Army Rumour Service

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Scotland & Independence

The parochial view is all well and good but while I may be wrong, my impression is that the idea being promoted is that the day after I Day then Scotland would automatically enter the EU with all those glorious susidies.

That's not how it works. There would need to be a period of application which could be lengthy while the Scots economy slides further down.
The worry in some EU countries like Spain is how to compensate for the loss of a contributing country after Brexit.
This has come as a nasty surprise to those countries who counted on being net receivers for some time to come and have had to face a reduction in what they get. A new net receiver might not be welcomed with open arms.
Secondly, as noted before, Spain will fight tooth and nail against taking in a country that has declared independence from the State. There is no way they will give support to anything that could aid the cause of Catalan Independence. Their veto may count as Spain's status as a big country in the EU has risen after Brexit. While the Spanish economy is a disaster their political support for EU policies may well prove important and so a quid pro quo could come into play. Scotland may find themselves outside with the way in blocked.
I imagine that isn't common gossip in the SNP as it won't fit the received wisdom.
In fact, the SNP have distanced themselves from their Catalan brethren.
 
I can’t ever imagine a situation where NI became part of Scotland. I also cannot see NI becoming part of a united Ireland for at least 40 years, I can, however, I can see a situation of an extremely devolved and possible an independent Norther Ireland.
If Scotland goes, then the UK goes. It will be just England and Wales in a new union called Britain. There can be no reason for Ulster to be part of Britain and to continue to subsidise it. The population consists of Irish Irish and Scots Irish, so a new independent Scotland would have to work it out with the ROI.

During the last referendum in 2014 there were worries in Northern Ireland as to what would happen if the Scots did vote for independence.
 
Last edited:
The parochial view is all well and good but while I may be wrong, my impression is that the idea being promoted is that the day after I Day then Scotland would automatically enter the EU with all those glorious susidies.

That's not how it works. There would need to be a period of application which could be lengthy while the Scots economy slides further down.
The worry in some EU countries like Spain is how to compensate for the loss of a contributing country after Brexit.
This has come as a nasty surprise to those countries who counted on being net receivers for some time to come and have had to face a reduction in what they get. A new net receiver might not be welcomed with open arms.
Secondly, as noted before, Spain will fight tooth and nail against taking in a country that has declared independence from the State. There is no way they will give support to anything that could aid the cause of Catalan Independence. Their veto may count as Spain's status as a big country in the EU has risen after Brexit. While the Spanish economy is a disaster their political support for EU policies may well prove important and so a quid pro quo could come into play. Scotland may find themselves outside with the way in blocked.
I imagine that isn't common gossip in the SNP as it won't fit the received wisdom.
I actually think the EU would take them on, fast tracked after independence. Its another country to bring the numbers up to 28, and the economic criteria for entry is always ignored by the EU when ever it suits them. Look at Romania and Bulgaria. In 2007 there was no way they met the criteria for entry and the EU's own officials told them this. But the EU just ignored their own officials and waved them through. They still do not meet the criteria and corruption is endemic in both countries.

If Norway applied to join today it would be a member by tomorow as a net contributor and all its economic resources.

Unlike Catalan, Scotland has always been a distinct country even in a union with the rest of the UK. It has about the same population as Denmark, Finland and Ireland who all manage all right. It has always had its own law The EU is not worried about upsetting England now that Brexit is done.

Would Vlad be keen to take on a country that has more alcoholics than Russia. China probably has more interest's closer to home and would not want to upset the EU now that it has signed a trade deal with it.

The best part though would be Ireland having to up its contributions significantly to pay for Scotland (and Northern Ireland.
 

Dwarf

LE
In fact, the SNP have distanced themselves from their Catalan brethren.
Interesting. They supported Catalan self-determination at the time.
Obviously their stance is with an eye on garnering support in Europe.
Shows their idealism is a veneer.
 

Dwarf

LE
I actually think the EU would take them on, fast tracked after independence. Its another country to bring the numbers up to 28, and the economic criteria for entry is always ignored by the EU when ever it suits them. Look at Romania and Bulgaria. In 2007 there was no way they met the criteria for entry and the EU's own officials told them this. But the EU just ignored their own officials and waved them through. They still do not meet the criteria and corruption is endemic in both countries.

