Shotguns for home defence

#1
I do archery as a hobby and am thinking of taking up clay pigeon and practical shotgun shooting as a hobby. My ground floor flat which is in a bad area has been burgled/robbed three times before in two years, the thought of having a shotgun at home for home defence as an improvised weapon appeals.

The last time we were robbed, three guys broke into our house at around 4am through a single glazed window round the back which the landlord was too stingy to upgrade to a double glazed uPVC window. My wife and I were promptly ushered at knifepoint into a disused airing cupboard which used to hold the hot water tank (since replaced with a combi boiler). The men proceeded to utterly ransack the house.

The police arrived about 20 minutes after we freed ourselves and called them, which by then the robbers were long gone. They were not helpful and initially said they will call us in for a photo fit as the men were not wearing masks, and we saw them face to face. They never did call us in for a photo fit and after we tried calling them a few times to remind them and ask how their investigation was proceeding, we gave up.

I am not very familiar with the laws with regard to using shotguns at home as a defensive weapon, what types are best and what shells are best. I don't want to ask the following questions at my range which I just joined so I will ask them anonymously here:

The gun cabinet will fit in the walk-in closet in the master bedroom. Will the police be happy with it being situated here?

Is it possible to legally own a semi automatic shotgun with several shells as a civilian?

If I get a 3+1 round shotgun initially, how easily can it be upgraded (if legal) to a larger magazine?

What shotguns do you guys recommend primarily for clay pigeon and practical shooting, but a secondary role as a home defence weapon?

What are the best shells for home defence? I am looking for something that won't raise eyebrows if bought for sports/hunting but are equally effective against humans with heavy clothing.

Is it possible to buy shotgun slugs rather than buckshot?

Is keeping a loaded shotgun by the bed always inexcusable?

Under what circumstances is it acceptable or not to use a shotgun for home defence? E.g. back shots.
 
M

Mr_Tigger

Guest
#2
Self-defence is not a valid reason to apply for a SC. If there is any hint of this you application shall be rejected.

Semis are legal.

More than 3 rounds it stops being SC and becomes FAC. You would need club membership or access to land.

Specialist ammo also needs an FAC i believe.

It is acceptable to use a shotgun in self defence when a court agrees.


PS Im sorry to hear of your ordeal. I for one would much prefer it if self defence were a valid reason.
 
#5
I would have thought in the scenario you envisage that you would not have time to get the shotgun out of the double locked cabinet (inside your wardrobe) , then unlock the ammo box and load in the time you havent been stabbed. Surely your landlord has improved security as the best defence (proper locked windows for a start) ?? forget about leaving a loaded gun under your bed permanently..

Im sorry to hear this happened.. above all dont let them win by turning you into a home defence headcase..
 
#7
Self-defence is not a valid reason to apply for a SC. If there is any hint of this you application shall be rejected.
What sort of checks do the police do to determine if you are applying for self-defence? For example can they cross reference the police report database (where I lodged police reports for all three burglaries/robbery) and then suppose I am getting the shotgun for home defence?

I idly let off steam/joked to friends after the burglaries along the lines of: "I wish I had a gun at that time". Are FB posts or emails admissible as evidence against owning a shotgun in the UK, especially since I am resident in two countries for work and my statement could have applied to the second country (US) where home defense laws are more reasonable?

Semis are legal.

It is acceptable to use a shotgun in self defence when a court agrees.
PS Im sorry to hear of your ordeal. I for one would much prefer it if self defence were a valid reason.
In England can I still expect to be arrested if I use a shotgun defensively, with my DNA/fingerprints/mugshots taken and retained forever even if the courts acquit me?
 
#8
I think you should give up on this idea, whilst I do not agree with the gun control we have the law is the law and attempting to pretend you want a firearm for another reason so you can shoot people is not a very good idea.
 
#9
1X home, for the defending of:
I have a shotgun but the security and location of the gun cabinet will prevent me from getting access to it quickly in an emergency. A large blunt object, such as Mr Tigger's excellent suggestion, is much more practical and far easier to explain to Mr Plod and a court.

You know it makes sense...

Rodney2q
 
#10
Arrows are quite quiet aren't they?

Bit like knives.

Knives are good, because they don't make any noise, and the less noise they make, the more likely we are to use them. Shit 'em right up. Makes it look like we're serious. Guns for show, knives for a pro.
 
#11
I would have thought in the scenario you envisage that you would not have time to get the shotgun out of the double locked cabinet (inside your wardrobe) , then unlock the ammo box and load in the time you havent been stabbed. Surely your landlord has improved security as the best defence (proper locked windows for a start) ?? forget about leaving a loaded gun under your bed permanently..

