Summer Mountain Leader Trg

Discussion in 'Sports, Adventure Training and Events' started by Cider_Glider, Feb 14, 2007.

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  1. Hopefully this hasnt been covered before, but if it has I apologise!

    Just been informed that I have been sucessful in my bid for the MLT Cse, but in the joining intsructions that i should bring my Logbook to qualify for the civvie qual. Now, I havent got one of those.

    The question I am asking is, is this gonna hinder me in a major way, and if i get there on day one, will they just say 'get back in your car and come back when you have one'? or is it something that can be worked around.

    Hope someone can help.

  2. I would phone them and find out before tipping up only to be told to do one.

    Normal drills for a civ qual is to keep a log book of climbs/walks that you do, and take notes on each one.

    Always good to have proof that you have done what you say you have.
  3. As this is only the training part of the MLS civilian qualification it is not compulsory to have the logbook with the necessary experience before you attend the course as it can be got retrospectively (for a small fee).

    It also cost quite alot of money to join all the necessary organizations.

    (As a side note every one on my MLT course brought logbooks but none were given the award due to lack of experience)
  4. So you can do the course, get the qual but not qualify for the Civvie qual?

    Cheers for the advice tho! Ill rock up and see what happens!
  5. yeah it depends on how they rate your logbook exprience if you don't have the 20 QMDs days then they won't give the civi qual.
  6. Your MLT is exactly what it says on the tin: Mountain Leader Training, once you complete it you will get a nice little sticker in your MLTB(Mountain Leader Training Board) Log book- if you have one! If you don't you will be given the opportunity to register for one and pay for it, it's not much and you need it to ever become qualified because the MLTB are the awarding body for the Mountain Leader summer award ML(S). When you get your book send it back to the training centre and they will retrospectively attach your course report and MLT sticker. You now need to get some experience! however you are qualified to take military personnel 6 of into UK mountain regions that you have previous experience of and within your limits below the snowline. Once you have 42 days experience in the mountains over 2000' in 3 regions including 6 overnight camps you can return to the training centre for an ML(S) assessment, if you pass you will be awarded the ML(S) a civvy award. You can then gain more experience including snow and ice stuff- I would suggest doing some climbing too and apply for the ML(W) winter award. Do it, it's well worth it even if you only keep to the summer stuff- and it's FREE!
  7. Be honest and put down all the days you have done in the past in your new log book !

    Count all days in the hills, monros or mountains.

    I included trips up the Pyg track and other easy routes for the MTL and all the climbing I did years ago to get my JSRL.

    Again be honest, we had a Capt (Inf I think? ) on the JRSL talked the talk and fell off the final climb with bad pro placement.

    Still I did offer to buy his rack from he had no need for it .
  8. To death...Its not a necessity to be registered on the Civvy scheme to attend the JS MLT course and as already stated its a training course, however some do get deferred (A PC Fcuk off tablet) for various reasons ,mainly they are a liability and not up to taking groups outdoors even though they have been trained how to for 5 days they still insist on doing there own thing or being habitually bitten by the mong snake...

    It states in JSP 419 that you should have a minimum of 20 QMD's in a logbook before attending , this however is rarely the case and if it was then the JS centres would have no students, its accepted that service persons don't have the time to achieve these pre requsites due to current hectic times.

    The policy is that no students are ever turned away and its preferred that you turn up with no logbook rather than a copied one from your mates (Integrity)

    The syllabus for the MLT course is roughly as follows:

    Sun, Arrival brief, draw personnel kit .

    Mon, OCs welcome brief, Aims of AT, Weather Lecture, Meet Instructor, Draw Group kit, Put up tents and look at group kit/personnel kit. Local area for intro to nav/ micro nav . Evening lecture Mountain Hazards

    Tue, Weather (May change with Wednesday depending on weather etc) Security on steep ground, roped and un roped. Using only the rope and simple systems to ascend and descend short obstacles, Theory and practical. River Crossing theory and practical. Evening lecture Access and Conservation.

    Wed, Weather (May change with Tuesday depending on weather etc) Quality Mountain Day normally involves walking up a hill/Mountain may practice a few of the SOSG methods if applicable.

    Thu,Weather, Exped deploy for the day and night practising skills taught and exped skills with intro to night Nav and wild camping.

    Fri, Exped do a few more legs of Nav and cover emergency procedures , carries and evacuations. Debrief in Petes eats, back to centre, hand in kit , debrief from Instructor and closing brief by OC. RTU

    Its worth getting out on the ground before you attend an MLT course to hone your fitness, basic navigation concentrating on Direction/Distance and Speed.

    You wont need any kit as its all issued including the maps and scarpa manta boots, Paramo waterproofs. Just bring the kit on the kit list.

    As for registering with the MTLB for the civilian award. You can complete the military MLT course and if you decide you want to get the civilian award you can register after the course submitting your completed logbook (minimum 20 QMDs) and your mil MLT certificate and a covering letter you will then be considered by the civvy ML board for exemption from training and if successful will receive the sticker and endorsement at a small cost.

    The majority of deferrals for exemption from Training on MLT come from just having the bare minimum of QMDs and remember that course time and military type ex's don't count,

    Good luck

    A few relevant links

    Civvy MOUNTAIN LEADER AWARD INCLUDING DEFINITION OF A QMD and registering /exemption from training application info

  9. My Bold

    I don't wish to start a pissing contest however this isn't correct.

    As a military qualified MLT you are only allowed to take 6 on duty service persons on walking routes worldwide that are on ungraded ground that don't require security on steep ground tactics or the use of hands that you have previously completed yourself below the snowline.

    And that your CO is completely happy that you are competent in this task.

    and there is no height definition to qualify as a QMD, although it is expected that you will have some within your logbook.

    If in doubt have a look here at the bottom of the page for QMD definition or ring a JS centre and ask for the duty Jim Queen or Woolly Hatter ...... If they arent all on the sick.
  10. No pissing contest here, what you are saying then is that I was virtually correct, however they appear to have made the whole process somewhat easier in that you can now take the wife, kids and dog for a walk around Dartmoor, Bodmin or the Peak District and claim them as quality mountain days? that's a little worrying! I gained my basic quals (UEL then ML(S), ML(W), SPSA, JSRCI) some time ago (20 years) and have moved on a quite bit since then, I never expected the standard to lower though, I seriously thought they would increase if anything given our modern litigation driven society, but you live and learn, I will however bear that in mind next time I am out with another ML who claims to know what he is doing. :meditate: