St. Crispin's Day

Discussion in 'Old & Bold' started by JoeCivvie, Oct 25, 2010.

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  1. 25th October 1415 - The Battle of Agincourt.

    Forgive a question by a fecking civvy, but if the late Tropper was still here, could he have told us which was the most accurate portrayal of Henry V's speech before the battle?

    Branagh's version

    Dear, dear Larry's version
  2. St. Crispen's Day Speech
    William Shakespeare, 1599

    Enter the KING

    WESTMORELAND. O that we now had here
    But one ten thousand of those men in England
    That do no work to-day!

    KING. What's he that wishes so?
    My cousin Westmoreland? No, my fair cousin;
    If we are mark'd to die, we are enow
    To do our country loss; and if to live,
    The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
    God's will! I pray thee, wish not one man more.
    By Jove, I am not covetous for gold,
    Nor care I who doth feed upon my cost;
    It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
    Such outward things dwell not in my desires.
    But if it be a sin to covet honour,
    I am the most offending soul alive.
    No, faith, my coz, wish not a man from England.
    God's peace! I would not lose so great an honour
    As one man more methinks would share from me
    For the best hope I have. O, do not wish one more!
    Rather proclaim it, Westmoreland, through my host,
    That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
    Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
    And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
    We would not die in that man's company
    That fears his fellowship to die with us.
    This day is call'd the feast of Crispian.
    He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
    Will stand a tip-toe when this day is nam'd,
    And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
    He that shall live this day, and see old age,
    Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
    And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian.'
    Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
    And say 'These wounds I had on Crispian's day.'
    Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
    But he'll remember, with advantages,
    What feats he did that day. Then shall our names,
    Familiar in his mouth as household words-
    Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter,
    Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester-
    Be in their flowing cups freshly rememb'red.
    This story shall the good man teach his son;
    And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
    From this day to the ending of the world,
    But we in it shall be remembered-
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
    For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
    Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
    This day shall gentle his condition;
    And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
    Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
    And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
    That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
  3. I'm ready for the French.

    Loving the sunshine today even if its a bit cool.:)
  4. The ending is the bit that really bites, really makes you want to go out and slaughter some french nobles

    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
    For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
    Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
    This day shall gentle his condition;
    And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
    Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
    And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
    That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
  5. Auld-Yin

    Auld-Yin LE Reviewer Book Reviewer Reviews Editor

    OK, so you had a lucky away win!!!!!! :)
  7. Battle of Cadsand 1337 English victory
    Naval Battle of Sluys 24 June 1340 English victory
    Battle of Auberoche 1345 English victory
    Siege of Calais 1346 English victory
    Battle of Crecy 26 August 1346 English victory
    Battle of Saint-Pol-de-Leon 1346 English victory
    Battle of La Roche-Derrien 1347 English victory
    Battle of Saintes 1351 English victory
    Battle of Ardres 1351 French victory
    Battle of Mauron 1352 Anglo-Breton victory
    Battle of Poitiers September 19, 1356 English victory
    Battle of Auray September 29, 1364 English victory
    Battle of Navarrette (Najera) 3 April 1367 English victory
    Battle of Montiel 1369 French victory
    Battle of Chiset (Chizai) 1373 French victory
    Siege of Harfleur 18 August - 22 Sept 1415 English victory
    Battle of Agincourt 25 October 1415 English victory
    Siege of Rouen July 1418 - January 1419 English victory
    Battle of Bauge March 21, 1421 Franco-Scots victory
    Battle of Cravant July 31, 1423 English victory
    Battle of Verneuil (Vernuil) 17 August 1423 English victory
    Battle of St. James March 6, 1426 English victory
  8. Fair play to the English, they had a not bad away win - perhaps spoiled in terms of reward by their becoming a bit jumpy hearing their baggage had been raided by some 800 peasants. concerned that the ransom bearing prisoners might get jiggy with them from the rear, Henry V ordered the French nobles put to the sword.

    This may have cost him "the ransom of France" and estimates of the loss in ransoms vary up to millions of crowns! The French suffered heavily. Three dukes, at least eight counts, a viscount and an archbishop died, along with numerous other nobles. Of the great royal office holders, France lost her Constable, Admiral, Master of the Crossbowmen and prévôt of the marshals. The baillis of nine major northern towns were killed, often along with their sons, relatives and supporters. In the words of Juliet Barker, the battle "cut a great swath through the natural leaders of French society in Artois, Ponthieu, Normandy, Picardy." Estimates of the number of prisoners vary between 700 and 2,200, amongst them the Duke of Orléans (the famous poet Charles d'Orléans) and Jean Le Maingre (known as Boucicault) Marshal of France. Almost all these prisoners would have been nobles, as the less valuable prisoners were slaughtered.

    For Scots who are fed up with all this Crispin Crispian shite... Shakespeare’s ‘Henry V’ rightly portrays the Battle of Agincourt in 1415 as one of England’s greatest military victories. Scots did not fight in the French Army at Agincourt. For the French it was a disaster that led to the near collapse of their kingdom. In their darkest hour the Dauphin turned to the Scots, England’s enemy, for salvation. Between 1419 and 1424, 15,000 Scots left from the River Clyde to fight in France. In 1421 at the Battle of Bauge the Scots dealt a crushing defeat to the English and slew the Duke of Clarence.

    Honours and rewards were heaped upon the Scots army by the French. The Earl of Douglas was given the royal Dukedom of Touraine and the Scots army lived well off the land, much to the chagrin of the French peasantry. Their victory was short lived however; at Vernuil in 1424 a Scots army of 4,000 men was annihilated. As mercenaries they could have expected no mercy and those who were captured were dispatched on the spot. Despite their defeat, the Scots had brought France valuable breathing space and effectively saved the country from English domination.

    Many Scots continued to serve in France. They aided Joan of Arc in her famous relief of Orleans and many went on to form the Garde Écossais, the fiercely loyal bodyguard of the French Kings, where they were at the very heart of French politics. Many Scots mercenaries settled in France although they continued to think of themselves as Scots. One such man was Beraud Stuart of Aubigny: a third-generation Scot immigrant, Captain of the Garde Écossais from 1493-1508, and hero of France’s Italian wars. To this day both he and other Scots heroes of the Auld Alliance are celebrated in Beraud’s home town of Aubigny-sur-Neve in an annual pageant.
  9. It has got to be Dear Larry's version.

    Thrilling is the word.

    Lying under a huge tree trunk in a German forest near the Möhne Dam, wrapped in my cape, SLR clutched to my chest I heard a clipped voice 'OK chaps' and above me, sat on the trunk a group of soldiers were briefed on their attack.just their backs visible to me.

    Drifting off to sleep until dawn, I know just how those bowmen felt on St Crispin's Day .
  10. Isn't archery great.

    Jules compound bow.jpg
  11. Lovely. I wonder what he really said? I suspect it was something along the lines of "the only way home is through that mass of French cnuts, and by the way, any captured bowmen will die horribly".
  12. Charge of the Light Brigade 25th October 1854. Not such a good result but a glorious spectacle by all accounts. Gave rise to a famous poem as well.
  13. Twist your bow arm in a little more, and check the position of your bracer. Besides, using a compound bow and (if I'm not mistaken) carbon fibre arrows is a bit too modern for the Froggies. They've only just developed recurves!
  14. Quite. Plus the prospect of ransomming some dopey noble once you've shot his mount out from under him, is a powerful incentive.
    The only scary thing about the French is their toilets.
  15. Thanks for the tips, Only been a toxophilite for 30 years.... cheers.. oh and Aluminium shafts.