Silly Questions - D.I.Y. Double-Rifle: How does one license it?

#1
As I understand it, if you order a spare gun barrel for a project, it occupies a "slot" of the relevant calibre on a S1 FAC cert.

Qn1: Is that right?

If one wanted to self-build a double rifle, You'd presuambly need 3x slots on an FAC:
Slot 1 = Barrel Blank A
Slot 2 = Barrel Blank B
Slot 3 = The finished double-barreled gun once assembled and proofed.
(Let's assume the person in question is a private individual doing a shed-project, rather than an RFD)

Qn2: What process do you have to go through when a barrel blank (or more than one) gets assembled with other non licensed parts into a complete Firearm?

Qn3: I've always fancied Harper's "Seven Barreled Volley Gun" off Sharpe.
How many barrels of legal (non-pistol) length can you cobble together before the Plod tell you to stop taking the urine and slap a Sect-5 status on the project, as it's essentially a machine gun? I daresay it'd make a difference if it had a different trigger for every barrel, rather than one thet set them all off simutaneously!
 
#2
A reproduction Nock volley carbine would not qualify as Section 5: "any firearm which is so designed or adapted that two or more missiles can be successively discharged without repeated pressure on the trigger" in that the bullets do not leave it successively.

If you keep the barrels over 24 inches ( a real one having barrels of 20 inches) being smooth bore and "Either has no magazine or has a non-detachable magazine incapable of holding more than two cartridges" it isn't even Section 1.
 
#3
A reproduction Nock volley carbine would not qualify as Section 5: "any firearm which is so designed or adapted that two or more missiles can be successively discharged without repeated pressure on the trigger" in that the bullets do not leave it successively.

If you keep the barrels over 24 inches ( a real one having barrels of 20 inches) being smooth bore and "Either has no magazine or has a non-detachable magazine incapable of holding more than two cartridges" it isn't even Section 1.
Cool!

Mind you I had phrased Qn3 Badly - I was still thinking of a "modern" version of the volley gun, with rifled-barrels and being breech-loading with unitary cartriges.
When does that get reined in?
Does it need to have one-trigger per barrel?
 
#4
Mind you I had phrased Qn3 Badly - I was still thinking of a "modern" version of the volley gun, with rifled-barrels and being breech-loading with unitary cartriges.
When does that get reined in?
Does it need to have one-trigger per barrel?
Still only Section 1 but some constabulary staff don't even know what a drilling its and so good luck!

Only trigger on a Nock Volley Carbine because the barrels discharge simultaneously.

BTW, Henry Nock's company exists to this day but it is now called Wilkinson (Henry Nock's son-in-law) Sword.
 
#5
Still only Section 1 but some constabulary staff don't even know what a drilling its and so good luck!
Ah yes. But what confuses them generally is that there are two sho-gun barrels up top (s2) but a rifled barrel underneath (s1), so they don't know whether to put in on a SGC or an FAC (Or which box on a Co-terminous license, if they still exist). (Or at least that's what was explained to me once).

I'd just be working on one type of barrel; e.g. a double-barreled .416 for large game.
Or a 12-barreled .22rf for sh*ts-n-giggles - It's all just a theroetical exercise to work out what's legal and what ain't if you do a bit of bodging in shed.

Back to my original question, really:

What is the administrative step to turn two seperate barrels into one gun on the FAC?

Only trigger on a Nock Volley Carbine because the barrels discharge simultaneously.
Indeed - flash holes beween the barrels, as I under stand it
 
#6
Barrel blanks are not licensed items.

Making guns requires an RFD.
 
#7
Barrel blanks are not licensed items. .
Aren't they? I thought it was the "presure-brearing parts" that required the FAC; meaning the chamber-cut breech end of a rifle barrel, and the cylinder on those long-barreled post-Dunblane revolvers.

Making guns requires an RFD.
Well, that's that project kyboshed then. Glad I checked!
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#8
Having built a rather large number of very very expensive double rifles over the years, I would strongly advise against attempting to bodge together a DIY job.

It will be shit.
 
#9
Having built a rather large number of very very expensive double rifles over the years, I would strongly advise against attempting to bodge together a DIY job.

It will be shit.
Never said I was going to build something that'd put Purdey out of business!
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#10
No seriously, double rifles are a nightmare to build whether you're building a mega expensive thing covered in gold or something built on an old Baikal side by side action.

