State of UK Policing: another Home Office triumph

Is there any single action, or range of actions, that Government could take to reverse the downward trend?

A recruitment drive?
Improve terms and conditions?
Strengthen the court system?
Better welfare support?

The Rubicon was crossed so long ago you can barely see it in the rear view mirror. Sadly, even if the government suffered a rush of common sense to the head, and were willing to spend whatever was necessary, it would still take years to fix the problems. And while more coppers is a no-brainer, you would also need more prisons, and more PO's to run them. Ideally, you would recruit more judges and Sheriffs as well, to speed up the process.

As other have pointed out, Social Work and Mental Health need improving as well, as this has a direct effect on crime and police resources. All of this would cost Billions, take years to deliver and would require politicians who were willing to admit they were wrong and put the needs of the country before their own egos. So that will be the day after never, then.

In other words, it's a huge shit sandwich and both coppers and the public are going to have to take a bite.

And no, Ann Margret's not coming ;)
 
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There are real emergencies, and then there are time wasters.

Not all calls to public services are deserving.

I know, I respond to my fair share of them. And I'd rather turn up to a dozen false alarms than a single incident that was allowed to escalate because someone somewhere dismissed it as whining.
 
I know, I respond to my fair share of them. And I'd rather turn up to a dozen false alarms than a single incident that was allowed to escalate because someone somewhere dismissed it as whining.

Nothing is ever dismissed as whining until after the event. However there is a knock on effect for other users when we respond to a dozen false alarms.
 
I know, I respond to my fair share of them. And I'd rather turn up to a dozen false alarms than a single incident that was allowed to escalate because someone somewhere dismissed it as whining.

What do you do that requires a response as a matter of interest?
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
There is really only one layer of plod to blame for this and it sits at CC level. For years they have followed the politicians line instead of standing up and saying its wrong!
Now they are sitting in charge of what seems to be (well the latest anyway) crisis to have hit UK policing since the (insert any drama) introduction of PACE and CPS all those years ago.
Fecked and sold down the river is what they are, couldn't see it coming? My big fat hairy arse, they chose to ignore it until too late as long as they were at the top of the politician arse licking league they thought they were safe. Policing became politicised at about the same time as the rise of the professional career politician!

You are totally right, The Pol Fed predicted this about 6 or 7 years ago but were accused of crying wolf.
Senior Police Officers are complicit for not challenging it but those promotions and gongs don’t self generate.

Yep. Have a few highly motivated individuals as friends who bailed out as a consequence of this. Among them, one very senior, the other a good copper (and my aikido instructor).

As examples, the former made the point about the latest police station no longer having a bar (where coppers could drink in peace) but having a multi-faith prayer room.

The latter quit after asking why there was a Black Police Federation, having made the point that there couldn't be a white one and that the 'general' one represents all coppers.

New Labour may have politicised many aspects of the Civil Service but the Conservatives have hardly been quick to undo matters.
 

PhotEx

On ROPS
On ROPs
Perhaps if they stopped pandering to minorities and got on with policing. I'd rather see coppers patrolling than attending pride.


Hampshire, community policing almost totally shut down, but ‘hate’ crime ‘he called my poodle a gay dog’ now it’s no 1 priority.
The Police have become too politicised to effectky do their job. They act as Little more than the para military wing of Social Services these days.
 
Recruting drive and T&C's would require a direct admission from Mrs May she was wrong.

So really, no.

I was chatting virtually with a mate of mine who is still in a week or so ago, and asked him what morale was like.

His was his messaged reply

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He’s not wrong. My shift is down to half numbers, and that’s before abstractions. Demand is at an all time high and it seems I’m spending most of my day doing the work of the social services and mental health services. I know I should suck it up and crack on but these days it’s hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

And as for recruiting and it taking 10 years to get back to where we were, far chance. The new degree qualifications is going to write off whole sections of decent candidates who could apply. Utter madness, you don’t need a degree to be a copper. You need good communication skills, common sense and a ability to read and write to a decent level.
 
When you read the full paragraph, you will see that I qualified it with those that then refuse to contribute to the process. Making the process unworkable.

Equally if you google 999 calls, I’m quite happy to say that some of them are totally unnecessary and amount to whining.



My bold … This being a classic example of the sheer idiocy of some of our populace today Police release audio of caller who dialled 999 because KFC was closed
I have been told that some people will even ring 999 to ask if the police can give them a lift as they missed the last bus. I suggest anyone who thinks that this doesn't happen listen to the recording.
IMHO we have allowed a generation of people who believe they are entitled to everything, mostly for nothing, but won't take responsibility for anything, especially if it costs them time, money or effort!
 