If Norway applied to join today it would be a member by tomorow as a net contributor and all its economic resources.

Unlike Catalan, Scotland has always been a distinct country even in a union with the rest of the UK. It has about the same population as Denmark, Finland and Ireland who all manage all right. It has always had its own law The EU is not worried about upsetting England now that Brexit is done.

Would Vlad be keen to take on a country that has more alcoholics than Russia. China probably has more interest's closer to home and would not want to upset the EU now that it has signed a trade deal with it.

The best part though would be Ireland having to up its contributions significantly to pay for Scotland (and Northern Ireland.
That's a very plausible scenario. Your points about Romania and Bulgaria are well made. Also the Mediterranean countries of Spain, Italy, and Greece also had their books massaged to allow entry which the EU was aware of but skated over as the political project was more important.
Corruption is also endemic in these countries and especially in Spain overloaded with people with their trotters in the trough. (Spain has double the number of politicians than Germany with about half the population.)
While France may want Scotland as thumbing their nose at England, Germany may be more rational. After having to bail out Greece the German voter is getting less happy with having to pay for others.
I still think Spain will be the obstacle to overcome though.

(As an aside without trying to divert the thread, Catalonia and The Basque Country have always maintained their national identities. Spain militarily maintained power over them and unlike England with Scotland, insisted they were Spanish against the feelings of the Catalans and Basques.)
 
Interesting. They supported Catalan self-determination at the time.
Obviously their stance is with an eye on garnering support in Europe.
Shows their idealism is a veneer.
Last year Sturgeon tweeted: “The EU commission building in Brussels tonight (and if you look carefully you’ll see that they do appear to have left a light on for us).”
Peter Grant, the SNP's Treasury spokesman and former Europe spokesman at Westminster, attempted to claim the EU commission were behind it.
He said: "What a strange thing to do for a European commission that Labour and the Tories say doesn’t want Scotland back in.”
A spokesman from the commission refuted the claims, it had "not been “involved in the light projected on the Berlaymont”
He said permission should have been sought, but had not been.
Edinburgh company Double Take Projections were hired by the SNP for the stunt

She then retweeted the same picture a few days ago

1609842092251.png
 
What , are you telling me the nats concocted a stunt and then lied about it?
im shocked to the core!
still if they can fib about so much else and get it past the gullible vote fodder in Scotland, I suppose why not.
 

Auld-Yin

ADC
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Reviews Editor
Last year Sturgeon tweeted: “The EU commission building in Brussels tonight (and if you look carefully you’ll see that they do appear to have left a light on for us).”
Peter Grant, the SNP's Treasury spokesman and former Europe spokesman at Westminster, attempted to claim the EU commission were behind it.
He said: "What a strange thing to do for a European commission that Labour and the Tories say doesn’t want Scotland back in.”
A spokesman from the commission refuted the claims, it had "not been “involved in the light projected on the Berlaymont”
He said permission should have been sought, but had not been.
Edinburgh company Double Take Projections were hired by the SNP for the stunt

She then retweeted the same picture a few days ago

View attachment 536108
I doubt very much that the company Double Take Productions were paid by the SNP - I suspect that this would have been paid by ScotGov. Which the SNP seem to think is their banker at the moment.
 
Countries waiting to join the EU.

There are five recognised candidates for membership of the European Union: Turkey (applied in 1987), North Macedonia (applied in 2004), Montenegro (applied in 2008 ), Albania (applied in 2009), and Serbia (applied in 2009).

Whilst these are not big hitters finacially, how do you think they would react if Scotland was fast tracked into the EU? If Scotland was given certain special conditions for entry outwith the normal EU requirements, there would surely be questions asked and not just from those members who have already applied.
One of the main conditions for entry into th EU is:

a functioning market economy and the capacity to cope with competition and market forces in the EU;


Currently the SNP don't even know what currency they will be using on the day of independence, let alone anything else!
 

FHA

LE
Interesting. They supported Catalan self-determination at the time.
Obviously their stance is with an eye on garnering support in Europe.
Shows their idealism is a veneer.


I posted on the other thread after I’d been in Edinburgh with one of my lads, for the last pre-Covid University open day.
There was a March of the Muppets that day (or All Under One Banner as they call it.)
The Estelada Blava was commonly carried alongside the EU flag. Not really thought it through, have they?


