Scots requesting Military Aid to clear snow/ice

#1
From BBC news this morning.

Personally I'm disgusted by the cheek of it. It is the local authority's responsibility to clear the snow and ice.

Not only is it not a military specialisation to pick up a shovel (I.e any fat lazy council office worker can pick one up), but treating the military as general dogs bodies shows a distinct lack of respect.

Hopefully commanders will chin it off.
 
#3
The military has enough on it's plate without this crap! How about rounding up the dole queue as they sign on and using them!!!
 
#4
Dingerr,

You forget it is also the job of the MOD to subsidise local economies in Scotland! If the MOD does get involved I hope we present them with the capitation bill.

Do they not have plenty of people on community service that could do this?
 
#5
Whilst it is the local authority's responsibility the conditions are unusual. It would seem ridiculous for local government to employ loads of extra bods on the off chance that they might be needed to varied levels throughout the year. In the meantime government manpower is available, along with equipment, from the Armed Forces.

But quite apart from the above, there is a lot of good will towards the Armed Forces in the general population at the moment and offering to help would only increase that standing. When people are struggling due the weather telling them to "chin off" will only lose you good will.
 
#6
Whilst it is the local authority's responsibility the conditions are unusual. It would seem ridiculous for local government to employ loads of extra bods on the off chance that they might be needed to varied levels throughout the year. In the meantime government manpower is available, along with equipment, from the Armed Forces.

But quite apart from the above, there is a lot of good will towards the Armed Forces in the general population at the moment and offering to help would only increase that standing. When people are struggling due the weather telling them to "chin off" will only lose you good will.

Bollocks! The army has enough to do and definitely doesn't need this as well!...I love your "the conditions are unusual", I mean, whoever would expect it to snow in winter and in Scotland!

There are more than enough dole scroungers and profesional layabouts, without having to ask the army for help! Or maybe, do what I have to do over here and clear it yourself!
 
#7
I agree with other comments about using the armed forces as a source of mass labour. However, my understanding is that it was a Labour MP who has raised this issue, in a parliamentary question, and that he criticises the Scottish Government for NOT requesting such help from Westminster.

If such help had been requested for Scotland, I see no reason to treat it differently from any other part of the United Kingdom.

In fact, the Army in Scotland has been assisting the Scottish Ambulance Service in the Central Belt with 4x4 vehicles. Heavy plant might have been useful in the unusual conditions, with the blades breaking off snowploughs and roads and motorways blocked with vehicles, but (if requested) it would be difficult to bring equipment up from England in the conditions.

Edit: Edinburgh City Council reported in talks with Scottish Govt and military authorities about help with SNIC.
 
#8
From BBC news this morning.

Personally I'm disgusted by the cheek of it. It is the local authority's responsibility to clear the snow and ice.

Not only is it not a military specialisation to pick up a shovel (I.e any fat lazy council office worker can pick one up), but treating the military as general dogs bodies shows a distinct lack of respect.

Hopefully commanders will chin it off.
You want Council office workers to get off their fat arses and shovel snow??????
You havin a laff? Just trying to get them to do their own jobs is an effort of olympic standards.
Anyhoo its been snowing and they'll all be nice and cosy and warm at home!
 
#9
the practical problem if there is enough snow needing a mass army of dole scum to clear it how are the dole scum suppoused to get where you need the snow cleared?
bit like how the snow plough workers get to work.
its ranting by the hard of thinking
 
#11
What are you all fussed about? This is Military Aid to The Civil Community, it's part of UK Operations. And the Civil Authorities will have to pay for it because life is not at threat. To the hole.
 
#13
You want Council office workers to get off their fat arses and shovel snow??????
You havin a laff? Just trying to get them to do their own jobs is an effort of olympic standards.
Anyhoo its been snowing and they'll all be nice and cosy and warm at home!
Last line should read" Anyhoo its been snowing and they'll all be nice and cosy and warm at home on extended sick leave on full pay"
 
#14
First off ,who do they ask ? Local garrison commander ? MoD ?
I hope whoever it is turns round and tells them where to shove it.
 
#15
Bollocks! The army has enough to do and definitely doesn't need this as well!...I love your "the conditions are unusual", I mean, whoever would expect it to snow in winter and in Scotland!