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My bold … This being a classic example of the sheer idiocy of some of our populace today Police release audio of caller who dialled 999 because KFC was closed
I have been told that some people will even ring 999 to ask if the police can give them a lift as they missed the last bus. I suggest anyone who thinks that this doesn't happen listen to the recording.
IMHO we have allowed a generation of people who believe they are entitled to everything, mostly for nothing, but won't take responsibility for anything, especially if it costs them time, money or effort!
Bang on. Every knows their rights but not their responsibilities.
 

Yokel

LE
My bold … This being a classic example of the sheer idiocy of some of our populace today Police release audio of caller who dialled 999 because KFC was closed
I have been told that some people will even ring 999 to ask if the police can give them a lift as they missed the last bus. I suggest anyone who thinks that this doesn't happen listen to the recording.
IMHO we have allowed a generation of people who believe they are entitled to everything, mostly for nothing, but won't take responsibility for anything, especially if it costs them time, money or effort!

Surely they have committed an offence - in which case it is in the public interest that they are prosecuted and made an example of. Some false calls will be reasonable, such as someone having a panic attack and thinking it is a heart attack or someone seeing two idiots indulging in horseplay and thinking there is a violent crime happening, but calling 999 without a reasonable cause should result in a fine/community service/public naming and shaming.

Bang on. Every knows their rights but not their responsibilities.

I had the misfortune of seeing a talk/presentation on the holocaust the other day. A lot of it happened as ordinary Germans got used to turning the other way. Can people be taught to strive to be the best version of themselves they can be, or that 'if you do nothing - you condone it'?
 
So why do we still get millions of whiny calls a year asking for us to help people and a reluctance by anyone to help themselves after they have made that call?
Asking for a statement from someone can be like asking to pull teeth. In my experience, most members of the population don’t have the capacity or the balls to do much for themselves.

And now the other side of that coin...

Woman's 999 call to police 'ignored' almost 90 minutes before she was killed by her brother

Coppers who whinge about receiving too many calls would be well advised to remember the advice pertaining to Glass Houses and Stones.
 
And now the other side of that coin...

Woman's 999 call to police 'ignored' almost 90 minutes before she was killed by her brother

Coppers who whinge about receiving too many calls would be well advised to remember the advice pertaining to Glass Houses and Stones.

What you have done there, is pick the most extreme example of a misjudged decision probably made in good faith that had a catastrophic outcome to make a point about police struggling to deal with people who don’t want to engage in The CJS.

I’m sure you can google hundreds of examples of rubbish and inappropriate calls to 999 or examples of people who refuse to help the police help them but instead you post that incredibly sad story. Weird.
 
It'a awe bollox'd
Back in 1989 the CC of Strathclyde Andrew Sloan [long before the SNP fucked it up totally] went on public record saying that his force would never resort to the use of automated cameras to enforce speed limits as, in his view, the Public might not like it, but they would respect the police for dealing with them "directly"........full circle and today how do you respect the polis on a day to day basis. ie when was the last time you spoke to one that wasn't a doing?
 
I think it oversimplifies matters to lay all the problems in policing with cuts to money.

I saw an interview after the Manchester concert bombing, I think he was some type of Fed lefty, he distinctly reminded me of Bob Crowe.

Said chap was pretty much stating Manchester going bang was all PMTM's fault due to her cuts as Home Sec.

Now I thought this was a touch disingenuous. Firstly, an extra million coppers in employment will not stop a lone wolf suicide bomber, unless some of them are actually in the idiot's kitchen whilst he makes the device. Secondly, I understand security at such a concert is a private firm doing it, not the (very) thin blue line.

I may be wrong about the latter, but as to the former, looks to me like an intelligence failing led to Manchester, not lacking numbers.
 
His point, was the ersosion of neighbourhood policing, Beat Officers in old parlance.
Years ago, the beat officer would be allocated 1 beat to manage and they would be kept reasonably free to patrol and get to know the area and the people. Locals would entrust them with info and curiosity would uncover a lot of pattern of life stuff. Who had moved in, who was having lots of visitors, lots of deliveries and anything that nosy neighbours notice.
Nowadays 1 PC or PCSO may be nominally allocated 4 or 5 beats, on top of this, they will be allocated crime enquires to progress, long term problems to solve and be used as the first point of abstraction in order to keep Response Shifts up to strength. Meaning they never get that depth of knowledge or hear the gossip/intelligence that is passed.

Neighbourhood Policing is the first line of defence against Crime/Terrorism and probably the most slashed after cuts.

My town used to have 16 Beat Officers and now has 5, you do the maths and tell me it doesn’t make a difference.
 

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