Service Guarenties Citizenship

#1
Got this idea while watching Starship Troopers the other day. As those of you who have seen the film will know to become a 'citizen' you have to serve a minimum time in the armed forces.

Would this work in modern Britian? If you want to be a politician, Doctor, go to Uni or vote etc then you have to serve for 3, 4 years in the forces.

I think this would work because at the moment any idiot can vote, it doesn't matter if he has done nothing except sell drugs all of his life he still automatically get the right to vote.

Discuss

Sorry if this has already been done but did a quick search and didn't find it.
 
#3
I like the sentiment but it wouldn't work. Not everybody serves their country by stagging on! And i think we are a richer country for having it this way. If all the chavs joined the military then it would become "over chav'd" and at some point they will infect the highe echelons! At this point, its not long before berets are replaced with caps and instead of yes sir, you get "ohmygodinnit".

I would like to see it harder to get benifits, and if you can't get a job, then you do community service to get a basic benifit package!
 
#4
Oneshot said:
I like the sentiment but it wouldn't work. Not everybody serves their country by stagging on! And i think we are a richer country for having it this way. If all the chavs joined the military then it would become "over chav'd" and at some point they will infect the highe echelons! At this point, its not long before berets are replaced with caps and instead of yes sir, you get "ohmygodinnit".

I would like to see it harder to get benifits, and if you can't get a job, then you do community service to get a basic benifit package!
The chavs wouldn't have to join the army, it's not compulsory, it would just mean that they can't get the right to vote or to get certain job or go to uni etc.
 
#5
Mazur_UK said:
Oneshot said:
I like the sentiment but it wouldn't work. Not everybody serves their country by stagging on! And i think we are a richer country for having it this way. If all the chavs joined the military then it would become "over chav'd" and at some point they will infect the highe echelons! At this point, its not long before berets are replaced with caps and instead of yes sir, you get "ohmygodinnit".

I would like to see it harder to get benifits, and if you can't get a job, then you do community service to get a basic benifit package!
The chavs wouldn't have to join the army, it's not compulsory, it would just mean that they can't get the right to vote or to get certain job or go to uni etc.
My bold

from most of the election results, they don't know how to vote anyway! they don't realise why they should.
 
#8
Dangerous stuff - you are proposing a two-tier system in which the State expects service in some form to achieve the elevated status of 'citizen' and a raft of benefits that come with it. As a result a fresh underclass is created with the State imposing limits on the aspirations and potential of those who wouldn't or couldn't serve.

Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
 
#9
BluntedAtBirth said:
Did you mean the right to vote in elections or for the outcome of television shows?
elections although not being able to vote in Big Brother might be a bigger blow to the chav community....
 
#10
Victorian_Major said:
Dangerous stuff - you are proposing a two-tier system in which the State expects service in some form to achieve the elevated status of 'citizen' and a raft of benefits that come with it. As a result a fresh underclass is created with the State imposing limits on the aspirations and potential of those who wouldn't or couldn't serve.

Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
And the premise that military service is the only kind of contribution that one can make to the state is clearly rubbish - this country would collapse without an army of people workig in the commercial world.
 
S

stabradop

Guest
#11
Mazur_UK said:
Got this idea while watching Starship Troopers the other day. As those of you who have seen the film will know to become a 'citizen' you have to serve a minimum time in the armed forces.

Would this work in modern Britian? If you want to be a politician, Doctor, go to Uni or vote etc then you have to serve for 3, 4 years in the forces.

I think this would work because at the moment any idiot can vote, it doesn't matter if he has done nothing except sell drugs all of his life he still automatically get the right to vote.

Discuss

Sorry if this has already been done but did a quick search and didn't find it.
One thing you should note though is that foreign students pay a higher rate at Uni than domestic ones. They either pay for it themselves or in some case their government pays.

stab (worked for immigration for 9 years)
 
#12
Scabster_Mooch said:
Victorian_Major said:
Dangerous stuff - you are proposing a two-tier system in which the State expects service in some form to achieve the elevated status of 'citizen' and a raft of benefits that come with it. As a result a fresh underclass is created with the State imposing limits on the aspirations and potential of those who wouldn't or couldn't serve.

Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
And the premise that military service is the only kind of contribution that one can make to the state is clearly rubbish - this country would collapse without an army of people workig in the commercial world.
I'm sure there would be plently of people who would chose not to serve, or who after serveing would join the commertial market and could do those jobs.
 
#14
Anothermedalwonderer said:
Hmmmm....

What about those of us with medical conditions that exclude us from service?
I was gonna write about that, you could apply for some sort of exclusion, or chose to work in say the police as a clark etc for 2 years.
 