There are more than enough dole scroungers and profesional layabouts, without having to ask the army for help! Or maybe, do what I have to do over here and clear it yourself!
I am sure that those people in difficulty would, given the choice, rather have an organised body to people come to their aid who can look after themselves in these conditions, have extensive communications, vehicles suitable for these conditions, are first aid trained, etc etc rather than a rable of scroungers etc who are none of the above. Note that many of the people who would be helped are paying your wages either directly or via VAT, fuel duty etc. When your in a muddle and a truck appears from nowhere with a load of blokes and supplies to offer you help it disposes you to feel more charitable to the veteran who might be injured and needing help at a later stage. After all, who would have thought that joining an Army at war could lead to getting injured! The Military Covenant works both ways.

As for the financing of the help. All it is is an inter departmental transfer from one government department to another. Easy.
 
#16
How dare the Army be required for help in Scotland, what an outrage. It is completely different to the Army helping out when York gets flooded...........oh, hang on minute......

**********.
 
#17
I can see the logic of using cadets and TA units who are not involved with operational tours or intensive training. Especially if the units have access to decent 4x4 vehicles, tools and the essentialy norgy of hot unidentifiable orange liquid. I think that would be a capital idea. Bit of hard work and some team work. Be quite rewarding for some. You see some doing it around London here and there such as clearing around rail stations etc usually in uniform and I always go and give them words of thanks. I get the impression that they are quite happy to help and appreciate the thanks from local people for helping out. It strikes me that there should be more of them out there. I agree with Dingerr that using busy regular units is not right though.
What a spiffing idea Mr D - the kids can't get to school and the teachers aren't in anyway and the TA can't get to their jobs so might aswell don thier C95 and start digging. There is a unit up there currently driving paramedics around in Landrovers, because ambulances are not 4X4, perhaps the next time the ambulance service buys some vehicles they will be. That unit has just returned from a 7 month tour and are just starting the FORM cycle again, acclimatisation works both ways you know.
 
#18
What are you all fussed about? This is Military Aid to The Civil Community, it's part of UK Operations. And the Civil Authorities will have to pay for it because life is not at threat. To the hole.
No it's not, your wrong, get yourself to the hole.
 
#19
As the good book (JDP2-02) explains, we're here for those imminent threats to life, and also some bespoke roles. We're not scaled, funded nor equipped to be at the beck and call of local councils too lazy or incompetent to do some basic emergency planning - a conversation which in scotland should go like 'it can snow heavily here, so lets ensure our emergency planning takes that into account and not just go for the ring up the Army option'.

The Armed Forces are training to do a job - doing snow clearance takes them away from that training. The TA would have to be mobilised to use properly (yes, its true, don't get me started on that one), and even if we used their MTDs, we're wasting scarce MTDs which could be used to train for Ops, on clearing snow and doing the councils work for them.

I've no problems helping where life is at stake, but I have serious issues using the armed forces (some of the few people of Scotland who seem to work for a living), to do the councils work for them.
 
#20
As the good book (JDP2-02) explains, we're here for those imminent threats to life, and also some bespoke roles. We're not scaled, funded nor equipped to be at the beck and call of local councils too lazy or incompetent to do some basic emergency planning - a conversation which in scotland should go like 'it can snow heavily here, so lets ensure our emergency planning takes that into account and not just go for the ring up the Army option'.

The Armed Forces are training to do a job - doing snow clearance takes them away from that training. The TA would have to be mobilised to use properly (yes, its true, don't get me started on that one), and even if we used their MTDs, we're wasting scarce MTDs which could be used to train for Ops, on clearing snow and doing the councils work for them.

I've no problems helping where life is at stake, but I have serious issues using the armed forces (some of the few people of Scotland who seem to work for a living), to do the councils work for them.
You arrogant English ********. Have you ever lived in Scotland? You seem to be way off the mark, there is a whole other Scotland outside of inner city Glasgow you know. Your generalisation is pish.

Once again, I bring it you your short sighted attention that the Army has helped out on more than one occasion when York floods, again, as much a matter of life or death as getting trapped in snow, but I suppose that is ok because York is in sunny old England, where everyone has a job don’t you know.
 

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