Saving thousands - the military car pass..............

#1
Is it just me, or do others think that booking your car into each Garrison you visit, is barking mad????

So far this year I have had to stand in front of a desk and have my picture taken 23 times - each time I get a different pass for the same vehicle (my own), each time I have to show my MOD 90 to a civilian (who is paid to issue car passes) and each time I am told that the system is not networked because "it costs too much".

FFS.................. I HAVE AN MOD 90!!!!!!!!!!

My car, is mine............ taxed, MOT etc, I am insured to drive it (for work) and you know what?

With an MOD 90 I can walk in to any Barracks anywhere.............

SO big question......................Why do we (those with an MOD 90) still need car passes and why do we pay civilians to issue them???? If we need one at all why can't it be a standard issue that gets you into 95% of Camps??

Get rid of the civvies and save a wad of cash on upgrading un-networked computers and printers!!!!!

Clearly then - the only ones needing to book in would be those who do not have an MOD 90.
 
#2
1. MOD90 doesn't automatically grant you access to a barracks, with or without a car. It tells you that on the back.
2. What if your car's stolen or you sell it? It's then not linked to your MOD90.
3. Checking your car in is only part of the gate guard's job. He'd still be employed if no civvy cars were brought in.
 
#3
Is it just me, or do others think that booking your car into each Garrison you visit, is barking mad????
Security, load of balls really in this day and age eh...

So far this year I have had to stand in front of a desk and have my picture taken 23 times - each time I get a different pass for the same vehicle (my own), each time I have to show my MOD 90 to a civilian (who is paid to issue car passes) and each time I am told that the system is not networked because "it costs too much".

Most people these days have to use hire or pool cars to do duty trips, I take it you have business insurance on your car as directed by those dashing chaps in the MT

FFS.................. I HAVE AN MOD 90!!!!!!!!!!

Congratulations I have a Unit gym pass, does the same principle apply

My car, is mine............ taxed, MOT etc, I am insured to drive it (for work) and you know what?

with an MOD 90 I can walk in to any Barracks anywhere............
No you can not

SO big question......................Why do we (those with an MOD 90) still need car passes and why do we pay civilians to issue them???? If we need one at all why can't it be a standard issue that gets you into 95% of Camps??

Security is not a dirty word and civvies are cheap to hire, provide continuity etc.

Get rid of the civvies and save a wad of cash on upgrading un-networked computers and printers!!!!!

A well thought out arguement
PS: How do you upgrade quote un-networked computers and printers unquote

Clearly then - the only ones needing to book in would be those who do not have an MOD 90.

Like they do now anyways


Like the rant by the way :cool:
 
#4
Is it just me, or do others think that booking your car into each Garrison you visit, is barking mad????

So far this year I have had to stand in front of a desk and have my picture taken 23 times - each time I get a different pass for the same vehicle (my own), each time I have to show my MOD 90 to a civilian (who is paid to issue car passes) and each time I am told that the system is not networked because "it costs too much".

FFS.................. I HAVE AN MOD 90!!!!!!!!!!

My car, is mine............ taxed, MOT etc, I am insured to drive it (for work) and you know what?

With an MOD 90 I can walk in to any Barracks anywhere.............

SO big question......................Why do we (those with an MOD 90) still need car passes and why do we pay civilians to issue them???? If we need one at all why can't it be a standard issue that gets you into 95% of Camps??
Get rid of the civvies and save a wad of cash on upgrading un-networked computers and printers!!!!!

Clearly then - the only ones needing to book in would be those who do not have an MOD 90.
Because....
1. The MOD90 relates only to the person described on the front.
2. It is not available as a pass or permit.
3. Etc
4. Etc
Sorry to be so boring...
 
#5
I would like to see a little efficiency with regards to car passes. It is a bit tosh having to book in each time at every barracks.

T_S. Average idea, shocking implementation. DETENTION
 
#6
I have to say, there must be a better way. Ever tried to get into Shriv on a monday morning? Or HQ LF? I've spent over 45 mins twice last week booking in, 2 mins at the desk 43 waiting my turn. I've usually booked ahead so they know I'm visiting but it still takes forever at the larger sites.
 