Im sorry to hear this happened.. above all dont let them win by turning you into a home defence headcase..
Don't even get me started on the landlord! He is the most stingy person ever. Our laminate flooring is rippled because his sons came and did a DIY job on it, one of our light fixtures is LIVE and the tiled floor in the kitchen is also uneven because of a botched DIY job.

My wife and I are rarely home and are out of the country a lot. We've actually started leaving our valuables at work, pay for a safe deposit box with the bank but leave some cash and costume jewelry at home to appease any burglars/robbers who do break in.

As for having a loaded gun under the bed unless the police do spot checks they aren't going to know about it. Dead men don't tell tales, we can always say we heard them trying to get in and had time to load the gun.
 
#12
These questions tell me that you are a wind up merchant who already knows all the answers, but if you were serious all you need is a shotgun cartridge and a mousetrap to discourage entry to your bedroom. Failing that when you hear a noise downstairs get the other half to put a facepack on..
 
#13
I do archery as a hobby and am thinking of taking up clay pigeon and practical shotgun shooting as a hobby. My ground floor flat which is in a bad area has been burgled/robbed three times before in two years, the thought of having a shotgun at home for home defence as an improvised weapon appeals.

The last time we were robbed, three guys broke into our house at around 4am through a single glazed window round the back which the landlord was too stingy to upgrade to a double glazed uPVC window. My wife and I were promptly ushered at knifepoint into a disused airing cupboard which used to hold the hot water tank (since replaced with a combi boiler). The men proceeded to utterly ransack the house.

The police arrived about 20 minutes after we freed ourselves and called them, which by then the robbers were long gone. They were not helpful and initially said they will call us in for a photo fit as the men were not wearing masks, and we saw them face to face. They never did call us in for a photo fit and after we tried calling them a few times to remind them and ask how their investigation was proceeding, we gave up.

I am not very familiar with the laws with regard to using shotguns at home as a defensive weapon, what types are best and what shells are best. I don't want to ask the following questions at my range which I just joined so I will ask them anonymously here:

The gun cabinet will fit in the walk-in closet in the master bedroom. Will the police be happy with it being situated here?

Is it possible to legally own a semi automatic shotgun with several shells as a civilian?

If I get a 3+1 round shotgun initially, how easily can it be upgraded (if legal) to a larger magazine?

What shotguns do you guys recommend primarily for clay pigeon and practical shooting, but a secondary role as a home defence weapon?

What are the best shells for home defence? I am looking for something that won't raise eyebrows if bought for sports/hunting but are equally effective against humans with heavy clothing.

Is it possible to buy shotgun slugs rather than buckshot?

Is keeping a loaded shotgun by the bed always inexcusable?

Under what circumstances is it acceptable or not to use a shotgun for home defence? E.g. back shots.
Perhaps Ex-Norfolk farmer Tony Martin can assist you....……what could possibly go wrong!?!?
 
#14
I think you should give up on this idea, whilst I do not agree with the gun control we have the law is the law and attempting to pretend you want a firearm for another reason so you can shoot people is not a very good idea.
That's not quite the story. I genuinely want to take up clay pigeon and practical target shooting as my primary reason for getting them. But it so happens shotguns are effective for home defense too.
 
#15
I do archery as a hobby and am thinking of taking up clay pigeon and practical shotgun shooting as a hobby. My ground floor flat which is in a bad area has been burgled/robbed three times before in two years, the thought of having a shotgun at home for home defence as an improvised weapon appeals.

The last time we were robbed, three guys broke into our house at around 4am through a single glazed window round the back which the landlord was too stingy to upgrade to a double glazed uPVC window. My wife and I were promptly ushered at knifepoint into a disused airing cupboard which used to hold the hot water tank (since replaced with a combi boiler). The men proceeded to utterly ransack the house.

The police arrived about 20 minutes after we freed ourselves and called them, which by then the robbers were long gone. They were not helpful and initially said they will call us in for a photo fit as the men were not wearing masks, and we saw them face to face. They never did call us in for a photo fit and after we tried calling them a few times to remind them and ask how their investigation was proceeding, we gave up.

I am not very familiar with the laws with regard to using shotguns at home as a defensive weapon, what types are best and what shells are best. I don't want to ask the following questions at my range which I just joined so I will ask them anonymously here:

The gun cabinet will fit in the walk-in closet in the master bedroom. Will the police be happy with it being situated here?

Is it possible to legally own a semi automatic shotgun with several shells as a civilian?

If I get a 3+1 round shotgun initially, how easily can it be upgraded (if legal) to a larger magazine?