Sent from my iPhone
 
Last edited:
Countries waiting to join the EU.

There are five recognised candidates for membership of the European Union: Turkey (applied in 1987), North Macedonia (applied in 2004), Montenegro (applied in 2008 ), Albania (applied in 2009), and Serbia (applied in 2009).

Whilst these are not big hitters finacially, how do you think they would react if Scotland was fast tracked into the EU? If Scotland was given certain special conditions for entry outwith the normal EU requirements, there would surely be questions asked and not just from those members who have already applied.
One of the main conditions for entry into th EU is:

a functioning market economy and the capacity to cope with competition and market forces in the EU;


Currently the SNP don't even know what currency they will be using on the day of independence, let alone anything else!
The Jocks will never get in the EU whilst they continue to breach human rights , banning salad , fruit and fresh vegetables from supermarkets and restaurants is criminal .
 
The Jocks will never get in the EU whilst they continue to breach human rights , banning salad , fruit and fresh vegetables from supermarkets and restaurants is criminal .
You do know that the pish you come out with is what the SNP try and push.

They’re trying to create division.

Well done fool. Thank you for being a useful fool for the SNP cause.
 
Afternoon Andy. The problem down here is all we hear. ( or read) is the Nats poison. From the man on the Clapham omnibus’s point of view,he sees or hears virtually no Scot publicly taking the fight to them and saying bollox to that. With the honourable exception of George Galloway nada.
The cleverest trick the snp pulled was to slyly weaponise the low level casual anti English bigotry.( you know the sort of thing a piss head would come out with in a bar , and everyone else would just smirk and not pull them up.) Lots of Scots shamefully went along (or agreed)
Now they have conflagrated this into “ if you don’t agree with all that we do you must be on the side of the English,Note not pro U.K. but on the side of the “ auld enemy”( sic). so the rest stay quiet to avoid the neds attentions.
That clever trick needs to be broken , but it can only be done by scots.
The nats have ensured that anyone who doesn’t have a accent from north of Gretna, has no part of discourse of what happens in the land of the Scoti .
I would say in conclusion and with sadness that an increasing number of my countrymen see very little coming out of Scotland at present that would make them WANT to maintain a union .
 
Afternoon Andy. The problem down here is all we hear. ( or read) is the Nats poison. From the man on the Clapham omnibus’s point of view,he sees or hears virtually no Scot publicly taking the fight to them and saying bollox to that. With the honourable exception of George Galloway nada.
The cleverest trick the snp pulled was to slyly weaponise the low level casual anti English bigotry.( you know the sort of thing a piss head would come out with in a bar , and everyone else would just smirk and not pull them up.) Lots of Scots shamefully went along (or agreed)
Now they have conflagrated this into “ if you don’t agree with all that we do you must be on the side of the English,Note not pro U.K. but on the side of the “ auld enemy”( sic). so the rest stay quiet to avoid the neds attentions.
That clever trick needs to be broken , but it can only be done by scots.
The nats have ensured that anyone who doesn’t have a accent from north of Gretna, has no part of discourse of what happens in the land of the Scoti .
I would say in conclusion and with sadness that an increasing number of my countrymen see very little coming out of Scotland at present that would make them WANT to maintain a union .
Beware of the internet opinion pieces. They distort the narrative.

Work on the assumption that most people don’t feel like posting opinions and her fire don’t bother.

There’s been a lot of vocal criticism of the nats, but they’ve cleverly taken advantage of the collapse of Labour In Scotland to gain power and believe that they speak for all of Scotland.

I suspect you’ll start seeing now that Brexit is over and done with, now we’ve got control over legislation again, people will revert back to voting SNP for local elections and the more traditional parties in the general elections.

Why’s free all would you vote for a regional party that has no say in multi regional issues.

The SNP thought they’d be king makers in Westminster, but the only politicians who wanted their supper were the desperate minority who were fanatical pro EU.

I’m hoping that Brexit will see a resurgence in decent quality parliamentarians now, which as you can see from Ian Blackford in the house are somewhat lacking in the SNPs party.
 