Either way you want both barrels to shoot in pretty much the same place, achieving this will require some serious mathematics, highly expensive machinery and a hell of a lot of time and patience. Think (upto) 6 months of travelling to the range everyday, firing 2 shots and then driving back to the workshop to make minuscule adjustments.

Unless you have a range in your garden it may prove difficult.

Building a shotgun is a piece of piss in comparison.
 
#11
Why not ask Pedersoli if their "Kodiak" double rifle is available in kit form, they offer kits for a wide range of guns. Here they sell finished rifles in 8x57 well as the shit kicking .50 and 45-70.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#12
Having said that, if you're serious about it, I'll gladly point you in the right direction regarding tube suppliers etc.

You'll save yourself a fair bit of time and hassle if you start out with decent raw materials.
 

Alsacien

MIA
Moderator
#13
No seriously, double rifles are a nightmare to build whether you're building a mega expensive thing covered in gold or something built on an old Baikal side by side action.

Either way you want both barrels to shoot in pretty much the same place, achieving this will require some serious mathematics, highly expensive machinery and a hell of a lot of time and patience. Think (upto) 6 months of travelling to the range everyday, firing 2 shots and then driving back to the workshop to make minuscule adjustments.

Unless you have a range in your garden it may prove difficult.

Building a shotgun is a piece of piss in comparison.
I'm in the market for an express rifle for driven boar, I was thinking of a 9.3x75R Beretta Silver Sable or a Chapuis - both have 5-6cm convergence at 50mts for a 3k rifle - any views?
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#14
I don't believe you have to be an RFD to build a rifle, just to carry on a business you do! Making one offs every few years isn't a business as neither is making something for your own use, it dies simplify things and makes it safer as the dealer has to abide by the proof laws but you can't sell yourself something so those laws don't apply!

Sent from my BlackBerry 9780 using Tapatalk
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#15
We built two 9.3x74Rs which turned out pretty good, basically our 20bore shotgun with some bolsters on the side and third grip.

There should still be the parts (assembled but unregulated barrels + un-detonated actions) to build two more kicking around in the factory. We built them on the off chance that someone would want another. If you're serious about a nice small double, I could probably get the parts and you could find someone to build it for you. I know my replacement is trying to free up space in the factory and would probably sell the parts for cost value.

Anyway, I haven't a clue about the guns you mention, outside of the London scene my knowledge is pretty slim I'm afraid.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#16
Actually scratch my last, just had a chat with one of the lads and 'cost value' is going to be around 20k for the parts alone!

Needless to say, the barrel work is what eats the cash.

Personally I'd leave double rifles to the very rich. It's all about bling, look at the PHs in Africa, how many of them use DRs over trusty bolt actions?

Just to wet your whistle, I once sold a pair of 375 doubles for 390 grand and they shot (a lot) worse than a 26 grand 375 bolt action we were building at the same time.
 
#17
I don't believe you have to be an RFD to build a rifle, just to carry on a business you do! Making one offs every few years isn't a business as neither is making something for your own use, it dies simplify things and makes it safer as the dealer has to abide by the proof laws but you can't sell yourself something so those laws don't apply!

Sent from my BlackBerry 9780 using Tapatalk
That's good to know, thanks.

What do you do when a chambered barrel (which I understand occupies an FAC-slot) becomes a completed gun?
Do you tell your local FEO that your 7.62x51mm spare barrel has become Smiffy's Experimental Camel Gun, Serial No 0001, (7.62 Cal)?
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#19
Do you tell your local FEO that your 7.62x51mm spare barrel has become Smiffy's Experimental Camel Gun, Serial No 0001, (7.62 Cal)?
Basically yes.

Every experimental I've seen or odd job that some bloke in the factory knocked up, has been a 'Smith & Son 001.'

I actually had to ban people from numbering guns '001' after we realised that there were 9 on the register under various makes.

Plod were getting mightily pissed off when I presented them with a massive pile of bits all numbered 001.
 
#20
No seriously, double rifles are a nightmare to build whether you're building a mega expensive thing covered in gold or something built on an old Baikal side by side action.

Ravers,

I'm a very low-brow fan of functional Baikal shotguns. For some reason I have craving for a double rifle. As I'm never likely to be able to splurge on a "proper" rifle, I'm keen to have a look at one of the Baikal doubles. Aesthetics aside, are they reasonably well put together in terms of barrel alignment, etc?
 

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