Should abortion be illegal? AKA Roe vs Wade

[Steamboat]

Maybe you should ask the judges who decided that there was one and, all subsequent judgements based on the 'opinion' ? Maybe something to do with womens rights ?

I might also ask, where in the 2nd Amendment does it say, citizens have the right to buy and use automatic weapons "for personal protection" ?

Any such document is meant for guidance, not slavish adherance...it is now used by all and sundry,as a club to forward their specific agenda...what originally was drafted as a protection of democracy, is now being used as a weapon AGAINST democracy !

Do you understand the difference between a semi auto and an automatic firearm by chance?

 

[Steamboat]

But not a majority of women...

Let’s address this point. In many of the low populated Western States trigger bans are going into effect, mine included. Which is more of a joke than anything.


But these states are fairly split between males and females as the Demographics show.
Which means that these bans were only created with females who support pro life policies. If the female populations of these states were all pro choice the abortion ban legislation wouldn’t see the light of day.

So are the females in these states wrong?

 

[Dreamseller]

Let’s address this point. In many of the low populated Western States trigger bans are going into effect, mine included. Which is more of a joke than anything.


But these states are fairly split between males and females as the Demographics show.
Which means that these bans were only created with females who support pro life policies. If the female populations of these states were all pro choice the abortion ban legislation wouldn’t see the light of day.

So are the females in these states wrong?

Were these trigger laws voted in by the state population?

 

[Lindermyer]

She said the Quiet bit out load - and not for the first time

She's the one who said Hitler was right...

This another of those Faux outrage things - Where we ignore context and so we must be outraged because pointing out where Hiltler made a valid point means you admire him and think he was right about everything

Thus for example whilst saying Hitler was evil because he manipulated crowds and thats the danger of populist speeches is deemed a good thing to say, saying 'Hitler was a good orater who knew how to work a crowd' means you are a literal Nazi.

 

[Steamboat]

Were these trigger laws voted in by the state population?

In my own States case it was legislation that was introduced and passed in the last session.

 

[Glasgow_Jock]

But these states are fairly split between males and females as the Demographics show.
Which means that these bans were only created with females who support pro life policies. If the female populations of these states were all pro choice the abortion ban legislation wouldn’t see the light of day.

So are the females in these states wrong?

If 60% of a state's population supports stricter anti-abortion laws, though of that 60% two thirds are males, does that seem right?

 

[Dreamseller]

In my own States case it was legislation that was introduced and passed in the last session.

Okay, so it's not known how many women or men in your state support that specific legislation?

 

[Steamboat]

If 60% of a state's population supports stricter anti-abortion laws, though of that 60% two thirds are males, does that seem right?

It’s why we have elections and vote. Women have many ways to influence the male population.

But like I said in my state this debate is a farce.

 

[Steamboat]

I

Okay, so it's not known how many women or men in your state support that specific legislation?

It’s really simple. If you are pro life you vote Republican. If one is pro choice you vote Democrat. We have very few Democrats in the State Legislature .

 

[Ortholith]

I

It’s really simple. If you are pro life you vote Republican. If one is pro choice you vote Democrat. We have very few Democrats in the State Legislature .

What if you're anti abortion and pro gun control? Pro abortion and anti gun control?

Edited for stupidity.

 

[Dreamseller]

I

It’s really simple. If you are pro life you vote Republican. If one is pro choice you vote Democrat. We have very few Democrats in the State Legislature .

It really isn't that simple at all and trying to force it to be is to the detriment of a reasonable discussion. You have no empirical evidence that proves that every, or even a majority of, the female republican voter is because of that one issue.

 

[Dreamseller]

What if you're anti abortion but pro gun rights? Pro abortion and anti gun rights?

Then according to the previously stated logic you can't vote for either of the two parties as they're far too complex a position to take on things.

 

[Bob65]

What if you're anti abortion but pro gun rights? Pro abortion and anti gun rights?

Aren't those literally the Republican and Democrat positions?

If you were anti-abortion and anti-gun, or pro-abortion and pro-gun, you would be politically homeless.

 

[Ortholith]

Aren't those literally the Republican and Democrat positions?

