Silence for 2000 victims of terrorism

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by flash_to_bang, Sep 11, 2002.

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  1. As we remember the 2000 plus victims of the terror attacks in New York I would like to suggest a change in policy to George Dubya.  It goes like this; release all the captives you have in Camp X-ray and pardon those you have yet to catch.  Invite Al-Qaeda to sit in Congress and make Osama Bin Laden a cabinet minister.  While you are at it establish an enquiry into the acts of your armed forces and keep having them until you get the result that you want-it was all the Army's fault.  

    You could remember 2000 terrorist victims that way, but no one could be that stupid............could they?
     
  2. Flash: top post.
     
  3. Bet there won't be the same amount of fuss about silences and everybody stopping come Rememberance Sunday - a much more worthy cause!! :mad:
     
  4. woopert

    woopert LE Moderator

    Perhaps as the US has funded terrorism in Ulster via abhorrent organisations and propagandists such as NORAID, perhaps the US would like to hold a minute's silence for the 3000 or so victims of the IRA and other splinter groups associated with Republicanism in the Province since 1969?

    No? I didn't think so some how!  :mad: :mad: :mad:
     
  5. Flash - an excellent, intelligent & articulate post.

    However, it is wasted on this Forum.  Try The Times or Torygraph letter pages where the effect will be much greater and perhaps seen by the people who matter; i.e. politicians, Senior Civil Servants, Senior tary etc

    It really sticks in my throat to see tried and convicted terrorists freed to appease a political process when the self-same Soldiers (or their predecessors) who were targets of these scum have to go to Afghanistan (or wherever) to fight a "War on Terrorism".

    What makes it worse is that, as Woopert points out, these Scum were sponsored by inhabitants of the country that has suddenly become a victim of terrorism and who then take the moral high ground to defeat the type of people they supported.  Pure hypocrosy :mad:
     
  6. I agree, perhaps Cpl Jones summed it up best.."they don't like it up 'em you know"
     
  7. I can't imagine what you're all talking about...... surely September 11th was the first incidence of terrorist attacks anywhere in the world, ever.......   that's the impression I get from the media.
     
    And of course everyone is so keyed up and security is now so good that it could never ever happen again.........

    ......could it?
     
  8. Sat at home this morning watching the CNN and Fox news coverage of Sept 11, one year on.  Must admit I did feel somewhat touched by some of the anecdotal accounts of those who survived the WTC or who had lost friends, relatives or loved ones.  At the same time, I still managed to feel frustrated.  I cannot seem to remember the terms "selective", or "some" included in the phrase, "war on terrorism" when it was first announced.  I would love to believe that airing my frustrations on the likes of the torygraph's letter page might just make an impact upon the conscience of  someone of influence who may just happen to be reading it over their cornflakes.  I doubt it though.  Such belief has gone much the same way as that which I once had of how bad guys could never prosper in a fair society.  Poor old naive me. :mad: :mad:  
     
  9. talking about 9/11, I watched a rather moving account of flight 93, where the passengers managed to overthrow the terrorists and bring the plane down.
    It was a re-enactment of the events on the plane that day with interviews from the families of the victims.

    How sad to hear the partner, mother, wife, husband of someone recount the phone call received from their loved one saying that the plane had been hijacked and they were phoning to say goodbye.
    I could never imagine what that felt like. My heart goes out to them.
     
  10. Tonights contestants are:

    Manachan Begin, Prime minister of Israel

    Daniel Arap Moi, President of Kenya

    Mr Grivas 19 kipling villas Limassol

    Martin Mcguinness, Minister of education

    and some phsycho who got a social work job looking after children-at-risk in Haringey.

    Now try and tell me that Ossy B doesn't stand a chance in 10 years time?  He went to a good school I understand and comes from a very good family.
     
  11. From "1984" by George Orwell:

    Oceania was at war with Eastasia: Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia. A large part of the political literature of five years was now completely obsolete. Reports and records of all kinds, newspapers, books, pamphlets, films, sound-tracks, photographs -- all had to be rectified at lightning speed.  Although no directive was ever issued, it was known that the chiefs of the Department intended that within one week no reference to the war with Eurasia, or the alliance with Eastasia, should remain in existence anywhere.

    Anyone else feel that this rings a bell?
     
  12. I find it incredible.

    Is there something wrong here?

    The media, has been stuffed full of 9/11. Everywhere you turn, it's 9/11 this and 9/11 that.

    Yes it was a great tragedy. particularly poignant last night, was the documentary about firefighters trapped in Tower 1 when it went down. Even when it was obvious, that everything was on the motorway to rats, the fireblokies still tried to find survivors. Even after they got the evacuate order, the guys in Tower 2, were saying "Surely some mistake, there's still people trapped in here, let's go"

    .....and that's where the bulk of the Firemen died.

    It was certainly a day of individual and group acts of heroism. "Let's roll" on Flight 93.... Damn, if I had to go, that's the way I'd want it, not your way, but mine.

    Now the downside....

