Sticking two fingers up and just going

Discussion in 'Army Pay, Claims & JPA' started by KhakiCrab, Oct 26, 2008.

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  1. Folks

    Everyone I work with knows someone, who knows someone, who reckons they know someone who got 'emselves a good employment lawyer, put in six months notice and said, "I'm leaving. Try and stop me and I'll see you in court." Or words to that effect. :lol:

    Now, before I go on I should point out that this is not for me. Neither is it for that euphamistic 'friend'. I'm looking at this from a professional POV, as someone who runs a DCMH and grows tired of the number of patients who end up on our books essentially for no other reason than they see themselves as trapped in the mob - 'being paid to be in open prison', as it was once put to me by one of my patients. Never mind that 'we' make people psychiatrically unwell by sending them to war, 'we' also make people psychiatrically unwell because we allow them to believe they are unable to leave, or at least not for a very, very long time. :evil:

    Anecdotally, we are led to believe that the reason the mob can continue 'enforcing' leaving restrictions that do not stand up to scrutiny in law is simply because the actual legal situation is not widely publicised. Thus the plethora of anecdoatal examples of people who got legal advice and went, quietly and without fuss, because fuss is precisely what the mob are very keen to avoid.

    So, if YOU got out via this route, or you genuinely know someone who did. Let me know.

    Several years ago, one of my senior colleagues (OF5) wrote a paper suggesting we should follow the lead of other NATO partners and allow people a statutory right to leave with 6 months notice. He acknowledged that we would see an initial flood of people 'pulling the yellow-n-black' as we like to say in the airforce, but after that, the evidence from other NATO nations is that it settles down and you are left with either those who do genuinely want to continue to serve, or those that may be unsure, but who at least know that if push came to shove they could be out in 6 months. Our evidence shows that many service personnel PVR because 12-18 months seems like a lifetime to them, so when they are unsure they put the paperwork in just in case. A guaranteed shorter exit time might make them more inclined to stick at it for a bit longer.

    The central problem I am looking at is Temperamental Unsuitability. I guess most people probably know of someone who was, in essence, bullied to join up, bullied into staying in Phase 1, bullied into staying in Phase 2 and now desperately want to leave, but falsely believe that they can't. These folk come to us as TU patients. The Army is (no, seriously) fairly good at dealing with TU. It's the RAF that are bloody useless. As soon as someone goes to the doc and gets sent to see us, the RAF then regards it as a 'medical problem' and, despite the poor sod getting a clean bill of mental health from the psychiatrist, the RAF then refuse to take the TU admin action, because they still think it's a 'medical problem'. :x

    So, any info gratefully appreciated. If you got out on S8 or TU grounds and had trouble getting work because of your 'psych' history, for example, I'd be interested to hear about it. PMs welcome if you don't want to air your dirty washing in public, etc. :wink:
  2. Don't know what the official resettlement answer is (maybe Filbert Fox does) but my understanding is that most people who go out TU get fast tracked to the Job Centre instead of going to CTP.

    The legal position is quite clear. You promise to give the mob 12 months notice and the mob promises to give you the same. Someone who has genuine reasons for being released sooner usually will be (at least from the army - can't speak for the RN or RAF). Putting it bluntly, we've no room for wasters (whatever the reason for their being that may be).
  3. Under EU working law you are only obliged to give 1 pay periods notice (for us read one month) and employers under law can only expect a return of service equal to the amount of time spent training you. I know of a close friend who challenged this and they (MCM Div) caved at the mention of lawyers.
  4. The same person perhaps?
  5. As HM Armed Forces are exempt from Employment Rights Act, well, the good bits anyway, quoting 'Europe' to try and get out quick is likely to fall on very deaf ears...
  6. Well one of you is telling porkies...
  7. diplomat

    diplomat War Hero Book Reviewer

    But not a test case that the MOD would particularly like to try and defend in court. This is, I believe, why individuals quoting this 'right' have been allowed to leave quietly once they have mentioned obtaining legal advice.

    How this stands with the 'warned for operations' aspect of leaving the forces I do not know. I assume that in such circumstances MOD would have to fight a test case in court.
  8. If it is true they should really be preparing for a flood of people wanting out as soon as they have read this.