Should ACF/ CCF Mess Functions be held at annual camps?

Should ACF/ CCF Mess Functions/ Dinner Nights be held at annual camp?

  • Officers Mess only

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • WO's/Sgts Mess only

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Yes

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
#1
With the duty of care involved with looking after young people, should we, as youth leaders, be allowed to hold mess functions or unit dinner nights during annual camp/ CCF central camp?

My ACF has banned them, but I know of other ACFs that still allow them.

Some ACF's allow Coy's to leave camp on mass so they can have a unit night out.

What do you think?
 
#2
We tend to have the Sergeant's Mess on one night, and then all of the Officers are on duty, then we return the favour on another night. I t works well, and its nice to have some formality to celebrate the year and the work we do for the cadets.

I understand the argument about instructors getting drunk and therefore not being able to fulfil their duty of care to the cadets, but on the mess night they aren't on duty and with so many colleagues around, we all look out for each other, we operate a strict policy of no drinking if on county or company duty. Also, guidelines in the Red Boolk depict that any of the drivers musn't have touched alcohol for at least 8 hours prior to driving... this is fiercely enforced in our county. Better safe than sorry.

How come your county banned them? :)

I appreciate we are youth leaders but we are also human and work in an organisation based on the Army... and mess functions are one of those traditions. We are volunteers and its nice to have an event to socialise with the team we've been working with for the past 2 weeks or whatever.

I supose it could be argued that if Mess funtions were banned, then the bar should be dry too on regular nights at camp. :)
 
#3
dusty_evans said:
We tend to have the Sergeant's Mess on one night, and then all of the Officers are on duty, then we return the favour on another night. I t works well, and its nice to have some formality to celebrate the year and the work we do for the cadets.

I understand the argument about instructors getting drunk and therefore not being able to fulfil their duty of care to the cadets, but on the mess night they aren't on duty and with so many colleagues around, we all look out for each other, we operate a strict policy of no drinking if on county or company duty. Also, guidelines in the Red Boolk depict that any of the drivers musn't have touched alcohol for at least 8 hours prior to driving... this is fiercely enforced in our county. Better safe than sorry.

How come your county banned them? :)

I appreciate we are youth leaders but we are also human and work in an organisation based on the Army... and mess functions are one of those traditions. We are volunteers and its nice to have an event to socialise with the team we've been working with for the past 2 weeks or whatever.

I supose it could be argued that if Mess funtions were banned, then the bar should be dry too on regular nights at camp. :)
Yup,
We as adults forgoe time with our families to train these youngsters & hopefully improve their quality of life.The mess & any functions are a 'perk' which is a relief from 2 weeks of early days,late night's & stress from looking after 200+/- youngsters.
As long as it is'nt abused,let it be.
Spike
 
#4
With the NI 2nd Bn, I found the mess dinner to be a very enjoyable evening. Well worth it, after all the work the ACF put in I'd say they deserved it - pity their adjutant matched wits with someone far superior ;)
 
#5
escape_artists_never_die said:
With the NI 2nd Bn, I found the mess dinner to be a very enjoyable evening. Well worth it, after all the work the ACF put in I'd say they deserved it - pity their adjutant matched wits with someone far superior ;)
H Coy?
 
#8
To be honest, if you can't be trusted to go to the mess or a mess function and not get so bladdered that the kids know what you've been up to, then you should'nt really be an AI.

I find the mess more of a social thing, where you can seperate from annual camp and the kids over a few beers, just like if you were at home in the pub. Its not as if you're going to start a yard downing competition and then go and take a drill lesson at 0700 the next morning while asking the little ones if they can pop down the kebab shop.

Two or Three pints before bed, as long as you're not driving? Theres no problem with that. And you won't be doing that every night anyway. As said before, as long as it isnt abused, let it be.

Regards

Rab
 
#9
I don't like these things myself - having to sit next to someone you wouldn't normally piss on if they were on fire. There are far too many people in our County who have forgotten the real grass-roots purpose of the ACF. They see it as a drinking club where they can desperately try and impress dribbly old dignatories and feather their own nest.

I also find it slightly objectionable that 'you must go to this dinner, otherwise you'll be in front of the Colonel'. It costs about £30 for one of these things and we usually have 3 a year - that's 200 Mars bars I could have bought instead! ;)
 
#10
Country_Bumpkin said:
I don't like these things myself - having to sit next to someone you wouldn't normally urine on if they were on fire. There are far too many people in our County who have forgotten the real grass-roots purpose of the ACF. They see it as a drinking club where they can desperately try and impress dribbly old dignatories and feather their own nest. The Commandant is by far the worst offender.