Dredd

LE
I actually think the EU would take them on, fast tracked after independence. Its another country to bring the numbers up to 28, and the economic criteria for entry is always ignored by the EU when ever it suits them. Look at Romania and Bulgaria. In 2007 there was no way they met the criteria for entry and the EU's own officials told them this. But the EU just ignored their own officials and waved them through. They still do not meet the criteria and corruption is endemic in both countries.

Disagree - because Scotland is not likely to be a net contributor. And when Romania and Bulgaria joined, there was a large net contributor in the Union that isn't there any more.

If Norway applied to join today it would be a member by tomorow as a net contributor and all its economic resources.

Totally agree. In fact, they are probably viewed as members-in-all-but-name already even though they are only in EFTA. For the same reason as above - one of their purses has recently gone missing.
 

Dredd

LE
Afternoon Andy. The problem down here is all we hear. ( or read) is the Nats poison. From the man on the Clapham omnibus’s point of view,he sees or hears virtually no Scot publicly taking the fight to them and saying bollox to that. With the honourable exception of George Galloway nada.
The cleverest trick the snp pulled was to slyly weaponise the low level casual anti English bigotry.( you know the sort of thing a piss head would come out with in a bar , and everyone else would just smirk and not pull them up.) Lots of Scots shamefully went along (or agreed)
Now they have conflagrated this into “ if you don’t agree with all that we do you must be on the side of the English,Note not pro U.K. but on the side of the “ auld enemy”( sic). so the rest stay quiet to avoid the neds attentions.
That clever trick needs to be broken , but it can only be done by scots.
The nats have ensured that anyone who doesn’t have a accent from north of Gretna, has no part of discourse of what happens in the land of the Scoti .
I would say in conclusion and with sadness that an increasing number of my countrymen see very little coming out of Scotland at present that would make them WANT to maintain a union .

This was always the SNP intention - drip, drip, drip - until the 'other side' gave in through exasperation.

They must be delighted that they have had almost 17 years of this uninterrupted poison slowly eating away at our Union, like the malignant cancer that they are. And currently, no end in sight. Well, except for their goal. And the longer they get to drip the closer they see their goal. It gives them the same effect that edging achieves and they think they are close to a happy ending.
 

mrboo

War Hero
I personally don't see why anyone who voted NO in 2014 would change to a Yes vote .The arguments to leave have not changed . But the one's to remain have the oil has gone the hard liners still don't want any else to govern Scotland apart from Scot so no to the EU. Plus you have the real possibility of a hard border among other things.
 
There’s been a lot of vocal criticism of the nats, but they’ve cleverly taken advantage of the collapse of Labour In Scotland to gain power and believe that they speak for all of Scotland.

I suspect you’ll start seeing now that Brexit is over and done with, now we’ve got control over legislation again, people will revert back to voting SNP for local elections and the more traditional parties in the general elections.
Surely the time has come to form a new Scottish Unionist party in Scotland to take on the SNP. Labour are finished in Scotland, the Conservatives, although meant to be a unionist party are still too toxic. Look how quickly Nigel Farages Brexit party took off. Times they are a changing.
 
I think to really wind up the SNP, Trump needs to fly over and offer to buy Scotland and turn it into the world's largest golf course
 

HCL

LE
Afternoon Andy. The problem down here is all we hear. ( or read) is the Nats poison. From the man on the Clapham omnibus’s point of view,he sees or hears virtually no Scot publicly taking the fight to them and saying bollox to that. With the honourable exception of George Galloway nada.
The cleverest trick the snp pulled was to slyly weaponise the low level casual anti English bigotry.( you know the sort of thing a piss head would come out with in a bar , and everyone else would just smirk and not pull them up.) Lots of Scots shamefully went along (or agreed)
Now they have conflagrated this into “ if you don’t agree with all that we do you must be on the side of the English,Note not pro U.K. but on the side of the “ auld enemy”( sic). so the rest stay quiet to avoid the neds attentions.
That clever trick needs to be broken , but it can only be done by scots.
The nats have ensured that anyone who doesn’t have a accent from north of Gretna, has no part of discourse of what happens in the land of the Scoti .
I would say in conclusion and with sadness that an increasing number of my countrymen see very little coming out of Scotland at present that would make them WANT to maintain a union .
Screenshot_20210105_211213.jpg
 

Latest Threads

Top