#7
It is a very fair point; why should an annual car pass for most installations not be a workable idea? If security is an issue, it can hardly be less secure than a badly photocopied work ticket in a 2p plastic sleeve can it? After all, something like that which a 12 year old could fake on a computer, combined with a MOD 90 would get you most places. As would a laminated piece of paper with the logo of whatever corporation we have mortgaged our barracks to for 30 years in some places!
 
#8
I have to say, there must be a better way. Ever tried to get into Shriv on a monday morning? Or HQ LF? I've spent over 45 mins twice last week booking in, 2 mins at the desk 43 waiting my turn. I've usually booked ahead so they know I'm visiting but it still takes forever at the larger sites.
Secure car park "outside" the gates? i.e. no access from the car park to the barracks but inside the perimeter wire and within sight of the gate guard. If you NEED to take your car in, you go through the rigmarole. If not, it goes in the outer car park and you walk through the gates. Weigh up financial outlay against time saved. Obviously it'd only work at barracks that have a suitable perimeter.
 
#10
My personal pet peeve is the way that a few years ago, MOD introduced a 'universal pass', yet large numbers of sites refuse to recognise this - hence booking into a range of sites such as HQLF or DE&S, despite holding a pass designed to prevent this exact situation ocurring.
 
#11
Being MPGS and having to work in this environment, I can understand where the OP is coming from. He's wrong...but I know what he means.
Sysis! Great idea, badly implemented. I've lost count of the amount of times someone has come for a car pass and on me asking if they have been here before and are they on the system, they usually reply, "Not here but I am at such and such barracks!"
With the wonders of the t'interweb nowadays, how hard would it be for the company that produces Sysis to have a central countrywide server that every sysis terminal can be linked to?

I've served at three different units as MPGS, and have seen 3 different styles of car pass. To save a bit of money:

1. Centralise sysis.
2. Have the same style car pass for everywhere.

Therefore if posted, at your new unit you pop into the guardroom with ID, car pass and car paperwork to confirm its all you, and this saves having to issues new passes every time you go to a different unit. Possibly not the biggest saving and wouldn't fill an aircraft carrier with planes, but a start.
 
#12
A big problem with having a standard pass across the board would be when you start issuing passes to people allowed to take cars into some areas, but not others due to parking issues.

Take for example the SMC and barracks in Marchwood, HMS Sultan in Gosport and HMS Excellent in Portsmouth, all places that 1 person might visit in a week.

Someone that lives in the barracks is allowed a car on there, but not on the port. If they go on course at HMS Excellent, they may be accommodated at HMS Sultan, so they are allowed to park on the accommodation side, but not on the Technical side, they are also not allowed to take a private car onto Excellent as there is transport from Sultan and parking is limited.

Another person, this time lives out and drives to work on the port, and has a valid pass. No need to park on the barracks,so no pass for there, on course and accommodated at Excellent so needs a pass for the duration.

How would one standard pass differentiate between these two people,and all the other variations of vehicle access permissions?

You could issue a different pass depending on where......hang on...
 

Auld-Yin

ADC
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Reviews Editor
#13
Secure car park "outside" the gates? i.e. no access from the car park to the barracks but inside the perimeter wire and within sight of the gate guard. If you NEED to take your car in, you go through the rigmarole. If not, it goes in the outer car park and you walk through the gates. Weigh up financial outlay against time saved. Obviously it'd only work at barracks that have a suitable perimeter.
So how does it become and remain 'secure'? Would one have to book in and out and go through security checks? Would there be a shuttle bus service on the larger bases.

How much time/money do you think will be saved by having to secure a large area off the bases, (making it part of the base)?
 
#14
Just take the Abbey Wood approach and ban visitor parking (OK limit it to ridiculously low levels for the pedants). No problem with car passes then ^_~
 
#15
I have to say, there must be a better way. Ever tried to get into Shriv on a monday morning? Or HQ LF? I've spent over 45 mins twice last week booking in, 2 mins at the desk 43 waiting my turn. I've usually booked ahead so they know I'm visiting but it still takes forever at the larger sites.
Yes, and I don't recall having any dramas with it. But that was nearly 2 years ago.

