Staggering to War in the Falklands?

#3
As the drums of war beat on, will the civilized world stand by with the tacit message “that’s not my problem,” or will rational minds dedicate themselves to helping these nations chart a course away from war and toward a new era of harmony? We may find ourselves forced to decide sooner than we think.
If the rest of the "civilised world" keep their noses out then there should be no problem. As various threads have concluded the Argies don't have the capability to launch a (successful) unilateral offensive. Should any of the other Conquistadors wish to join in then you'd hope that the only decision for Uncle Sam was whether USN support was covert or overt, but with Obama at the helm I wouldn't bank on it.

If I were the Argies and wishing to head that off then offering future oil concessions to the US Gov would be a tempting option.
 

Biped

LE
Book Reviewer
#4
That's a great article. I would suggest that any British government would have the unqualified and solid backing of the British people once again if, once again, the Falklands came under attack from Argentina, with or without their allies in South America.

I've said the same thing in another thread: The Falkland Islands are sovereign British territory, with the Islanders resolute in their wish to remain British. That then is a done deal. Add the suspected 60 billion barrels of oil in the Falkland Island territories and it's a fait accompli - we should never give it up.

The fact remains that Argentina continues to militarily threaten our sovereign territory, and it's the only part of worldwide British territory under such threat. To defend against that territorial threat is the Government's obligation, because it's not just territorial, it's an economic threat too. If Argentina gets those islands, a long term economc lifeline for both the Islanders and the UK as a whole is lost, as well as our international prestige and standing.

To defend against this threat, we need fast jets, carriers, other warships, chinooks, apaches, heavy lift aircraft, missiles, APC's, light and/or heavy tanks, artillery - basically, we need a fully functional army, navy and airforce with nowt taken out.

If we lost a war to keep the Falklands against a multinational army from South America, history and the British people in the Falklands and the UK will never forgive our leaders and the penny-pinching fucktards in the Treasury for saving a few billion in defence in the short term, but failing to defend British subjects and British sovereignty, not to mention costing the UK hundreds of billions in oil revenues in the long term.
 
#5
I like the referance to the UN Decolonisation Comittee, at first I was a bit suspect until I read this on it's site:

The aspirations of the peoples of the Territories to achieve self-determination, and the international community's perception that United Nations Charter principles were being too slowly applied, led to the United Nations General Assembly's proclamation on 14 December 1960 of the Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples - resolution 1514 (XV).

The Declaration states that "the subjection of peoples to alien subjugation, domination and exploitation constitutes a denial of fundamental human rights, is contrary to the United Nations Charter, and is an impediment to the promotion of world peace and cooperation, and that steps should be taken to transfer, unconditionally, all powers to the Trust and Non-Self-Governing Territories so that they might enjoy complete freedom and independence".
Oh, and their website is a complete dogs breakfast and can be found here: The United Nations and Decolonization
 
#6
One of our T45's will take a jolly down south soon enough to remind the spicks just how outclassed they really are.
 
#7
My old man, who to be fair was a man of few words repeatedly called it a 'shithole' that people thousands of miles away romanticised and that he would swap it for his absent friends in a heartbeat. To be fair we were drunk, and Phil Collins massive hit 'Against All Odds' was playing softly in the background.
 

jim24

LE
Book Reviewer
#8
I like the referance to the UN Decolonisation Comittee, at first I was a bit suspect until I read this on it's site:



Oh, and their website is a complete dogs breakfast and can be found here: The United Nations and Decolonization
That only makes sence if there was an indigeous population, but there was not in the Falkland Islands, in fact at the time the Americans kicked the Dagos out the majority were probably American Whalers and Sealers
 
#9
This is one British Overseas Territory, probably with energy assets, that the new RN Queen Elizabeth class Carriers would be ideal to defend.
 
#10
That only makes sence if there was an indigeous population, but there was not in the Falkland Islands, in fact at the time the Americans kicked the Dagos out the majority were probably American Whalers and Sealers
And plus the islanders have exercised their right to self-determination, and they have self-determined to remain British.

Meanwhile, the Argentinians wish to colonise them and subject them to the rule of an unwanted foreign power under the mom of decolonisation. How ironic and un-self-aware can you get?
 
#11
From the link -

"No independent country in Latin America and the Caribbean supports Britain’s position that the islanders should have the right of self-determination in how they are governed."

Quite telling that. Kinda goes against UN principals too.
 
#12
From the link -

"No independent country in Latin America and the Caribbean supports Britain’s position that the islanders should have the right of self-determination in how they are governed."

