Solution: Putting the FUN back into the TA

#1
Ladies and Gentlemen:

I propose to you the solution for putting the fun back into the TA:

Convert every 25m range in the country to a DCCT

Then:

1) Set it to run from compressed air, rather than CO2
2) Link them all into a network

and get the following benefits:

1) Environmental - no travel to ranges, no lead
2) Personal - no drafty troop shelters, no rain, no bullsh1t paperwork, no sentries, no red flags, no range stew, no weapons to clean
3) Competition - inter-unit falling plates, section in defence etc
4) Training - DCCT operator and scenario making trg conducted at unit level, the best scenarios circulated
5) Ops - training conducted in the theatre of Ops, judgemental shoots conducted with your local RMP det
6) Royal Artillery - use the DCCT to replace the crappy Invertron
7) Added incentive to sell the TA to cadets and OTCs

I am sure there are other benefits, please let me know what you think.

msr
P.S. This post brought to you in association with Left50
 
#2
Sounds like a winner, hence it will probably go nowhere. Shame because it could be a great retention and recruitment tool.
 
#3
And we all go to somebody else's TAC so we get fed for free?
 
#4
And can we run them from Nitrous Oxide, instead of compressed air? It would be more of a laugh. Or even Helium?




PS Is this a serious thread?
 
#5
Would it be uber-cynical to suggest that the only potentially useful output from the TA review would be enough hot air to run every DCCT in the UK?
 
#6
Gassing_Badgers said:
Would it be uber-cynical to suggest that the only potentially useful output from the TA review would be enough hot air to run every DCCT in the UK?
No.

And it would not be wrong to observe that the intellectual input would be better served as blancmange at an all ranks function.

msr
 
#7
1 prob - operators and custodians to run the system - at the moment majority are contracted civvies and its hard enough trying to get them to open on a weekend or work through their designated lunch break by 10 mins.

also the DCCT is only a training aid and should never replace good old fashioned live shoots - i admit its a good system if used properly, checking cant and trigger presures etc.
 
#8
Sarge_Knows_Best said:
1 prob - operators and custodians to run the system - at the moment majority are contracted civvies and its hard enough trying to get them to open on a weekend or work through their designated lunch break by 10 mins.
Don't care. What sort of Sgt are you? Mine is a DCCT operator and we have an arrangement with our local DCCT such that if it is not being used on the w/e we can rock up.

Sarge_Knows_Best said:
also the DCCT is only a training aid and should never replace good old fashioned live shoots - i admit its a good system if used properly, checking cant and trigger presures etc.
I never said it was going to replace anything. It's there to put the FUN back.

msr
 
#9
Sounds great

civpol already have something similar in a few of the armed police bases in London, so of course it can work. Dunno abot the network thing though.

The yanks had a similar uber gucci SAT about 10 years ago.
 
#10
hogspawn said:
The yanks had a similar uber gucci SAT about 10 years ago.
I rest my case.

msr
 
#11
Strange, but I've never really thought of the TA being there for fun or fun (per se) being a recruiting tool. Don't get me wrong, there is fun, but it seems to work best in hindsight - looking back over the cock-ups or successes that happened during some particularly arduous training, for example.

I suppose that there's got to be something there to stimulate interest, otherwise people won't take the important step through the doors. But is the offer of a video game going to do it? DCCT is a very useful tool - I wish it had come about many years earlier - but it's a training aid which prepares soldiers for the ranges and assists in teaching of LOAC.

Rather than DCCT, wouldn't driver training be more effective as a means of stimulating interest? Cross-country, obstacles, trailer-handling etc. In times gone by, I've had turns on a Fox, Ferret, some big wagon with a clam-shovel, a fire engine and so on - not with a view to actually learning to drive them, but just to have a go. There's a lot of kit out there that we rarely, if ever, see, let alone play with.

TA units also tend to be introvert. Let's get out and work with each other. Let me, a Sapper, turn the wheels and pull the string on one of your guns. In return I'll let you ...errrrm... ...errrm... push some buttons on a laptop... - maybe I should get one of our surveyors to run you through a bit of land surveying instead. But you get the drift - some non-role-specific training to break the monotony.

And it would be cheaper than converting ranges.
 
#12
Certainly agree with the concept of inter-unit activity. Used to happen quite a lot but if I remember correctly it got scuppered by the bean counters who said it was too difficult to do the pay etc (yes I know total b*ll*cks but there you are). I for one would love to get some of my guys on joint training.
 
#13
Blenhim... Has a lot to answer for!!!


Another problem I can see is most indoor rangs are not very wide, and would probably only fit in a 2 lane DCCT.

We have an Invertron at our place and many a time has been the sugestion that we replace it with a DCCT and when the subject of cost came up the sugestion was to 'buy it' ourselves.


Good idea though....
 
#14
I'm aDCCT oporator and Have taken the lads on a DCCT day. Good practice some fun shoots. Enjoyed by everyone. V Good for morale. Inter unit training is the way forward i reckon
 
#15
Carlos_Hathcock_II said:
Another problem I can see is most indoor rangs are not very wide, and would probably only fit in a 2 lane DCCT.
I am not an expert, but I would have thought you could fit in a 4 lane DCCT.

