Stuff One Man One Vote - Im Tony Blair, I am

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by whiffler, Feb 19, 2007.

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  1. The younger amongst you may not remember the struggle within the Labour Party for One Man One Vote (or OMOV).

    It was brought in because of increasing complaints of votes going against the members, or even against those in a conference hall. A few select people had Card Votes, representing the number of members in their Union. It mattered not that the membership was as divided as those in the hall, all (say) one million members voted the same way.

    In certain cases the individual holding the card vote was given some leeway on how to vote (or abstain), which was often abused somewhat. Occasionally someone even voted against the instructions of the members.

    So, OMOV was a good thing - unless you consider that Tony Blair wouldn't have got in without it.

    .... Enough history ........ back to the future !.

    You'll all be aware of the recent e-petitiion on Road Pricing, and that some 1½ million signed it. Since when the petition has been mocked by the government, those who signed it described as ignorant (not 'understanding'), and generally maligned.

    They are now to be blessed by a response from the Blessed Tony, who will describe to them the errors of their ways, and counsel them to be better citizens. Each and every person will get this email. You lucky people!.

    Once he's done this, Tony will say that he's answered the points made, and people now understand. Effectiveley he's employed his card vote of a million billion gazillion votes of an infinitely better quality than yours, and your cause is lost.

    >

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    Well, not necessarily.

    I sense a second petition coming along. Either a restatement noting (and demolishing) his response or one asking for him to put the issue to Parliament on a free vote - and to make it a motion of confidence. A date should be specified, you might think as early as possible - I couldn't possibly comment.

    I've checked the petition terms and can't see any grounds upon which it could be knocked back.

    There's no point starting the petition yet, Tony's response has yet to be witten by a research student eight years ago and jazzed up .... (sorry, going off on one there).

    Opinions chasps ?.
     
  2. Absolutely. Do it.
     
  3. He really is a cnut.........
    Thats about it, I expect nothing more from the Fuhrer, nothing this man does suprises me.

    Democracy? It must be an outdated concept..........
     
  4. There are a lot of petitions competing for attention there. The one that grabbed my attention was for Spandau Ballet's "Gold" to replace "God Save the Queen" as national anthem
     
  5. Imagine that!!
    Big line of people.....
    You are GOLD, gold............ :D
     
  6. Please focus on the petition in hand, lest ye end up doing Tony's work.
     
  7. Problem is, motions of confidence have a polarising effect when all good sense goes out the window and members vote along party lines to so they don't have to reapply for their jobs again.
     
  8. Granted, but if every Labour MP backs Tony at this stage and on this subject they'll be treading a dangerous path. If Tony really believes he's correct let him make it a MoC.

    As if he will ........ but heaping more shame on him can do no harm and may affect his plans.
     
  9. One man, one vote has been shot to bits, together with so much of the fabric of this nation, by Bliar and his toxic tribe of t*rd stranglers.

    Postal Voting equals one man with a few quid plus one postman in need of a few quid equals goodbye democracy. There are other methods of 'controlling' the postal vote.

    Won't Bliar be satisfied until he has wrecked completely everything in this country?
     
  10. Yes OMOV has suffered at his hands. The response to those having a well-justified moan about the latest EU kerfuffle/scandal/decision is often "why don't you write you your MEP - I bet you don't even know who your MEP is".

    Well, easy answer - no I don't, but I know I have more than one (five or six I believe) and that I can no longer vote for a particular candidate since Bliar fixed it for Party Lists to be used.

    In spite of what he says, Blair has set up this petitions system with the aim of drawing the sting of Joe public, but this could be the best chance of turning it against him.
     
  11. in_the_cheapseats

    in_the_cheapseats LE Moderator

    No - A vote of confidence would be won as even the Labour cynics will realise that they would irreparably damage the Party if they lost. This is not ideologically problematic enough for them to fall on their swords for.

    A second petition would need to be carefully worded to show that being a patronising git and ignoring popular opinion is not what a politician is suppost to do. A timely remainder of what happens if you do would be the "incomplete" Nuclear debate and Greenpeace's win in court last week.

    Saying that the arrogant tosser has already said there that he doesn't care about the court judgement and that nuclear power is going ahead anyway. Thing is, he really doesn't care - he has a days to do attitude which is frankly dangerous to due process.

    I look forward to receiving his e-mail. :plotting:
     
  12. He did it with the ID Card petition too. Just received Bliar's response in my inbox (For those who can't use the hyperlink in previous post, here's the full text):

    "E-petition: Response from the Prime Minister
    The e-petition to "scrap the proposed introduction of ID cards" has now closed. The petition stated that "The introduction of ID cards will not prevent terrorism or crime, as is claimed. It will be yet another indirect tax on all law-abiding citizens of the UK". This is a response from the Prime Minister, Tony Blair.

    The petition calling for the Government to abandon plans for a National ID Scheme attracted almost 28,000 signatures - one of the largest responses since this e-petition service was set up. So I thought I would reply personally to those who signed up, to explain why the Government believes National ID cards, and the National Identity Register needed to make them effective, will help make Britain a safer place.

    The petition disputes the idea that ID cards will help reduce crime or terrorism. While I certainly accept that ID cards will not prevent all terrorist outrages or crime, I believe they will make an important contribution to making our borders more secure, countering fraud, and tackling international crime and terrorism. More importantly, this is also what our security services - who have the task of protecting this country - believe.