Quite telling that. Kinda goes against UN principals too.
Read: "self-determination doesn't count if we want to colonise the bit of territory in question"
 

jim24

LE
Book Reviewer
#13
There is also the fact that they signed the Islands over to us to pay off their debts in London in the 1840s
 
#14
Interesting to see that the Argentine Navy intend bringing nuclear powered ships into service.

Could that present us with an interesting dilema if one or more of those ships were to sail into Falklands' territorial waters and stake their claim? Would we, in the cold light of day, be prepared to attack a nuclear powered vessel? Notwithstanding the fact that we could be in danger of contaminating our own territory, we would really stir up a hornets nest with the rest of South America. Hugo Chavez is flakey at the best of times and is allready ranting about our colonial ambitions, it wouldn't take much for the rest to rally behind Argentina.
 
#15
Interesting to see that the Argentine Navy intend bringing nuclear powered ships into service.

Could that present us with an interesting dilema if one or more of those ships were to sail into Falklands' territorial waters and stake their claim? Would we, in the cold light of day, be prepared to attack a nuclear powered vessel? Notwithstanding the fact that we could be in danger of contaminating our own territory, we would really stir up a hornets nest with the rest of South America. Hugo Chavez is flakey at the best of times and is allready ranting about our colonial ambitions, it wouldn't take much for the rest to rally behind Argentina.


It would be an interesting SINKEX for a prowling Astute.;P
 
#16
It certainly proves the value of this sort of thing:
Navy News 7 Oct 2010 said:
AS FOUR propeller-driven aircraft of the Fuerza Aérea de Chile bank over the harbour at Valparaiso, HMS Portland takes her place in a line of two dozen warships celebrating Chile’s 200th birthday.

Twenty-six surface ships and submarines gathered in the great port for a bicentenary fleet review – the highlight of a weekend of celebrations in Valparaiso and the country’s nearby capital, Santiago. Ships from around the world RSVPed to an invitation from the Chileans – besides the UK, warships from Argentina, Brazil, Canada and the USA – to attend the maritime spectacular. With the sun rising above the foothills of the Andes, the ships made for a waiting area before forming a column, six miles long, behind CNS Almirante Williams (formerly HMS Sheffield) in formation.

The salute was taken by the Chilean President, Sebastian Pinera, who was joined by Britain’s First Sea Lord Admiral Sir Mark Stanhope. It was all witnessed by around one million Chileans lining the Valparaiso sea front... (more)
Rio Times 14 Sep 2010 said:
RIO DE JANEIRO – Arriving in Brazil from the Caribbean where she was assisting in maritime security against the drug trade, 20,700 tonne helicopter carrier HMS Ocean landed in Rio last week. The largest in the British naval fleet, HMS Ocean then switched roles from security to diplomacy as the UK continues to pursue international relations with the country.

The purpose of the trip was threefold; conducting an amphibious exercise with the Brazilian Marines, hosting a defense industry day with the likes of British Aerospace presenting projects to Brazil’s defense ministry and a security seminar, culminating in the signing of a new defense cooperation agreement between the UK and Brazil.

Around 100 Brazilian Marines joined the Royal Marines on board as soon as HMS Ocean arrived in port on September 9th, and followed the amphibious training exercise on Ilha da Marambaia in Mangaratiba to the West of Rio designed to help foster co-operation between the two navies and share experiences... (more)
MOD website 22 Dec 2009 said:
Over six months after leaving her home port of Portsmouth in June 2009, HMS Gloucester returned home for Christmas on yesterday following a very successful deployment to the South Atlantic...

The Commanding Officer of HMS Gloucester, Commander Iain Lower, who hands over his command to Commander D George in January 2010 said:
"This has been a very successful deployment. Our achievements reflect the effort put in by the ship's company in preparing for this deployment.

"HMS Gloucester's mission in the South Atlantic was to defend the British South Atlantic Territories, deter aggression and ultimately defeat any opposing force if required.

"We have also assisted in supporting the Government's wider diplomatic efforts in Cape Verde, Brazil and Chile... (more)
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#17
I don't know about staggering to war in the Falklands but we're certainly staggering under the weight of multiple aircraft carrier-related threads involving Iron Duke 99.
 
#18
Amazing the things the Royal Navy can do for UK, not to mention when the sh.t hits the fan, the RN fights their ships to the death -and much preferably, to the death of the enemy, just as history and tradition demands. Rather like the British Army really. Britain needs an Army AND a Navy, and the Navy (and the Army) needs Carrier Air.
 
#19
I don't know about staggering to war in the Falklands but we're certainly staggering under the weight of multiple aircraft carrier-related threads involving Iron Duke 99.
If I was half as clever as you I would have been in military intelligence, but then many hold that a contradiction in terms... (not entirely me mind you, since I know at least one intelligent intelligence officer).
 

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