Hey, at the HAC you could pay for 2 to be put in back to back ;)

msr
 
#16
putteesinmyhands said:
Rather than DCCT, wouldn't driver training be more effective as a means of stimulating interest? Cross-country, obstacles, trailer-handling etc. In times gone by, I've had turns on a Fox, Ferret, some big wagon with a clam-shovel, a fire engine and so on - not with a view to actually learning to drive them, but just to have a go. There's a lot of kit out there that we rarely, if ever, see, let alone play with.
Given that it now takes 7-10 days to train a soldier how to drive a Land Rover, I'm sure the fun police at DRLC or DRAC would be only to pleased to let the TA crack on with this...

...providing we source qualified instructors who teach structured lessons as per the course folder, write a 10-page risk assesment, and apply 3 months beforehand to one of the WFM pools of vehicles, only to find a week in advance that the vehicle you thought you were going to use is either VOR or been sent out to the sandpit because some short-sighted individual closed down the production lines 10 years ago.

Of course, there are always ways and means of making it happen (as we have done in-unit ourselves), but the sad fact is that for every Officer or NCO with the drive and enthusiasm to make things happen, there are 20 others looking for reasons why it can't be done, or even worse, hang you out to dry should anything go wrong.
 
#17
Gassing_Badgers said:
putteesinmyhands said:
Rather than DCCT, wouldn't driver training be more effective as a means of stimulating interest? Cross-country, obstacles, trailer-handling etc. In times gone by, I've had turns on a Fox, Ferret, some big wagon with a clam-shovel, a fire engine and so on - not with a view to actually learning to drive them, but just to have a go. There's a lot of kit out there that we rarely, if ever, see, let alone play with.
Given that it now takes 7-10 days to train a soldier how to drive a Land Rover, I'm sure the fun police at DRLC or DRAC would be only to pleased to let the TA crack on with this...

...providing we source qualified instructors who teach structured lessons as per the course folder, write a 10-page risk assesment, and apply 3 months beforehand to one of the WFM pools of vehicles, only to find a week in advance that the vehicle you thought you were going to use is either VOR or been sent out to the sandpit because some short-sighted individual closed down the production lines 10 years ago.

Of course, there are always ways and means of making it happen (as we have done in-unit ourselves), but the sad fact is that for every Officer or NCO with the drive and enthusiasm to make things happen, there are 20 others looking for reasons why it can't be done, or even worse, hang you out to dry should anything go wrong.
This is my whole point: a sub-unit level DCCT would remove all of these 'issues'.

msr
 
S

swampmonster

Guest
#18
"Of course, there are always ways and means of making it happen (as we have done in-unit ourselves), but the sad fact is that for every Officer or NCO with the drive and enthusiasm to make things happen, there are 20 others looking for reasons why it can't be done, or even worse, hang you out to dry should anything go wrong."
Quote.

And this is why its not "fun" anymore :roll:

Like your ideas with DCCT but then again I'm an operator..
The cost of good training is going through the roof..and the saftey net is getting bigger and bigger..

something will have to give.

We seem to be a holding unit for the next Op's call up..with more and more presure on those trained to go on the next Op.
I'm not saying this is wrong but we need to get the training between a lot better......current Ops training has helped us keep going but then again you cannot just do that......
guess we will just need to think a bit harder.. 8O
 
#19
swampmonster said:
Like your ideas with DCCT but then again I'm an operator..
The cost of good training is going through the roof..and the saftey net is getting bigger and bigger..

something will have to give.
Will you read my first post?

This idea makes training cheaper and there are almost no safety measures required!!!!

There is no thinking required - this is a no brainer.

msr
 
S

swampmonster

Guest
#20
msr said:
Ladies and Gentlemen:

I propose to you the solution for putting the fun back into the TA:

Convert every 25m range in the country to a DCCT

Then:

1) Set it to run from compressed air, rather than CO2
2) Link them all into a network

and get the following benefits:

1) Environmental - no travel to ranges, no lead
2) Personal - no drafty troop shelters, no rain, no bullsh1t paperwork, no sentries, no red flags, no range stew, no weapons to clean
3) Competition - inter-unit falling plates, section in defence etc
4) Training - DCCT operator and scenario making trg conducted at unit level, the best scenarios circulated
5) Ops - training conducted in the theatre of Ops, judgemental shoots conducted with your local RMP det
6) Royal Artillery - use the DCCT to replace the crappy Invertron
7) Added incentive to sell the TA to cadets and OTCs

I am sure there are other benefits, please let me know what you think.

msr
P.S. This post brought to you in association with Left50


I did....and agree :)

Most of our problems seem to be in basic field craft/amin in the field and basic fitness (with the standard battles weight in theatre just now and a unit Vol/Mob on the near horizion)... The DCCT could be used to a greater extent than it is and I would love one in my location to use on drill night and weekends...Would be fantastic to run an APWT (CI) on a Tuesday night or a fire team defence shoot or build a CGI scenario based on one on disc.
I’m just not sure it’s the answer to all my problems… We have moved to unarmed combat and bayonet training to give the boys a new aspect of training and to make it more aggressive, this seem to work to bring lads through the doors for weekends, this maybe a short term fix and we will need to move on to something else.
I am very aware that drill nights and weekend training always will repeat as for the nature of the Territorial’s turn out, different guys every weekend so we need to re-instruct the subject.
I know this is not everyone’s cup of tea or role (nor should it be!) but I am only speaking from our experiences.
 

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