Signal Squadrons and life support to higher formations

#1
Another part of my brief this week told of how the Corps is looking at its role of providing life support to higher formations.

Are we just a load of G4 tent putter uppers? should we be purely focused on communicating? Should the RLC be providing life support etc.

Well we have had this topic before but I am raising it again.

Personally I am Pro life support, why?

1. Capability. Communications is as important as field tactics. It plays such a key part that at Div and Bde level a Capt and a few troops wont cut it. There is too much intergration into the 1 or 2 * Hq and the way it functions for comms to be an add on.

2. Manpower, As a Sqn we have a fair amount of bods on the ground, no need for duplication of effort, we have our own Tech supply Specialist, our own Drivers etc. We are SELF sufficient. So what are a few tents and portaloos. Its the Army, who else is going to do it? contractors? You take the rough with the smooth. Once they are up they are up and the Hq goes live we all do our jobs. The complaint that we do tents is trivia. Even if the RLC took over life support we would still be tasked with providing the man power to fatuige parties.

3. Management of Troops. The Signals look after their men and women very well (from shop floor to MCM). You will not get that with another badge especially the RLC who are notorious for not looking after their soldiers. Also who do you want doing your part 2? a Sigs Maj who can relate to your skillset or another badge who sees you as scalies.

Any other opinions (reasoned ones that is...)
 
#3
There are a few points:-

Who else has the manpower? There are no other units that haven#t already got a role. The Pinoneer sections and Platoons attached to HQs in the old days just aren't there, and when they were they were supposed to be 'defence' sections or platoons, they were just misused to do a lot of the other crap.

You take away the support part of the job you are going to open the cries of 'Signals are over manned'. Then what 'Units' are you going to have?

Where did you ever get the idea that the Signals look after their men and women very well (from shop floor to MCM)? It's been the case for years that the Signals were normally top people until they got past full-screw. Then, they loose their reason for being in an HQ on ex or Ops. That's why they run around shouting at their blkles rather than talking. So they are actually seen to be doing something, not because it gets things done. You remove everything but the comms from them then there is no need for SNCOs in the field.... and that's a recipe for more BS than they get now.

Sorry you are the same as everyone else and have to do more than just your one job. You aren't going to get RLC or Engineers to come and set things up for you. Everyone in the army are too busy to take some graft off the scallys shoulders.
 
#4
Could'nt agree more PP what use do they actually have in the field apart from pissing people off. once all the graft has been done they just fade into the background stick their feet up and get in the way now and then. Unless your like a staffy i know who deploys on telic and sits on his arse all day sunbathing when there are outdets in desperate need of resup.
And finally you can't beat a couple of months building DTL's in a hot omani desert, some of the best character building i have ever had.
 
#5
crackpot_clayhead said:
Could'nt agree more PP what use do they actually have in the field apart from pissing people off. once all the graft has been done they just fade into the background stick their feet up and get in the way now and then. Unless your like a staffy i know who deploys on telic and sits on his arse all day sunbathing when there are outdets in desperate need of resup.
And finally you can't beat a couple of months building DTL's in a hot omani desert, some of the best character building i have ever had.
I don't know wot Bde you've served at but I it was never like that with any of my Seniors!!! They would graft with you until the links were in and the lads were sorted.
 
#6
Disco said:
Another part of my brief this week told of how the Corps is looking at its role of providing life support to higher formations.
What brief was this Disco? You on CLM or summat?
 
#8
Have you guys been hibernating since the Cold War or summat? The guys from 2 and 30 Sigs don't only deploy as radio operator siggies and JNCOs in some shellscrape, things have developed a bit in recent years. They also have SNCOs on some of the Cormorant dets (CEs and LASps) now. One of many reasons is that their CIS user community is right up to senior staff officers and a few stripes get things done. The seniors and subbies act as G6 LOs and try to make sure the guys G1/G4 needs are squared away. The Sqn and Regt Ops staff (e.g. YofS et al) man the various HQ elements like J6 JTFHQ/JFLogC, JFCIS, Joint Netcen and the Cormorant Management Cells.