If you were anti-abortion and anti-gun, or pro-abortion and pro-gun, you would be politically homeless.

Er, yes. I knew what I meant and fucked it up by confusing gun rights and gun control. I've edited the post now. Thanks.

 

[green_slime]

Aren't those literally the Republican and Democrat positions?

If you were anti-abortion and anti-gun, or pro-abortion and pro-gun, you would be politically homeless.

that is where the British Labour Party currently sits. They agree with any principle you might, or might not have.

 

[Bob65]

If 60% of a state's population supports stricter anti-abortion laws, though of that 60% two thirds are males, does that seem right?

During WW1 the Suffragettes loved to hand out white feathers to men they felt ought to have been conscripted and sent to die in the trenches.

Not saying this of you personally but in general: pro-abortion activists take it for granted that most of if not all women are pro-abortion, and the majority of those anti-abortion are men. I don't believe either assumption is true.

 

[Glasgow_Jock]

If you were anti-abortion and anti-gun, or pro-abortion and pro-gun, you would be politically homeless.

Indeed. It's almost as if large swathes of the US population on either side 'identify' with one of the two parties regardless of their stance across myriad subjects.

 

[Glasgow_Jock]

During WW1 the Suffragettes loved to hand out white feathers to men they felt ought to have been conscripted and sent to die in the trenches.

Not saying this of you personally but in general: pro-abortion activists take it for granted that most of if not all women are pro-abortion, and the majority of those anti-abortion are men. I don't believe either assumption is true.

I'd have women equally in the trenches absorbing artillery and small arms fire though I'm fairly progressive (unless they're pretty, then they can churn out babies to replace lost stock).

That's an observation I've noticed myself. Perhaps large swathes of women in 'Middle America' are brainwashed with Christian idealism?

 

[Bob65]

I'd have women equally in the trenches absorbing artillery and small arms fire though I'm fairly progressive (unless they're pretty, then they can churn out babies to replace lost stock).

That's an observation I've noticed myself. Perhaps large swathes of women in 'Middle America' are brainwashed with Christian idealism?

It's a tricky one and strays dangerously close to an obvious logical fallacy. Christianity holds that life begins (or more accurately, that the soul enters the body) when the baby is formed in the womb (Jeremiah 1:5) , but it doesn't quantify what that really means for a baby to be "formed", I don't recall offhand if it is defined elsewhere in the Bible that this specifically means the moment of conception.

But it doesn't hold that the belief that life begins at or shortly after conception is exclusively a Christian one, you can make an exclusively logical, scientific, atheist conclusion for example that once a baby has a distinctive heartbeat that it is a distinct individual with a "right to life", or some other marker like detectable brain activity, or distinct DNA from its mother, or whatever.

(I am not necessarily advocating either of those positions here, merely observing that they exist).

 

[Lindermyer]

During WW1 the Suffragettes loved to hand out white feathers to men they felt ought to have been conscripted and sent to die in the trenches.

Those Men included 16 and 17 year old boys - who incidently didnt have the vote and nor were they included in the suffragettes campaign to extend voting rights.

Not saying this of you personally but in general: pro-abortion activists take it for granted that most of if not all women are pro-abortion, and the majority of those anti-abortion are men. I don't believe either assumption is true.

Likewise

I firmly believe the argument is phrased as such, not because they believe it to be the case but because making it an equality / feminist issue enables them to control the debate.

I support the decision to overturn Roe V Wade -

Expressing that opinion will be countered with I dont have a Uterous - Im part of the Patriarchy - I want to control women - Man controlling women etc

It has nothing to do with my position viz abortion - I just think it was a mistake and it belongs with the states to decide (For the record I think its a retrograde step many states are now taking - but its their decision)

But it doesnt matter what I think - because im from the wrong demographic my opinion can be missrepresented and myself denigrated at every turn to ensure only the polarised 'correct" opinion is valid


Its effective at stiffling debate and ensuring only your voice is heard in the short term - but longterm it leads to highly polarised positions - lots of cretinous claims and the vast majority who you need to support you being disengaged at best or so effed of with the dullardry and being tod that they are bad for not thinking x that they now actively oppose you.

See also how both sides in the Trans women in sports debate brand the other mysogonists.