Strategically beholden some more to Uncle Sam

Discussion in 'Strategic Defence & Spending Review (SDSR)' started by Kromeriz, Sep 10, 2012.

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  1. Grumblegrunt

    Grumblegrunt LE Book Reviewer

    well we knew we were beholden unto their missile and launch tech.

    I bet ours cost a lot more than theirs to build though, because some idiot will insist on it being made here to our design.
     
  2. Quite seriously, what the **** are you talking about. Tell me you professional credentials and prior involvement with the UK SSBN project, then at least your bollocks might have a little bit of credibility.

    I will of course presume any obfuscation in your answer(s) means you are, at best, a civvy who has never stepped foot into HMNB Clyde, AWE Aldermaston, DE&S SM or the Cabinet Office.
     
  3. Bouillabaisse

    Bouillabaisse LE Book Reviewer

    I've been to Barrow in Furness. God help me.
     
  4. That's the point of the Yanks saying what the specs are, they are the same rockets. We don't have to build our boats to the same specs, but if we don't we don't get the nukes...


    Read more: US Navy Signs Specs for Next-Gen SSBN | Navy & Maritime Security News at DefenceTalk

    Not sure about the Navy, but I'd imagine folks like BAe et al may have some say in this sort of thing. Depends who are making parts for ti.
     
  5. Did you escape without making a local girl pregnant?
     
  6. Bouillabaisse

    Bouillabaisse LE Book Reviewer

    As an side, there are common elements of the sub design for both classes that are being done in Britain. Given that the missile size dictates submarine size this is quite sensible. Far more sensible than our current government's rather naive idea that we might design it with the French.
     
  7. So why not a common sub?

    Was it not General Electric or GE Boat (?) who were called in to rectify the Astute programme? And Alfred the Great, I am no submariner, just lived in Barrow and followed the local news at the time.

    Several administrations have vacillated over the Submarine fleet replacement, cutting orders and loosing skills. Hence the Astute debacle not to mention the increased costs.

    Just like we buy trains from the Germans and Transport jets from the Americans, is it about time to save money and to partner the Americans.

    And I am not trolling.
     
  8. He chose Sheep. Millions of em, and willing supplicants.
     
  9. Grumblegrunt

    Grumblegrunt LE Book Reviewer

    oh wind your neck in - we haven't been independant since Macmillan convinced them we had a hydrogen bomb, its all post imperialist bluster - who do you think we are anyway - France?.

    if we hadn't linked hands across the water we would be debating the future ship launched blue streak program and vulcan 6 replacement :) we gave them a slightly better way of making it go bang in time and they gave us everything else except permission to use them. especially as if memory serves we don't own the launch vehicles the yanks do and allways have. all we can do is build the tips to their specs and we cant even do that right*

    * - meaning we haven't enough warheads not that they are faulty, allthough as we will never use them they could fill the nose with baked beans.

    trident replacement is all a vanity thing anyway so we can claim to be a big boy at the top table. the rest of the world has noticed that we have been downgraded to cloakroom attendant of late. nukes are supposed to be the last resort when the conventional option has failed, seeing as we no longer have a conventional option worth mentioning or even statesmen worthy of delivering a convincing ultimatum should we even bother?

    Israel at the moment is causing suitable fuss using its pretty german subs specced to launch nuke tipped cruise. a cheaper option we could maybe look at if we must have the ability to make up for wasting all our defense budget.

    curious as to what the yanks would replace the quietest thing in the water with? there can't be much they could do better except build new ones.

    Been in clyde and holy loch if that helps and several other places linked to the genre albeit 20 odd years ago, I don't see what abbey wood would have to do with anything significant beyond employing too many people better suited for other things and aldermaston is pretty much a foreign owned service depot as far as our deterrent goes since they designed the trident heads back in the 80s basing that on a US design so anything new will be lockheed martin inspired unless serco are going to build it for us. Cabinet office - don't make me laugh, since suez they wont do a thing without permission.

    we did however give the world the first nuclear power station (even if it never fed the grid cos it was too busy making plutonium) and the first major accident and cover up - world leaders in that for years.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. I'd imagine first costs would be a lot cheaper if we just bolted on 6, no 5, no 4, no 3, er 2 subs on to the USN order. But you also have to think about through life costs and upgrades. And would the yanks give us some of their 'tech'? Could we fit British systems (ie sonar) to the Yank hull.
     
  11. GG - the OP misses the point entirely: since we've had a SSBN we've always had a common missile compartment. To proclaim that we are not 'strategically independent' solely because of that simply shows he has little or no idea how the Trident program (or Successor) works.

    And the Cabinet Office have a wider role than you may believe.
     
  12. I can understand the need for the UK to have SSBN'S no problems with that, but what do we need to replace the subs or the missiles ?
    If it is the missiles why not use them up on a few of the countries that hate us.
    Next question if the PM decided the let fly and managed to get all of the UK parts of the launch arrangements to agree to fire the things and they worked as described what could the UN do? After all the yanks did it to the Japs in world war two,after all we are fighting the WAR on terror.
    Would the bloody things work or has Uncle Sam put some secret little abort switch in the missiles?
    I often think what would happen if the Queen asked the CDS over for tea along with Charles & William and she says fuc@ it I have had enough fire the tridents at this small list of unfriendly countries and no CDS I am not daft and i do not give a toss what the pm says both my replacements Agee fire the bloody things would it be a lawful order? And would he do it?
     
  13. Someone has been at the paint thinners early.
     
  14. Paint thinners that's for the RAF reg
    Vodka my boy