Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by chiefwiggum, Nov 10, 2004.
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Is this just more new labour cr*p?
Perhaps his next seat will be in Scotland, or does this smack of pre-election false promises, watch out for February.
Yes I do think it is more New Labour crap on top of the rest of it.
If this is true then what a farce.
Good luck to the BW, but what about the other equally good and historic battalions that do not happen to be in Iraq right now simply because they have either just returned or are about to go or are in Afghanistan or NI etc etc?
Typical New Labour fishing for votes.
Apparently it is not just the Watch that have been 'saved' but the other regiments with Highland in their name - even the Royal Highland Fusiliers who are a Lowland Regt recruiting from Glasgow and south west of Scotland!
If this stands it means the demise of 2 great Regiments in a merger between The Royal Scots and the Kings Own Scottish Borderers.
So if this is correct and TbLiar has ordered a bit of a u-turn then the fight moves to saving RS & KOSB.
To start with I would take the Sun report with a big pinch of salt. I do hope it is true because it will completely undermine any logic the Gov't trot out for force reductions. What is their logic for a reversal? To which regiments will the focus shift now? This would be an excellent example of he who shouts the loudest wins.
Christ these politicians are a despicable lot. Liars, lacking credibility and no backbone. General Jackson must be pulling his hair out.
This also confirms that the reduction has no military logic but is treasury driven.
Birdie - the govt is still cutting Bns only not putting the remainder into 'large' regiments. RS & KSOB will merge into one Regt leaving one Scottish Regiment less on establishment.
DO NOT BELIEVE THIS.
Bliar has form on this kind of gesture. He is trying to disassociate himself from the cutbacks, leaving TCH to take the flak. The same happened with foot-and-mouth, the Dome and many other fiascos.
His media staff will have leaked this to friendly journos - and the Sun are about as tame as you get.
More to follow on Bliar's pedigree on this thread:
BBC Today programme item on the issue is at:
Cheers XI. But the logic of a reprieve for the BW is based on what thinking in Hoon's twisted mind? It is purely political vote sucking. It only adds to the illusion that a force reduction is required. No-one on the political nor senior Army scene has yet justified reduction in forces when committments are growing.
All the cr*p about numbers of troops from the commonwealth is also a distraction. What is wrong with recruiting O/S. I was recruited O/S and noone ever doubted my committment and loyalty to Queen and Country. Anyone who has fought alongside a Fijian, a Kiwi, an Aussie or a Canuk will not have been disappointed.
The Regiments under threat should kick up more of a fuss and keep the pressure on as it will generate even greater farce and that can only be helpful.
But its not about a simple reduction in forces, its about an increase in availability of forces. Mergers etc aren't the real issue, its the ending of the Arms Plot that will affect our lives the most.
The Scottish Regiments have always had very vocal support, is the realtive silence of the English and Welsh Regiments an indication that they at least understand the big picture?
I agree there are two issues at stake; the force reductions that lack logic and the death of the Arms Plot that a number of serving officers say is a sensible progression. I'm sorry but I don't agree.
One of the attractions in joining my Regt was to serve around the world and I'm sure this is an overlooked recruiting impact. I know that all units will still need to rotate through op tours but lets face it do you really want to be Caterrick based for your full 22. What about trickle posting I hear you say but how easy will that be to reduce when money gets tight? And how long will it take until the UK based Bn of the large regt becomes the dumping ground for the sick and the wasters. The premier Bns from a priority manning and eqpt view will be the Germany based units. I bet that within 5 years lack of eqpt and freezes on manpower will put the 2nd Bn of each Regt under pressure.
By all means lengthen the tours don't stop the plot.
Well said Crap Spy - no doubt your promotion is in the post!
The English Regts are vocal, but only within their own recruiting area so it is not coming across so strongly. The Scottish Regts on the other hand have a national backing and vocal support, not only from Uk but overseas as well, where their standing is held a lot higher than at that place in the south of England.
Birdie - agreed that it is cringe making back-slinding by TB, with the only good part being that it makes it look like he is hanging TCH and PoD out to dry. There is no illusion about force reduction and the crap about the arms plot being the driver here, when we all know it is purely financial, is to sideline the real financial issues.
It has been reported elsewhere on Arrse that these cuts (sorry again - reorganisations ) have meant that MoD have found the cuts in budget asked of them, plus pounds 250 million more. What more proof is required?
Without going over everything that has been said in tha past few months (and some people should take a look at the posts) I have to say the battle is not yet over. If the English Regts want to lie down and roll over, so be it, but the fight carries on in Scotland.
the Royals and KOSBs are for the hoof and the re-organisation will still take place. all that will happen is that we will get 3 Highland Regiments and 2 Lowland ones. Battalons will keep their local names in brackets, so:
1st Bn The Royal Highland Regiment (Black Watch)
2nd Bn The RHR (A&SH)
3rd Bn The RHR (Seaforth, Gordon & Camerons)
This was always going to be the case, so this is just pure politics (shock!).
This is happening people, accept it, i hear the regiments already have!
Hey XI and PY
Sorry, but we don't have to accept it. This is the Army Rumour Site and it is our job to kick up and bitch about things that are blatantly wrong if anyone of us thinks that is the case. Besides many serving soldiers and officers are not happy and feel unable to voice their opinions publically.
How quickly we forget the golden promises that prefixed past reorganisations.
So sorry if you find this debate a waste because it is a forgone conclusion. Who knows event in the sand pit combined by protest ast home may yet force a rethink.
don't get me wrong, i'm not saying you can't complain about it, please do! I will sign petitions, even give money and spend time out on the streets. but i will do it, resigned in the knowledge that TCH and BLiar have made up their minds.
Its just having lived through one amalgamation, getting worked up, writing letters, marching through the cities, doing the "Save the Regiment" thang, I get depressed quite quickly about this!
the B'tards will win, the SNP will make all sorts of ridiculous promises about "bring the regiments back" and the jocks will be left with sweet FA for their effort.
bad mood this morning, need more caffine.
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