Stealth jets fight Daesh in first combat missions from HMS Queen Elizabeth

Charles1948

Old-Salt
Daesh is a very weak opponent. It hasn't got any aircraft or submarines to attack the HMS Queen Elizabeth.

Wouldn't a stronger opponent, such as Russia, ensure that the HMS QE gets sunk on the first day of war?

This reminds me of imperialist attitudes adopted by Britain, in WW2. Such as, our big British battleships will defeat Japan, by sailing to Singapore. There our Naval power will prevail!

Unfortunately, our ships got sunk by the Japanese Air Force.

What lessons do we draw from this?
 
With its fifth generation capabilities, including outstanding situational awareness, the F-35B is the ideal aircraft to deliver precision strikes, which is exactly the kind of mission that 617 Squadron has been training for day-after-day, night-after-night, for these past few months.
This is also notable as the first combat mission flown by US aircraft from a foreign carrier since HMS Victorious in the South Pacific in 1943. The level of integration between Royal Navy, Royal Air Force and US Marine Corps is truly seamless, and testament to how close we’ve become since we first embarked together last October.
 
Daesh is a very weak opponent. It hasn't got any aircraft or submarines to attack the HMS Queen Elizabeth.

Wouldn't a stronger opponent, such as Russia, ensure that the HMS QE gets sunk on the first day of war?

This reminds me of imperialist attitudes adopted by Britain, in WW2. Such as, our big British battleships will defeat Japan, by sailing to Singapore. There our Naval power will prevail!

Unfortunately, our ships got sunk by the Japanese Air Force.

What lessons do we draw from this?
The lesson is:
That you are a defeatist.
 
Such as, our big British battleships will defeat Japan, by sailing to Singapore. There our Naval power will prevail!

Unfortunately, our ships got sunk by the Japanese Air Force.

What lessons do we draw from this?

That in war the need to conduct a particular action in a timely fashion outweigh the risks and that sometimes the gamble doesnt pay off.

In the case of task force Z urgency meant that when the aircraft carrier broke - the ships went without air support.
The limited support the RAF could provide if all went well as a cap was insufficient to do anything but attract attention - so they opted to rely on stealth.

A disaster yes but not of the unthinking Duh officers and imperialist racist hubris type were constantly told it was.
 

Slime

LE
That in war the need to conduct a particular action in a timely fashion outweigh the risks and that sometimes the gamble doesnt pay off.

In the case of task force Z urgency meant that when the aircraft carrier broke - the ships went without air support.
The limited support the RAF could provide if all went well as a cap was insufficient to do anything but attract attention - so they opted to rely on stealth.

A disaster yes but not of the unthinking Duh officers and imperialist racist hubris type were constantly told it was.

Not forgetting that many revisionists happily ignore the fact that one of the countries involved was very much racist, and very much of an imperialist mindset.
 

Charles1948

Old-Salt
I intensely admire the Japanese people.

They fought the United States of America, single-handedly, for 4 years. They could've gone for longer, except that the Americans invented an unfair weapon, ie the atomic bomb.

Also, the Americans colluded with that monster Stalin, at the Yalta Conference, to give Eastern Europe over to Communist rule, in return for the Soviet Union breaking its Treaty with Japan, and attacking that country

I mean, how disgusting can politicians be. Aren't you sick of them?
 

Dumb1

War Hero
We once tried to sell a missile system to the Japanese JMSDF by boasting about how it shot down another missile and saved a US Battleship.

Sadly, the battleship in question was the USS Missouri and that was the end of their interest.
 
I intensely admire the Japanese people.

They fought the United States of America, single-handedly, for 4 years.
Only if you think Britain was fighting single handedly in 1941* ie you forget imperial colonies and associated manpower

They could've gone for longer,

Sort of - they could have killed tens of thousands and lost 10s of millions in delaying the surrender of a war already lost.

Once the alles were ashore absolute air Dominance was asured - There was nothing to challenge Churchills Comets Shermans and Pershings (and if they push it to 46/47 they may find themselves facing off with arguably the worlds greatest tank and its 1st MTB the Centurian) Yes they had a decent AT weaopon by wars end but prodution would have been limited not to say actually getting it from the factory to the front in the teeth of cabranks of Typhoons, Thunderbolse, P57s etc

except that the Americans invented an unfair weapon, ie the atomic bomb.
How is it unfair - never understood this logic - Hiroshima and Nagasaki were destroyed by a single bomb - - Shocking , Amazing and unbelievably quick - but other than the fact the residents werent subjected to hours of bombardment how exactly is it differrent to what was done to Tokyo, Berlin, Stalingrad,

Also, the Americans colluded with that monster Stalin,

The Japanese colluded with Hitler - im not sure the getting into bed** with unpleasant leaders is a stick you want to be swinging
at the Yalta Conference, to give Eastern Europe over to Communist rule,

They really didnt - you could argue they were naive in accepting Stalins word about elections - but what exactly could be achieved without fighting the Soviet union (see operation unthinkable) other than possibly pushing further and faster beyond tyhe Elbe - but that risks fraticide.


in return for the Soviet Union breaking its Treaty with Japan, and attacking that country
No - they guarenteed a return of the Kurils if Russia assisted with the invasion of Japan - you have missed the bit where we were all allies and we had all agreed to deal with Germany 1st, Notwithstanding that it was the Western Allies that secured the oceans ensuring the USSR could hold on and then supplied its ability to deliver a hoofing great kick to the 3rd reichs dangly bits.

As for any Russian treaty with Japan - this is the same Japan that was debating in 1940 whether it was going to attack Siberia or attack the dutch east indias - malaysia - Since Russia was aware of this im not sure we should expect them to feel overly costrained by previous peace treaties

In the event Russian assistance wasnt required but 2020 hindsight and all that

I mean, how disgusting can politicians be. Aren't you sick of them?