    It took Dubya 3 days to get to ground zero. I have made this point before, on various spammy boards like Military.com etc. My they got the arrse - lol. I got a lecture, that Bush as supreme commander had to be somewhere safe, till they ascertained there was no more risk to his inviolate person. Well, that was in the couple of days afterwards. Since then, a lot of Americans are asking, "Well, why wasn't he there?"

    I noted with interest, that he wasn't at the twin Towers ceremony, till much later. Possibly advised not to?

    Spoke to a spam mate in New yoik yesterday. He said the feeling of a lot of New Yoikers, was Bush had NO RIGHT to be there, and yes, they remember how long it took him to turn up at Ground Zero.

    As regards terrorists who become statesmen?

    Hmmmmmm

    Menachim Begin
    Itzak Rabin
    (Stern Gang and the zwei leumi) King David Hotel atrocity.

    Yasser Arafat
    Jomo Kenyatta
    Black Bob
    Nelson Mandela

    The list goes on and on.

    Now let's not make any mistakes about this. There is NO war on terrorism, there really isn't. However, there is a "War against people who don't follow Americas line or interests"

    On Sept 12/13th, I expected a serious of small unit actions globally, as we rooted these scummers out of their hiding places.."You can run but....." However, it just hasn't happened.

    How can it, when you greatest oil supplier, and reputed best mate, is the one funding terrorism and supplying Martyrs?

    Lets stop calling it T.W.A.T. and start calling it War Enabling America's Precious Oil  New Suppliers

    Or Weapons for short....

    Maybe, for the more cynical amongst us, we should use the neumonic from

    Corporate UnitedStates Needs Thick Soldiers.

    I listened to Dubya spout even more crap yesterday, as the twins of evil, Ms. Rice and Ernest Stavros Rumsfeld pulled his strings. Thank God at least, well, according to Newsnight last night, that Blair had persuaded Dubya, to go via a UN mandate. I appreciate that upset Madam Rice and her daemons, but so what. At least it might give us time to rearm and re-equip, before we have to go in.

    Lastly, everyone here is right. The very least the Spams could do, was hold a rememberance service for the 3,000+ people , who have died in the province, after all, their funding created that situation.  :mad: :mad: :mad:
     
  13. woopert

    woopert LE Moderator

    Let there be no mistake, and for the purposes of clarification let me re-iterate, that all of us who do or have served appreciate more than any other the immense value of human life, on any side of the fence. When I think of people, who in the utmost dispair, felt they had no option bu to throw themselves out of windows 100 stories high rtaher than die in a collapsing building I feel such a sense of pian, anguish, and loss, and yes, even a desire for retribution. But, this is balanced by a desire to see justice done and mercy shown on all sides.

    The mark of a good commander in the field is not how many lives he takes, but the number he saves on all sides while still winning the objective. I have never believed that the so-called war that Bush wishes to wage is just i the definition of "jus a bello" so aptly coined by St Thomas Aquinas when he dealt with these matters in Suma Theologica. This thinking has formed the very basis of jurisprudence that frames much of the universal legislation of international law. I see no justice in condoning terror of any sort, especially when waged against your allies (NI and Zimbabwe) or turning a blind eye, or fundraising, but ercognising terror when it is unleashed against your unliateral interests. I would love to see the day when terror of all kinds ends. I connot in conscience support an unjust unliateral action of the type being whipped up against Iraq. yes it is a despotic regime, but the mentality of the US Government that sees the need for an enemy to be defeated, any enimy for any reason is abhorrent to me. I only wish Colin Powell was president. Unlike Bush he has faught a war and knows the value of human life and the extremis necessary to spill even one drop of blood.

    I hope that the families of the victims will find peace, but I do not think they will find it this way.
     
  14. Some good points coming out here...keep 'em coming! :)

    Good to see we 'pawns' are intelligent enough to dismiss all the media hype and politicians' egotistic waffle.... ;D
     
  15. SB  - sorry to appear churlish, given the great suffering of the family members of the deceased of Flight 93, however, nobody actually knows what happened on board prior to the crash. An article in the Independent -

    http://www.independent.co.uk/story.jsp?story=323958

    - shows that there is evidence that the plane exploded in flight, rather than being nosedived into the ground by the passengers. See particularly the record of the phone call from the chap who locked himself into the toilet and rang the emergency services.

    I also feel that the description (at least by many Americans) of the Twin Towers' victims as heroes cannot go unchallenged. No doubt there were many acts of heroism, and the persons who committed them deserve to be described as heroes. But most victims of this vile crime were not heroes. They did not overcome fear, and choose the difficult and dangerous option while rejecting the easy one.  What many of them went through was heart renching, but going through a painful, or even fatal, experience does not of itself make one a hero. Sorry.

    Lastly, this rubbish about '9/11 changing the world' also needs to be put to bed.
    The fall of the Iron Curtain, the First and Second World Wars, the French Revolution - these were serious happenings. Again, sorry if I appear insensitive to anybody's sufferings, but the terrorists attacks in the USA last year were not remotely in this league. (Does anybody really think that another excuse to attack Iraq would not have been found?)

    Rant over.