#15
Mazur_UK said:
Scabster_Mooch said:
Victorian_Major said:
Dangerous stuff - you are proposing a two-tier system in which the State expects service in some form to achieve the elevated status of 'citizen' and a raft of benefits that come with it. As a result a fresh underclass is created with the State imposing limits on the aspirations and potential of those who wouldn't or couldn't serve.

Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
And the premise that military service is the only kind of contribution that one can make to the state is clearly rubbish - this country would collapse without an army of people workig in the commercial world.
I'm sure there would be plently of people who would chose not to serve, or who after serveing would join the commertial market and could do those jobs.
Yes, but why should those who have never served not be entitled to the same rights as those who have? The only conceivable reason is that military service is somehow more 'important' than working in the civilian world, which as I have said, is rubbish. The country could not do without either.

edit: And why retrict access to being doctors? the country needs all the brilliant mind it can get and would do itself no good to start limiting the potential of its citizens.

Another issue: this looks like a way of securing representation for the armed forces among society's 'elite'. Why should the armed forces get that priviiedge. Why not Nursing, or Policing or Fire-fighting or .... etc etc

Sorry - typing without the aid of my left index finger - so spelling is abysmal.
 
#16
Mazur_UK said:
If you want to be a politician, Doctor, go to Uni or vote etc then you have to serve for 3, 4 years in the forces.
Imagine fighting beside Blair though.....

Adopt pathetic condescending voice

BLAIR: Yes, yes, yes Mr Taliban i am aware that you have gun, but you cannot pull the trigger until we have entered a predetermined dialogue set ou.................. (shot rings out)

Adopt voice akin to BBC newsreader

An independent enquiry reveals that Pte Blair received a gunshot wound to the arrse, thus preventing him from speaking and choking on his own words.

Pte T Atkins who dishcarged the fatal shot has been held at HM pleasure pending the cerimony to award Atkins a knighthood for services to Queen and Country.

Besides all the Prescott! PFT!
 
#18
Victorian_Major said:
Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
I thought that the premise was what would the world look like if the Nazi's had won the war.

But then on the other hand it deos show an example of civic virtue which is a sound princepal. But the main empahis is that citizenship is gain by exposing oneself to a great risk.

Personal as someone who left school at 16 and served and is now in their 20s at Uni I think it is a good way of doing things! The argument that the military ethos would be lost and replaced by that from the scum that may be enlisted I would say is false and that anyone taken in that didn't want to put into their service a possative attitude and work for the postion should be booted out and therefore not gain the citizen status.

Just a thought..
 
#19
Scabster_Mooch said:
Mazur_UK said:
Scabster_Mooch said:
Victorian_Major said:
Dangerous stuff - you are proposing a two-tier system in which the State expects service in some form to achieve the elevated status of 'citizen' and a raft of benefits that come with it. As a result a fresh underclass is created with the State imposing limits on the aspirations and potential of those who wouldn't or couldn't serve.

Might look alright on paper but even NL should blanch at this one. I always took Starship Troopers to be something of a pisstake?
And the premise that military service is the only kind of contribution that one can make to the state is clearly rubbish - this country would collapse without an army of people workig in the commercial world.
I'm sure there would be plently of people who would chose not to serve, or who after serveing would join the commertial market and could do those jobs.
Yes, but why should those who have never served not be entitled to the same rights as those who have? The only conceivable reason is that military service is somehow more 'important' than working in the civilian world, which as I have said, is rubbish. The country could not do without either.

edit: And why retrict access to being doctors? the country needs all the brilliant mind it can get and would do itself no good to start limiting the potential of its citizens.

Another issue: this looks like a way of securing representation for the armed forces among society's 'elite'. Why should the armed forces get that priviiedge. Why not Nursing, or Policing or Fire-fighting or .... etc etc

Sorry - typing without the aid of my left index finger - so spelling is abysmal.
I would agree that it wouldn't be just the Armed Forces but who ever puts in time with a public service but my suggestion would be that if you wish to go into higher education then it be unbared for course that will be of benafit to the citizens e.g Nursing, Doctors etc but the more frivlous things such as History of fingerpainting or the life and times of David Beckham could not be comensed until something had been put into sociaty first.
 
#20
Mazur_UK said:
Oneshot said:
I like the sentiment but it wouldn't work. Not everybody serves their country by stagging on! And i think we are a richer country for having it this way. If all the chavs joined the military then it would become "over chav'd" and at some point they will infect the highe echelons! At this point, its not long before berets are replaced with caps and instead of yes sir, you get "ohmygodinnit".

I would like to see it harder to get benifits, and if you can't get a job, then you do community service to get a basic benifit package!
The chavs wouldn't have to join the army, it's not compulsory, it would just mean that they can't get the right to vote or to get certain job or go to uni etc.
Chavs getting Jobs, voting or going to Uni???? like thats ever going to happen
 

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