Scottish Independence Referendum II

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Sixty, Jan 11, 2012.

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  1. Sixty

    Sixty LE Moderator Book Reviewer
    1. ARRSE Cyclists and Triathletes

    A continuation of the previous thread, if you really must.
  2. Indeed we must!

    It appears the central question now is what Salmond hopes to achieve.
    Is he trying to con his way into devomax as his best realistic hope or is he trying to manipulate the result in favour of independence by creating a three question referendum and splitting the vote enough to get his way?
  3. Or is he taking a long term approach of gradually building experience of true governance to the point that eventually the wecannaedaeits won't have a leg to stand on?

    Playing the long game isn't entirely out if the question. Maybe that's why cmd is so keen to force the pace.

    If it's been sent from my HTC Sensation using Tapatalk then I'm probably pissed.
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  4. The polls are clear, support for independence in Scotland is running at 29%
    Salmond may be a tosser (he's a politician after all) but he can see what is infront of his nose. He has two options infront of him, devomax or some kind of campaign to win independence by splitting the vote.
    As much as I dislike Cameron he is quite right, the only fair and just option is to offer the Scots electorate a clear and simple referendum between staying in the Union or leaving.
    "devomax" is a different issue which should be settled seperatley from an independence referendum.
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  5. Sixty

    Sixty LE Moderator Book Reviewer
    1. ARRSE Cyclists and Triathletes

    Makes you wonder why he didn't push for it when the SNP were running a minority administration and the Tories (and Labour and the Libs) voted down a referendum twice doesn't it?*

    *Answer, no, it really doesn't. The sudden enthusiasm for 'fairness' appears to tie in with him fearing that there's a chance the SNP might win if allowed to run it on their own terms and now 'fair and just' are the words du jour.
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  6. To keep up with the ocasional stupid post mixed into the thread I figure if the SNP were to organise the whole thing the word freedom and a picture of mel gibson would end up on the ballot paper.
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  7. Could that be because at that time even less people in Scotland wanted it? Now that he has a bit more support, its time to relook at it.
  8. Sixty

    Sixty LE Moderator Book Reviewer
    1. ARRSE Cyclists and Triathletes

    Is that not what my second paragraph says?
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  9. If it means seeing less of Salmonds gormless gurning face on the television,bring it on asap.
  10. They are politicians. They are politician-eering. It's not really a story when it comes right down to it.
  11. Perhaps - but at some point he's going to have to tackle external issues (diplomacy, defence, security, etc) and I'm not sure how gradualism works for those - does anybody? But then I'm a dinnaewanttaedoit.

    And typing this a sudden thought came to me - who is going to pay my army pension in 2017?
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  12. No its doesnt. Possible growing support for independence isnt the same as fearing wee eck dictates the rules.
  13. Doesn't make me wonder at all really Sixty. I have yet to see a politician do anything that is motivated by anything other than self interest.
    I'm strongly opposed to breaking up the Union but as I don't live in Scotland I'm highly unlikely to get a say.

    However, the question remains, Salmond cannot get a result in favour of independence in a straight vote and he knows it. The polls are unequivical on that one. So what is it he is really trying to achieve.
    Logically he can only be aiming to achieve one of two things, devomax or a manipulated result by means of skulduggery. Slamond might be an astute politician but the Scots deserve a clear and fair referendum to have their say. What the SNP appear to be aiming for is a way to split the referndum vote and magically turn 29% support into 51%
    I appreciate thoise who support independence will be happy however the SNP manage to make it happen but its to important an question for politicians to be allowed to manipulate the result.

    If there is to be a referendum make it yes or no. The devomax bollox can be decided after.
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  14. I'm loving this!

    Even if Cameron loses, the result is 41 less Labour MP's in the Houses of Parliament, and less Lib Dems.

    We keep hearing that every time Cameron speaks, the SNP wins more votes - well, who from? Its not like he's losing Conservative voters up there, is it? Nope, he's weakening Labour, again, a win Scenario.

    So - lose the referendum and Cameron virtually guarantees a Conservative majority in the next election. Whats he got to lose?

    Win the referendum on the issue of independence on a single yes/no referendum , and he kills Devomax, as there is "no mandate from the people for a change in the constitutional settlement"
  15. The idealist and romantic in me would love to see an independent Scotland, the realist in me worries about it.

    I think Cameron has only now realised what was blatantly obvious to most of us, that 2014 is the 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn.

    Wee Eck has had this up his sleeve for a while now and until Cameron tried to force his hand, avoided any reference to it.

    Cameron knows it'll be used shamelessly that year. It'll be trumpeted everywhere (before and during the Commonwealth Games) and you'll see Jock Jingoism on an unimaginable level, with a swing in support that'll see independence become a reality.

    I wonder if Morningside and the Grange will be partitioned?
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