I often go to the same camps (Pirbright, SMP, Napier, Longmoor) and since I've had the same car each time they recall my details from the computers memory and print it out with my original photo usually. Doesn't take very long at all. I use the time to see where I'm meant to be, peek at the camp map and the tote board and see who else has arrived.
 
#16
1. MOD90 doesn't automatically grant you access to a barracks, with or without a car. It tells you that on the back.
2. What if your car's stolen or you sell it? It's then not linked to your MOD90.
3. Checking your car in is only part of the gate guard's job. He'd still be employed if no civvy cars were brought in.
No I think this misses the point. The system is barking - utterly.

There are few establishments (Faslane maybe, or Coulport, and definitely MoD MB) where a MoD90 does not get you in on demand. I accept that and they are special cases. But, in 23 years I have never been refused entry at an RN,RAF or Army establishment with it - and nor should it.

I see absolutely no reason at all why we even need a car pass. The system is bonkers. I went to Tidworth the other day and they issued me a pass for a car i had owned 4 years ago (last time I went to Tidworth). I didn't even notice until I was leaving after my meeting. What good was that?

HM NAval Base Portsmouth is by far the worst. You can spend, at peak times, up to 2 hours waiting for a pass. Little or no allowance is made for military personnel. Countless meetings cancelled because attendees are stood at the main gate. As for MGS personnel - some are good I accept but experience is on the whole poor and I have found the vast majority to be shockingly bad. I have no confidence in the 'security' that they provide at all and anyone determined enough and with enough nonce could enter most HM Establishments with ease with a pair of wire cutters in a secluded and unguarded corner. And in HM NAval base they can row across the harbour if they want! At Shriv various Taxi firms can come and go without any kind of inspection and without passengers onboard. So too in other places.

In the inevitable Defence Estate's rationalisation that will surely follow SDSR I sincerely hope that the whole issue is sensibly addressed. Out of base parking is not an option - far too costly. Lets start trusting our people and do as many US bases do which is allow ID card holders entry with their car.
 

OldSnowy

LE
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#17
My favourite version of this only started around a year ago, when PJHQ brought in its own pass. These are now, of course, different from the Main Building ones (they used to use the same one). Result? Anyone going from one place to visit the other (and there are LOADS of them, every day) has to book in at the respective receptions, get special day pass, etc. Keeps the Amey/Caillion Reception people in a job, but otherwise - I can see no justification for it whatsoever. Note: this is not car passes, this is for a personal pass.

The old system worked fine for many many years. The new one is a complete and unnecessary pain.
 
#18
No I think this misses the point. The system is barking - utterly.

I see absolutely no reason at all why we even need a car pass.
Regardless of whether the system is barking or not I will give you a few of the top of my head.

Car Parks turning into scrap yards with unwanted abandoned cars.

Illegally parked cars, routinely or when an area has to be vacated for specific events

Confirmation of right of access to a specific establishment, hence why contrary to what was stated above, you can’t access certain bases on a ‘Works Ticket’ you need a site specific (or percific for certain WO’s & LE’s ;-)) passes. HQLF being one.

And overriding all of the above SECURITY. In order to identify a suspicious car quickly when our new friends decide they don’t want to play nicely anymore and we have to educate a whole new generation of soldiers about vigilance.
 
#19
Ok, here's my suggestion. Network everything (civvie companies do this) and issue one of the following:

An electronic pass card which details your vehicle information and parking priviledges/entitlement - all of which can be easily updated via the intranet/extranet. Only one card needs to be issued per man and it can be updated/modified as required with no re-issuing of paperwork. Such a card could contain the user's 'home' base (and home parking arrangements) and their 'default' parking priviledges when away from the home base.

Option two is a paper/plastic ticket which would do much the same but would need to be re-issued every time the arrangements change. I know for a fact that BT (probably the MOD's largest comms contractor) could provide such a system with no real dramas.
 
#20
No - I still don't get it................

I understand and support the security piece and believe that the ID Card (perfectly adequate when on foot) is paramount.

Why then does the fact that you drive in with the same MOD 90, alter your status and why are you issued another separate visitors pass, surely as a member of the organisation - your MOD 90 is all that is required? In regards to illegally parked cars, this used to be RSM business (and was very effective IIRC......................).

The current system is barking mad................... personal view of course :)
 

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