What shotguns do you guys recommend primarily for clay pigeon and practical shooting, but a secondary role as a home defence weapon?

What are the best shells for home defence? I am looking for something that won't raise eyebrows if bought for sports/hunting but are equally effective against humans with heavy clothing.

Is it possible to buy shotgun slugs rather than buckshot?

Is keeping a loaded shotgun by the bed always inexcusable?

Under what circumstances is it acceptable or not to use a shotgun for home defence? E.g. back shots.
Assuming this isn't a wah, what country are you in? Armed home invasions in the UK are i believe fairly rare. I'm differentiating here between burglars going equipped and a group of individuals who have not only targeted your property but upon discovery have continued unabated. Most burglars,in spite of the odd extreme case are anxious to avoid confrontation. Do you own a very expensive car or something else unusually valuable? If not, i would suggest that you and the Mrs were fortunate, relatively speaking to escape with a loss of belongings. Applying for a shotgun or other firearm in order to prevent something similar occuring would not only be long winded but possibly rather pointless because as has been pointed out, if there was a repeat of the previous incident, by the time you had been alerted and had unlocked the double locked cabinet, removed and loaded the weapon, it would already likely be too late.
If you had one in the first instance, it is probable that the intruders would have located the cabinet during the ransack and returned to you and the wife to demand the keys for it, resulting in them being armed with a firearm.
How is your landlord with you owning say an Akita or a Malinois?
 
M

Mr_Tigger

Guest
#16
When you are filling in the application form (which you will find on your local police force website) it will ask you to identify the reason you are applying. Self defence is not a listed option but sporting use (clays) will be an option. They will do a background check and pop around for a chat. They will ask you friendly questions but if they think what you are telling them does not check out they will deny you the SC. You might well be asked about the burglaries and if they think you are not telling the true they wont issue it. Again self defence is not a lawful reason to own a shotgun in the mainland UK. Do not apply apply for one if this is your motivation. I am sure you will enjoy blasting away at clays.

Yes you will be arrested, cuffed, processed. You can have your biometrics removed if acquitted but that would take forever and a day.

GCHQ will not be doing the background check so you porn preferences will not be a problem.

BUT

Don't lie to the police. Do not buy a shotgun for self defence. That would make you a criminal.
 
#17
Don't even get me started on the landlord! He is the most stingy person ever. Our laminate flooring is rippled because his sons came and did a DIY job on it, one of our light fixtures is LIVE and the tiled floor in the kitchen is also uneven because of a botched DIY job.

My wife and I are rarely home and are out of the country a lot. We've actually started leaving our valuables at work, pay for a safe deposit box with the bank but leave some cash and costume jewelry at home to appease any burglars/robbers who do break in.

As for having a loaded gun under the bed unless the police do spot checks they aren't going to know about it. Dead men don't tell tales, we can always say we heard them trying to get in and had time to load the gun.
You're a fool.
 
#18
Bear in mind we have already been burgled/robbed three times in two years at the same address. If it happens a fourth time it won't be the burglars' fault anymore, it will be ours for being forewarned so many times but taking no further measures to stop it.

The landlord has flatly refused to install an alarm system or a grille. Begrudgingly we just renewed our tenancy agreement for another year (work for both of us is literally across the street). Dogs are out of the question - terms of the tenancy and the landlord is Muslim. As for a flashlight/club, it takes a bigger fool to go close quarters with men with knives. The police are useless - by the time they come the robbers are gone.

There is no other option other than a firearm for self-defence. Unless you have any other suggestions...
 
#19
Bear in mind we have already been burgled/robbed three times in two years at the same address. If it happens a fourth time it won't be the burglars' fault anymore, it will be ours for being forewarned so many times but taking no further measures to stop it.



There is no other option other than a firearm for self-defence. Unless you have any other suggestions...[/QUOTE]

Under the circumstances, move somewhere else with a landlord who isn't an exploitative, uncooperative ******** and accept that the inconvenience of travelling further to work is better than the trauma of being burgled, robbed again or worse.
 
#20
Assuming this isn't a wah, what country are you in? Armed home invasions in the UK are i believe fairly rare. I'm differentiating here between burglars going equipped and a group of individuals who have not only targeted your property but upon discovery have continued unabated. Most burglars,in spite of the odd extreme case are anxious to avoid confrontation.
There is a quiet street elevated above the rear French doors, bathroom window and kitchen window of the flat. All three previous break-ins came in through the rear of the property. Anyone can just jump from the street (about a 7ft drop) into our rear lawn and they are then obscured from view. Either the locks were forced with a large screwdriver or the glass broken to gain access.

Other ground floor flats along our row are often targeted as well.
 
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