To say the seniors are only there to provide life support is a pile of utter pish. By the way, since you're back out of hibernation, you might want to know that Bryan Adams is no longer at number 1. :wink:

CS
 
#9
Disco said:
No, this stuff is doing the rounds. Im suprised youve not heard anything.
Only on ARRSE, mind you I've been on leave for a whopping one day. If you've got any specifics then PM me pse.
 
#10
CardinalSin said:
To say the seniors are only there to provide life support is a pile of utter pish.
I'm seeing the same, when we rock up at Bde they've sorted all G4 stuff out (and we're using new equipment aswell). Although when I was with a Ptarmigan regt they seemed to specialize on G4, don't think I ever ate better on exercise in any other unit (but there being good at comms was never gonna get me promoted)
 
#11
Disco said:
Manpower, As a Sqn we have a fair amount of bods on the ground, no need for duplication of effort, we have our own Tech supply Specialist, our own Drivers etc. We are SELF sufficient. So what are a few tents and portaloos. Its the Army, who else is going to do it? contractors? You take the rough with the smooth. Once they are up they are up and the Hq goes live we all do our jobs. The complaint that we do tents is trivia. Even if the RLC took over life support we would still be tasked with providing the man power to fatuige parties.
I think that if the manpower is not available then we should help set up the tent's eg. We are pretty lost with no build to install the comms into anyway!

This does depend on the unit though as at the HQ ARRC they have a Sqn of drivers and a sqn of pioneers that erect tents, lay out tables and chairs eg. and provide defence. They also have a RE troop that install all the power! And a troop of signals that are directly task'd by ARRC for things like SAT TV, PA & VTC stuff although all the comms are provided by 7 Sigs (with 16 Sigs out there somewhere). This can take days (a week for conFUSION) and so the sigs don't bother turning up till after a few days.

For a smaller build where the tents can be up in hours the sigs would be just hanging around and therefore should be helping or doing the job instead.
 
#12
THIS POST IS NOT A REPLY TO ANY ONE IN PARTICULAR AS THERE IS NO QUOTE, IF THE CAP FITS.............................. !!

is that why they call it support battalion, there was me thinking you got paid for going out to do your job, and we got paid more for coming out later, i could be wrong

hq arrc

sp bn = tentage, force protection, - these boys get the sheeite end of the stick but are 100% at there job, and do get recognition for it. ask commarrc
7 sigs = trunk, sat tv, any other jif job for comms
16 sigs = I.T. Support 500 + clients, not bad for supposed non trained coneheads. soz nearly forgot 'H' tp, common the fibre boys

we all do it, cry someone else is better off than us, but we all take the shilling and piss it up the wall at endex, some people have found or not as the case maybe that life is too short to cry about putting up a tent or playing solitare on a laptop on exercise, if you dont like your job why not transfer, because you know your getting easy money for old rope no doubt, move, make the change and better yourself, let some young sprog take your place and leave the place that is so hard for you that you have to complaine here.

rant over, thanks for my first post.

AS AR ._... ._._.

THIS POST IS NOT A REPLY TO ANY ONE IN PARTICULAR AS THERE IS NO QUOTE, IF THE CAP FITS.............................. !!
 
#13
I.T._Pioneer said:
16 sigs = I.T. Support 500 + clients, not bad for supposed non trained coneheads. soz nearly forgot 'H' tp, common the fibre boys
Since when were 16 Sigs untrained? I'll give you conehead, there are a few about. But the majority of the guys i know at 16 either hold the appointment of Supvr IS or are IS Engrs or AP Specs. Not sure where you dug untrained up from :roll:

Boney
 
#14
The sat tv, PA, any other jif job for comms are done by the Royal Signals Maintenance Team (RSMT) that are part of the Sp Bn HQ ARRC. Obviously though if its a big job it goes to the Regt but for the smaller sh*t the RSMT are there (about 13 strong).
 
#15
Now one small point, but please highlight to me on the R Signals recruitment web site does it mention providing life support? All it goes on about is being a CIS specialist and being a solder. No reference is mentioned about life support. To quote:

"Our role is to provide the Command, Control and Information systems " - err, no mention of porta loos......