I also find it slightly objectionable that 'you must go to this dinner, otherwise you'll be in front of the Colonel'. It costs about £30 for one of these things and we usually have 3 a year - that's 200 Mars bars I could have bought instead! ;)
So you're saying we should ban them just cos sometimes life is cruel and you have to sit next to someone you don't like? boohoo

If you're part of the organisation what's wrong with celebrating with others for the success of the organisation? And £30 is nought in comparison to what we get paid. Humbug LMAO

Mars Bars make you fat too.

Do you have anybetter excuses rather than you're own personal dislike of them? For example... you don't once raise a point about the cadets...

Newsflash, scientists have just discovered that after years and years of research - the world doesn't revolve around you lol ;) :twisted:
 
#11
i would prefer Mess dinners to conducted out of annual camp so that we can fairly p1ssed (within reason you don't want to be telling the commandant what you REALLY think of him after 10 pints down your neck :lol: ) without having to be ready to train the Cadets in the morning , all we have to do is sleep it off in the morning hopefully in our own homes :) , not in the dorm as we would have to clean it up the next day for the QM handover while nursing a headache, some QMs can be a right b@stard at times 8O


i think a drink the bar at camp is okay without being too formal, the last camp in Barrybudden (2004) was in a mixed mess so the bar is the same as back in my HQ same staff an' all, i could not do a formal mess during annual camp for too many potential for problems, if for example a fight kicks off between Cadet of different Cap badges or companies, football clubs or other tribal set ups, all of us would be expected to turn out and put a lid on things , not something you want to do in a Mess dress or DJs etc.

Knook camp (2005) didn't really have a bar that i noticed. it was all soft drinks in the main hall in the centre of the camp. we were in the back of the beyond

i say NO, Formal annual mess do should be out of training and out of camps, its a social event to relax, not to wonder if you will have to turn out for fights or training Cadets with live rounds lurking in the back of your head spoils your drinking a bit.
 
#12
Funny Dusty, I don't actually remember saying we should ban these things - just I didn't like them myself.

Amend my previous post: delete the 'real grass-roots purpose of the ACF' and insert 'delivering fun and quality training and looking after the welfare of the cadets'. I'm sure most people who read that understood exactly what I meant.

You're new round here Dusty - don't criticise people for voicing their own opinions and read posts carefully before you criticise. If you can't do that then FECK OFF!!!!!

When you grow-up you want to be a lawyer? Why not get an honourable profession like prostitution? I bet you're at some scuzzy third-rate former polytechnic (like APU). Enough said - pond life.
 
#13
Writing now as a CCF officer in a state-school contingent, I'm entirely in agreement with Rab. A mess night treated as an occassion to relax and socialise in a traditional military environment can't be a bad thing, and annual camp seems a logical time for it. All things in moderation.

Also agree with Bumpkin - mess nights should be social occassions, not careers fairs.

As for the CCF, in my experience the majority of those CCF contingents which have mess nights hold them at the school where they can get their hands on the cooks/waiting staff/dignitaries/silverware. My school has no waiters, no silverware, and barely has cooks. No mess nights for us.

Isn't lugging your mess kits up and down the country a pain in the arrse?
 
#14
mess dinners should be kept in. Camps are often hectic times for the instructors who are constantly on duty, running around after the kids who always manage to find a reason to come and see an instructor about something even after the day's training has been done. The adults deserve at least one to properly enjoy themselves. And like it was said previously- the two messes can help each other have the night of my covering the duties when the respective functions are being held.

2nd ni mess dinner was good laugh-yup eand it was a pity about that adjutant, but hey you get d**ks in every line of work
 
#15
murphy63 said:
mess dinners should be kept in. Camps are often hectic times for the instructors who are constantly on duty, running around after the kids who always manage to find a reason to come and see an instructor about something even after the day's training has been done. The adults deserve at least one to properly enjoy themselves. And like it was said previously- the two messes can help each other have the night of my covering the duties when the respective functions are being held.

2nd ni mess dinner was good laugh-yup eand it was a pity about that adjutant, but hey you get d**ks in every line of work
I bet I know who you're on about! 8)
 
#19
Cant be me! I have been taking a year off from cadets,missed last years camp so have'nt driven a Mil vehicle since camp 2004 at Leek.And then we only got lost due to dodgy directions from a certain Captain!
The was a vehicle wrecked by a SMI tho.
Spike
 
#20
from CCF perspective (very minor public school) I say no. From a selfish point of view it wouldnt be a real chance to relax because of the issues already raised, but also it isnt on to tell the kids to arrse off to the naafi while we get into our best bib and tucker. Fair enough we can relax in the bar, but there are gradations. Also from CCF point of view I don't see how it would be our function, as you are beholden to the unit running it. When at a central camp last year the admin unit were total tossers as regards the social aspect (many issues, not particularly funny or interesting) so how could one organise it. Then again I also don't like the way my school runs its dinner anyway, guesss I'm just hard to please.
 

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