Scots regiments in Canada & reinforced companies

Discussion in 'Infantry' started by DonnMac2, Dec 1, 2004.

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  1. Below is a letter that is in the Scotsman saying that it some of it units (in the Reserve as well) field reinforced companies which maintain the Scottish tradition of many of its regiments.

    I've noticed something similar with the Guards regiments.

    The Coldstream Guards has No 7 Company carrying the Colours of the 2nd Battalion which is in suspended animation.

    The Scots Guards has F Company carrying the Colours of the 2nd Battalion which is in suspended animation.

    The Grenadier Guards 1st Battalion has the 'Inkerman Company' retaining the inherited privileges of the 3rd Battalion.

    The Grenadier Guards also has Nijmegen Company carrying the Colours of the 2nd Battalion which is in suspended animation.

    If this can be done to protect battalion identity in the Guards why is it not even considered for the Scottish regiments?

    Wed 1 Dec 2004

    Scots regiments in Canada

    In following the disgraceful plan of the British government to axe the Scottish regiments it struck me as ironic that, when the plan is implemented, Canada, with 16 militia, or army reserve, units represented will have more Scottish units than the United Kingdom.

    While it is true that many of these units field only a reinforced company, they maintain the Scottish tradition in the Canadian Army and provide a tangible reminder of the thousands of Scots who emigrated to Canada and helped build our nation.

    Despite what the Ministry of Defence and the government might do to the Scottish regiments, the traditions of the Scottish soldier will be maintained here.

    Barrett Street, Wolfe Island
    Ontario, Canada
  2. I sat the Falklands war out at BATUS perm staff. The Canadien people where 100% on our side.
    I will never forget the editon of the evening news when the Senior announcer took over and smiling ear to ear said,
    The Brits have done it the Union Flag flys over Stanley.
    Evan the cowboys down the 'HAT' stopped kicking the sh1t out of tired and emotional squaddies for the duration.
  3. Yes, but ISTR that Canadian militia regiments are held up as the very reason why we shouldn't cling to capbadges.

    A Canadian militia regiment is established for 2 coy, the fighting company and the HQ/ recruiting/ support company.

    The fighting company has 2 rifle platoons, or about 60 men.

    The admin coy is the RRTT etc. and is not deployable.

    So, those 16 Scottish militia regiments have 32 platoons, or about 2 full battalions worth.

    Sorry to say, but the Canadian militia system is a shambles, and capbadge loyalty is the very thing that destroyed it.

    The UK had a brief flirtation with a similar system in the 1970's. Rather than disband 4th Queens (The Diehards), the Royal Hampshires and the Gloucesters they were reduced to companies for a time. It didn't work, and retaining capbadges is the route to doing to the regulars what has already been done to the TA.
  4. At one time there were 31 regiments in the Canadian Armed Forces that represented or were ' descended ' from Scottish/Highland units..part of the legacy from British rule.. now.. there are only 16 and they are all Reserve Regiments..having been ' downsized 'when a previous government decided to ' save money ' and 'amalgamate ' the military...

    While the designations remain..the ' reminders' of the Scottish heritage [ i.e. kilts and such ] are not ' covered ' by the government.. this expense is borne by the Regimental Associations and others who privately kit the troops and supplement those aspects of the traditions and history from 'supplementary ' and ' discretionary ' funds.. many cases. the government can't even cough up enough funds to adequately pay for training and equipment...Still. it remains a source of pride and defiance to uphold the traditions and legacy that rests with each unit and the rivalry spurs the efforts...The Toronto Scottish in 2000 were granted the additional designation " Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother's Own " on the occasion of her 100 birthday...The Black Watch continues as a Canadian unit and many other ' Scottish ' units trace their roots back to the 7 Years War and the War of 1812...

    The Government has shaken up and stirred up lots of sh*t over time but one thing it hasn't been able to do is shut down the honour that the units gained and hold.. The protests and lobbying by thousdands of retired and serving soldiers of all ranks and their ' voting ' power come election time has , so far, kept the yabbos in government cowed and unable to further screw matters up...

    How long that can last is anybody's guess but the regiments will fight to the death..too bad it has to be against their own' masters' ...don't envy the Home Units in the UK their task of keeping the idiots at bay...
  5. What should be remembered is that geography has a much greater effect in Canada than it does in Britain. For instance, my Regiment has two squadrons seperated by more than 800km. It is one of the few instances of this in Canada and causes a great dificulty: you trying being the CO of a unit with one Sqn in London and the other in Edinburgh. Try training.

    This is what makes Canada's choice to keep infantry units under one cap badge sensible: they usually exist in VERY distant locations (the only exceptions to this might be in Toronto and Montreal), where it would be otherwise impossible to maintain regimental cohesion. The same does not apply to the UK, where almost everything is within a two-hour drive/train.

    I should add that most reserve regiments in Canada have anywhere from 300 to 400 under their cap badge at any given time (we must recall that there are many extra-regimental jobs, and that these are volunteers who show up when they want to!). This coincides with the strength of the average 1 batallion regiment. The other point to note is that under Land Forces Reserve Restructure (LFRR), many of these 'regiments' will add another sub-unit. (reserve forces will go from 16,500 to 18,000)

    In sum, I think our reserve 'regiments' make sense for us and add up to a viable cultural organisation worthy of sustaining a single cap badge. Whether that works in the UK is another matter.


    Canadian Serving in the UK
  6. That would be the old 1 / 51 Highland (Black Watch) - Coys based in Perth, Dundee, Kirkaldy and London.
  7. I dread to think of the travelling involved with the old 2/51 Highland..... everywhere from the Utter Hebrides to the right-hand coast. Far from a "two hour drive". Right up there with 4 Para, especially once you added the Lovat Scouts mob in the Orkneys.

    Or 52nd Lowland Regiment - Dumfries, Motherwell, Glasgow, Bathgate, Edinburgh, Galashiels. With a mix of three regimental identities (four if you count the Motherwell mob who still secretly think they're Cameronian :) )
  8. Bad CO

    Bad CO LE Admin Reviews Editor Gallery Guru

    For an interesting and very readable analysis of why the Canadian Armed Forces are in their current poor condition can I suggest Who Killed the Canadian Military?
  9. Yes it is a shambles, but it is not "cap badge loyalty" that is responsible, it is Government policy.

    Cpa badge loyalty is the very thing that kept Canadian militia units alive pre WW1 and during the inter war period. It is the very "cap badge loyalty" and Regimental spirit that kept those units alive. The Canadian militia was in worse shape then, but not by much.

    If Canadian militia infantry units go to one badge it will be the accomplishment of the mess that started with Unification in the first place.

    It's all a very bad idea.
  10. That's now the 51st Highland Regiment - battalion training weekends were a delight to behold - punters turning up at 10 am on Saturday and having to leave at 3am on Sunday morning to get back in time for the last flight / ferry...ah memories...