    So I would like to explain why I think it would be foolish to ignore the opportunity to use biometrics such as fingerprints to secure our identities. I would also like to discuss some of the claims about costs - particularly the way the cost of an ID card is often inflated by including in estimates the cost of a biometric passport which, it seems certain, all those who want to travel abroad will soon need.

    In contrast to these exaggerated figures, the real benefits for our country and its citizens from ID cards and the National Identity Register, which will contain less information on individuals than the data collected by the average store card, should be delivered for a cost of around £3 a year over its ten-year life.

    But first, it's important to set out why we need to do more to secure our identities and how I believe ID cards will help. We live in a world in which people, money and information are more mobile than ever before. Terrorists and international criminal gangs increasingly exploit this to move undetected across borders and to disappear within countries. Terrorists routinely use multiple identities - up to 50 at a time. Indeed this is an essential part of the way they operate and is specifically taught at Al-Qaeda training camps. One in four criminals also uses a false identity. ID cards which contain biometric recognition details and which are linked to a National Identity Register will make this much more difficult.

    Secure identities will also help us counter the fast-growing problem of identity fraud. This already costs £1.7 billion annually. There is no doubt that building yourself a new and false identity is all too easy at the moment. Forging an ID card and matching biometric record will be much harder.

    I also believe that the National Identity Register will help police bring those guilty of serious crimes to justice. They will be able, for example, to compare the fingerprints found at the scene of some 900,000 unsolved crimes against the information held on the register. Another benefit from biometric technology will be to improve the flow of information between countries on the identity of offenders.

    The National Identity Register will also help improve protection for the vulnerable, enabling more effective and quicker checks on those seeking to work, for example, with children. It should make it much more difficult, as has happened tragically in the past, for people to slip through the net.

    Proper identity management and ID cards also have an important role to play in preventing illegal immigration and illegal working. The effectiveness on the new biometric technology is, in fact, already being seen. In trials using this technology on visa applications at just nine overseas posts, our officials have already uncovered 1,400 people trying illegally to get back into the UK.

    Nor is Britain alone in believing that biometrics offer a massive opportunity to secure our identities. Firms across the world are already using fingerprint or iris recognition for their staff. France, Italy and Spain are among other European countries already planning to add biometrics to their ID cards. Over 50 countries across the world are developing biometric passports, and all EU countries are proposing to include fingerprint biometrics on their passports. The introduction in 2006 of British e-passports incorporating facial image biometrics has meant that British passport holders can continue to visit the United States without a visa. What the National Identity Scheme does is take this opportunity to ensure we maximise the benefits to the UK.

    These then are the ways I believe ID cards can help cut crime and terrorism. I recognise that these arguments will not convince those who oppose a National Identity Scheme on civil liberty grounds. They will, I hope, be reassured by the strict safeguards now in place on the data held on the register and the right for each individual to check it. But I hope it might make those who believe ID cards will be ineffective reconsider their opposition.

    If national ID cards do help us counter crime and terrorism, it is, of course, the law-abiding majority who will benefit and whose own liberties will be protected. This helps explain why, according to the recent authoritative Social Attitudes survey, the majority of people favour compulsory ID cards.

    I am also convinced that there will also be other positive benefits. A national ID card system, for example, will prevent the need, as now, to take a whole range of documents to establish our identity. Over time, they will also help improve access to services.

    The petition also talks about cost. It is true that individuals will have to pay a fee to meet the cost of their ID card in the same way, for example, as they now do for their passports. But I simply don't recognise most claims of the cost of ID cards. In many cases, these estimates deliberately exaggerate the cost of ID cards by adding in the cost of biometric passports. This is both unfair and inaccurate.

    As I have said, it is clear that if we want to travel abroad, we will soon have no choice but to have a biometric passport. We estimate that the cost of biometric passports will account for 70% of the cost of the combined passports/id cards. The additional cost of the ID cards is expected to be less than £30 or £3 a year for their 10-year lifespan. Our aim is to ensure we also make the most of the benefits these biometric advances bring within our borders and in our everyday lives.

    Yours sincerely,

    Tony Blair

    James Hall, the official in charge of delivering the ID card scheme, will be answering questions on line on 5th March. You can put your question to him here http://www.pm.gov.uk/output/Page10969.asp

    To see his last web chat in November 2006, see: http://www.pm.gov.uk/output/Page10364.asp

    Identity and Passport Service
    http://www.ips.gov.uk/

    Home Office Identity Fraud Steering Committee
    http://www.identity-theft.org.uk/"
     
  13. in_the_cheapseats

    in_the_cheapseats LE Moderator

    So in other words,

    Fcuk off, you're all wrong. I'm going to do exactly as I want and can... which is to ignore you. I am, after all, your leader and always right

    And I really believe the security services think this is true, much like the manipulated 45 min WMD claims of pre Iraq invasion justification as well. Incidentally, who does have Campbell's role as the fixer these day? Is it not that woman who has just been interviewed under caution from No 10? Another person to trust, yes?

    If there was any doubt before, there is no longer. He is really is suffering from a Messiah complex.

    Sooner Labour moves him on the better it will be for everyone.

    What a cock . :frown:
     
  14. It might be a fun exercise to indroduce a petition of support for the road pricing policy. That way, Tone can't complain about the the silent masses who support him not exercising their democratic rights. It'll also provide an intereseted basis for comparison.