Now before you bunch of old moaners give me a history of how you thought you were going to be a tornando pilot in the recruiting office and ended up as a driver, we must concede the fact that it is well outside of the true role of our job.

Outside of the above, give it to the RLC and let us stick with our core skills - CIS.
 
#16
bullshit said:
Outside of the above, give it to the RLC and let us stick with our core skills - CIS.
Spot on - the main role of the CIS Troop 16 Signal Regiment is to provide - funny old thing: CIS - it is not to provide life support NOR to stag on - the Royal Signals really needs to make the BOLD statement that they have Customers (sorry weakman) for the services that THEY provide. And that the PRIMARY role of the Royal Signals is to provide Comms AND CIS.

I accept the old adage - Soldier first - trade second - GROW up - the world moves on: TRADE first soldier second :twisted:

Discuss oh and well done bullshit :D
 
#17
bullshit & GP3,
I think it's you two who have to do the growing up. Yes you are supposed to provide CIS. But you are also part of a Sqn or Regiment that is there to provide support to an HQ. If someone deems that as cleaning the portaloos, stagging on or picking up litter.... so be it. Everyone in the field on ex or ops has a job to do and then they have to look after their areas and admin. Now you picked a job you thought would be soft & cushy in an HQ. Well it is. You have your meals made for you, the stags are dished out amoungst a whole sqn and you have power for your TV, radio PS2 or whatever. You just happen to be in an HQ full of Staff officers who aren't going to do any of the sh1t jobs and they keep their own clerks busy enough so they aren't going to let them get jiffed are they? As you know.... sh1t rolls down hill and that means you get it. Tough, you should have thought a little harder before you tried the soft option.

As for getting RLC to do the jobs you don't want (note 'want' not can't or shouldn't be doing) to do? Where are all these RLC bods going to come from? They also have their jobs to do. They also have to 'police' their areas (as the spams put it) and stag on around their location.

You seem to think that you are a special case and I'm sorry to disapoint you but you can call it what you like..... I call it a reallity check.
 
#18
Plant-Pilot said:
I call it a reallity check.
The reality check is this:

One x armchair General is looking and talking to his comms and Battlefield computer system.

The system goes down = 1 x CIS or comms person is doing exactly what you prescribe - so how does it go............... switch on - now then PP would YOU like to face up to this said person AND stand AND be counted.

General - it goes like this - I told the said person he must clean the loos, as you need to ensure you can have a good S&*T also I told him to clean the areas as I know you like it to be clean. So as these Soldiers must do their bit - I thought you would not mind YOUR comms being down nor that the Server takes at least 15 mins to re-boot, Oh and the boys and girls get no sleep as I have them stagging on.

So would you stand there PP in front of the General or even JHQ on the blower - - Sir, the boys and girls are cleaning the loos and stagging on - we must do our bit SIR :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: after all we are Soldiers first.

Also PP you state that EVERYBODY must ensure ...... - reality check is that you are very wrong - during a high intensity ops - would you face off against the Corps Commander - Sir they (the persons providing a service) are cleaning loos because YOU said so
 
#19
Oh my god GP3, you actually believe your own drivel. There is only one person in the whole HQ who can do your job? If that's the case we might as well all go homer and give up. Becaue if you are sitting in the cookhouse, grabbing some sleep or hurt and casevaced the world is going to stop. NOT

If your Seniors can't organize things when they really have nothing else to do, then the R Sigs really has filled up with complete mongs since I had the good sense to get out and become an Royal Engineer.
 
#20
Oh come on GP your taking it to extremes. Not everyone is so indespensable (well apart from the FoS but he dont do duties)

True if you had critical tradesman doing some form of fatigues or GD duty if the sh*t hit the fan you would have to manage this appropriatley but and its a big BUT wouldnt you have a trained tradesman on duty for such problems anyway? (duty tech/IS/Inst).

Most of the G4 duties are done by the Sqms and his lads. They will take others from the Sqn but we should have our bases covered first? If not your either weak and scared of the Badge or have no man management.

I would concede the guard duty point, it is a big distraction to soldiers who are already on a shift pattern but the the setting up/tearing down and general GD stuff can be managed by all. It is part of soldering afterall (and team building :wink: )
 

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