Selection of Kiwi to play for England at Rugby

Discussion in 'Sports, Adventure Training and Events' started by schweik, Jul 1, 2008.

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  1. Riki Flutey has been selected to play for England. Another step forward for gross commercialism over the good old days when people did it for the passion etc. Have I become an old fogey, or do decisions like this take something away from the once noble sport of rugby?

    Link here:

    Quote from article here:
    "New Zealand-born centre Riki Flutey, who becomes eligible for England in September, is included.

    Flutey, 27, is a former Wellington Hurricanes player who has previously represented New Zealand at age-group levels and was a member of their U19 World Cup-winning team in 1999.

    He also represented the New Zealand Maori before joining London Irish in 2005, moving on to Wasps last summer and being voted Player of the Year by his fellow Premiership professionals last season.

    "Riki Flutey has had a fantastic year and he's there on merit as a player," Johnson said. "In the world of rugby, most teams have guys who are not born in that country.

    "It's what they do on and off the field for that team that earns them respect, not where they're born or what their passport says." "
  2. Before you get a c0ck-stand over this, hadn't you better cast your mind back to the pre-professional days and mull over Jamie Salmon's selection?

    Then drift forward through time passing such true-blue Brits as Lesley Vainikolo, Mike Catt, Matt Stevens, Phil Christopher, Dylan Hartley? What about Ubogu, Oti and Ojomo? Prince Obolensky?

    I am sure there are quite a few I've missed bearing in mind this is a spontaneous response. The All Blacks themselves have a lot of caps who were born overseas, mainly islanders.
  3. Add to that list Matt Stevens and Nick Abendanon . In cricket Pietersen, Strauss, Lamb and de Oliveira - what else is the commonwealth for if not to bolster our forces and sports teams?
  4. Definately. Where would we be every 1st weekend in May without our beloved ringers?
  5. I'm not suggesting he's the first one. Hence "another step". I'm suggesting its getting worse and I, for one, do not approve. I'm not berating England alone. Many countries follow this practice. NZ are especially bad, both for"borrowing" players from all round the pacific islands, and for NZ players finding they are qualified to play for Pacific islands, for Japan, for Wales, Scotland, England.

    Yes it happens in cricket and other sports. But rugby was (note "was") the last bastion of corinthian values. Yes I knew about "boot money" in the 70s and I also know that people have always found ways to use the rules to their advantage. HOWEVER I would still like to think that when it comes to representing one's country, that people have an affinity with, and loyalty to, their country of birth/blood, and that they stick with that country through thick and thin. I believe that professionalism has sounded the final death knell of that attitude.

    OK thats it. Rant over. Anyone who has actually read it through to the end, thank you for listening.
  6. That's OK I was happy to read through to the end. I've started worrying about my fogeyish views too.

    Hate the jerseys professional players wear nowadays; hate them running off the field at half time; hate commercial logos splattered all over every surface available; hate 'rev up' music blaring out each time the home side scores; hate the mangling of national anthems sung in peculiar ways by anorexic tarts I've never heard of (or "of whom I've never heard" :wink: ); hate tactical replacements leading to test caps for 90 seconds on the pitch at the end of match; hate the devaluation of the once noble test match into a money making vehicle to be flogged and flogged.

    Yup, definitely becoming an old fogey. Open professionalism has a lot to answer for .....
  7. Yep, bring back those heavy cotton jerseys that weigh an extra stone when it rains.
  8. At last, some like minded souls!

    And they should bring back those fcuk off big heavy leather balls, too, that weigh an extra two stone when it rains!

    But on a more serious note, I agree that many of these changes, designed to attract a "younger demographic" (and pots of cash) are changing the sport I loved to one I find it harder to relate to.
  9. Look I couldn't give a tuppeny toss about professionalism and mobile players...the danger to our game is the fecking ELVs...designed to make the game just another form of 2-D League. Get on that cause Schweik if you must!
  10. Clearly the chap is not able to make it as an All Black (after all who would choose playing for England if the alternative was to play for the All Blacks) so on this basis are England accepting second class players.
  11. Surely the implication is whatever Mr Flutey's past NZ relative ranking, he is the best centre (debatably of course) playing in English rugby? Hence his selection by those better (again very arguably) better qualified than we!
  12. I'll tell you something else that grips my sh*t - ELVs. There is virtually no discernable difference between Union and League anymore. Why back in my day .....

    I do, in fact, agree with you Cuddles.
  13. Schweik, back when the game went pro' I raved against the machine and even put my "pay" behind the bar every Saturday rather than receive it. I was incidentally 33 and perhaps if I were a pro, rather than a rather well paid defence industry exec at the time I might have felt differently! Certainly when I played first class rugby there was a lot of dodgy expenses changing hands. As an U-19 I was offered a "summer job" working on a golf resort in Portugal or Spain. Curiously enough all of the other greenskeepers were to be members of Harlequins development squad and the work was trivial. Unlike the afternoons which were all about conditioning! As luck would have it, I opted for a UN tour in Cyprus.
  14. If he is the best, perhaps it means one should be trying harder to get better players, as one is unlikely to get to the top with those who appear to have failed to make the grade with the top team. Now that is not to say he will not do his best for the team he has been chosen to play for and that he will not do his very best to earn the big bucks he will be getting.

    I suppose it just my feeling that one might persuade a very good Puma, or Azzuri, or even Springbok to jump ship, but who who hoped to be able to wear the Black Jersey would surrender that hope.
  15. I think we should go back to the old square toed forwards boots aswell


    Anyone remember getting a shoeing from one of these?
    Well maybe not quite that old but you know what I mean.

    compared to:


    I rest my case.