now, he was featured on the BBC Radio 5 11am news.
 
I was listening to a British spokesman earlier* on the radio and he referenced the Russian claim to not only shoot down any incoming missiles, but to target the launchers. He added that he hoped the Russian (the chap who made the statement) had chosen his words very carefully.
The British spokesman then went on to say that targetting the launchers meant sinking ships or subs and if that happened then 'THAT'S WAR'

Mentioning the 'W' word is pretty serious stuff, and especially so after commenting that he had hoped Russia had chosen its words very carefully!

*I can't remember the British chaps name right now, he was featured on the BBC Radio 5 11am news.
Not good.
 
Going shopping tonight.. suppose I may just buy tins.

It'll be fun to see how Russia plays it.
 

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