You mean dealing with things as they are practically rather than pretending the worlds made of unicorn farts and insisting its only fair if we all have a free puppy.


Ive replied - but im pretty sure you are just trolling for bites - no one can be that ignorant

*Often confused with Britain stood alone in 1941 - which is correct Geographically and partially correct in that the Empire wasnt yet producing men and equipment at a significant rate ( The US doesnt really have a significant force in the European theatre until late 44 early 45 either - )

**Although it has to be said that given their proclivities to minorities and POWs they were well suited.
 
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Not forgetting that many revisionists happily ignore the fact that one of the countries involved was very much racist, and very much of an imperialist mindset.
Britain?
 

Charles1948

Old-Salt
Only if you think Britain was fighting single handedly in 1941* ie you forget imperial colonies and associated manpower



Sort of - they could have killed tens of thousands and lost 10s of millions in delaying the surrender of a war already lost.

Once the alles were ashore absolute air Dominance was asured - There was nothing to challenge Churchills Comets Shermans and Pershings (and if they push it to 46/47 they may find themselves facing off with arguably the worlds greatest tank and its 1st MTB the Centurian) Yes they had a decent AT weaopon by wars end but prodution would have been limited not to say actually getting it from the factory to the front in the teeth of cabranks of Typhoons, Thunderbolse, P57s etc


How is it unfair - never understood this logic - Hiroshima and Nagasaki were destroyed by a single bomb - - Shocking , Amazing and unbelievably quick - but other than the fact the residents werent subjected to hours of bombardment how exactly is it differrent to what was done to Tokyo, Berlin, Stalingrad,



The Japanese colluded with Hitler - im not sure the getting into bed** with unpleasant leaders is a stick you want to be swinging


They really didnt - you could argue they were naive in accepting Stalins word about elections - but what exactly could be achieved without fighting the Soviet union (see operation unthinkable) other than possibly pushing further and faster beyond tyhe Elbe - but that risks fraticide.



No - they guarenteed a return of the Kurils if Russia assisted with the invasion of Japan - you have missed the bit where we were all allies and we had all agreed to deal with Germany 1st, Notwithstanding that it was the Western Allies that secured the oceans ensuring the USSR could hold on and then supplied its ability to deliver a hoofing great kick to the 3rd reichs dangly bits.

As for any Russian treaty with Japan - this is the same Japan that was debating in 1940 whether it was going to attack Siberia or attack the dutch east indias - malaysia - Since Russia was aware of this im not sure we should expect them to feel overly costrained by previous peace treaties

In the event Russian assistance wasnt required but 2020 hindsight and all that



You mean dealing with things as they are practically rather than pretending the worlds made of unicorn farts and insisting its only fair if we all have a free puppy.


Ive replied - but im pretty sure you are just trolling for bites - no one can be that ignorant

*Often confused with Britain stood alone in 1941 - which is correct Geographically and partially correct in that the Empire wasnt yet producing men and equipment at a significant rate ( The US doesnt really have a significant force in the European theatre until late 44 early 45 either - )

**Although it has to be said that given their proclivities to minorities and POWs they were well suited.
May I say, that your post displays a level of intelligence, and knowledge, far exceeding most of the stuff on here, which comes only from big mouths.
 
May I say, that your post displays a level of intelligence, and knowledge, far exceeding most of the stuff on here, which comes only from big mouths.

There are many better informed posters than I on these pages - some of whom have caused myself to rethink some opinions.

Theres alqso a lot of sillyness and mud slinging and im not any better in that regard than most and worse than some.
 
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Themanwho

LE
Book Reviewer

Themanwho

LE
Book Reviewer
I intensely admire the Japanese people.

They fought the United States of America, single-handedly, for 4 years. They could've gone for longer, except that the Americans invented an unfair weapon, ie the atomic bomb.

Also, the Americans colluded with that monster Stalin, at the Yalta Conference, to give Eastern Europe over to Communist rule, in return for the Soviet Union breaking its Treaty with Japan, and attacking that country

I mean, how disgusting can politicians be. Aren't you sick of them?
What is it about the rape of Nanking, abuse of prisoners and hideous medical experimentation that you admire most of the Japanese?

Actually they weren't fighting the USA alone, they were part of the Axis powers fighting the Allied powers, and they couldn't have fought for longer with any effect as they had fcuk all left to fight with, but don't let the facts smack you in the face, eh?. And the largest land defeat inflicted on the Japanese was at the hands of the British Empire.

And finally there's no such thing as a "fair" weapon. Used correctly, they're supposed to be unfair; that's pretty much the point.

You going for troll of the week or something?
 

Yokel

LE
What is it about the rape of Nanking, abuse of prisoners and hideous medical experimentation that you admire most of the Japanese?

Actually they weren't fighting the USA alone, they were part of the Axis powers fighting the Allied powers, and they couldn't have fought for longer with any effect as they had fcuk all left to fight with, but don't let the facts smack you in the face, eh?. And the largest land defeat inflicted on the Japanese was at the hands of the British Empire.

And finally there's no such thing as a "fair" weapon. Used correctly, they're supposed to be unfair; that's pretty much the point.

You going for troll of the week or something?

One of Putin's trolls, perhaps?
 

Charles1948

Old-Salt
I can't reply, because you've been brainwashed by political correctness.

If I say anything more, you'll report me. And get me arrested by the police. That's the world you've created.
 

Themanwho

LE
Book Reviewer
I can't reply, because you've been brainwashed by political correctness.

If I say anything more, you'll report me. And get me arrested by the police. That's the world you've created.
Trying to think of a polite way to tell this cnut to fcuk off, but I'm coming up short.
 

Slime

LE

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