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SA80 MoD Press Release

#3
Gen Jackson said that it had out-performed other rifles it was tested alongside although he said that for commercial reasons he could not name the other weapons.

hmm...so it outperformed some other weapons, but they won't say...so for all we know it is less prone to stoppages than the bren gun, or something equally up-to date...
 
#4
OK...
I must stop whinging about the SA 80,
I must stop whinging about the SA 80,
I must stop...f*ck it :mad:

The Torygraph says it has pictures of the trials in Oman where the SASC are "testing" the A2 while lying on matting on top of plastic sheets.  Certainly that is the cleanest and nicest set of desert combats I have ever seen.... ;)

Like the concept of burying the rifle and it makes a great photo-op... but... in my experience even the SA 80 does not let a lot of crud in when it has the bolt forward, the dust cover closed and the magazine fitted.  

Where it all goes to ratsh1t is when you actually try to use the gat like - radical concept here - an infantryman would.  I.e. the weapon spends a lot of its time with the dust cover open, or even with the mag off and the bolt to the rear while mag changes go on.  Grunts might even have to move mid mag change to keep up with an assault or withdrawal, meaning the gat could get buried (try throwing yourself head first into the sand carrying a rifle and see what hits the ground first) with all its apertures open.  I bet they didn't try that with any photographers around :mad:

Anyway, we're stuck with it now.  Bloody heap of junk.
 
#8
Nope Eagle,

Guardian's right, I have heard that all left handed people are going to be transfered to the RAF. There, they will be able to use their left hand to "do things" and insert their right thumb up their bum!

Smashing!

I hear the best bit of the press conference was when a smart-ersed boot-neck demonstrated the new cleaning regime to the assembled hordes of journo-scum and then announced "There you have it ladies and gents, it's so simple even YOU could remember it".

'Played fella!
 
#9
Hehe...

But have DCC(A) handled the press release and images properly?....  I've yet to see any news websites using actual pics of the Oman demo.....tch, amateurs!!!  ::)

I await the papers tommorow with some reservation! :(

 
#12
Kind of surprised that General Sir POD put his name to that. I'm suspicious it's actually him, cos I've read the whole thing from end to end, and there isn't one F-word in it  ;D

But if the Dark Lord says we can go to war with it (subject to correct maintenance, wtf that means) then that boosts me confidence

With the provisio he actually said it that is.
 
#15
Did you see the letter in todays telegraph?

I wonder who wants to be the next CGS.

Have they no shame????????

I thought of putting this on Club Army but I sobered up just in time!!!
 
#16
Just for the sake of argument to thrown the proverbial cat, but....

having canvassed most people I know, including those who served in Gulf part !, and have done so in the Arctic, noone sems to have had a particular problem with the A1 version let alone the A2.  I note that there are an awful lot of comments from those who have just come out of training (not on this site, but in the press), and yet more rear ech weasels who only get iron sights anyway.

What is all the fuss about?  If you look after it, and clean it (as you should any piece of equipment it should be argued) it works.  Together with the SUSAT it's about as acurate an assault rifle as there is available.

And as for the plethora of firefights in Afghanistan and Kosovo where all of these stoppages are alleged to have taken place, they must be the most secretive ones in the Army's history.

Please correct me if this is all bollocks.  But I and I suspect other professional soldiers who look after their gats would take some convincing.

I'll grant you, the magazines were cack, but then I'd managed to acquire a stash of Colt mags which seemed always to come up with the goods.

Oh and the LSW was flawed conceptually or did we get rid of the accurate and magazine fed Bren for a laugh?

I'm as cynical as the next trench dweller too.  
Happily will I bring my new A2 along to Eagle's "get together in Whitehall" when the time comes!
 
#18
I used the A1 during Gulf War 1 and it was a piece of sh*te! It's all well and good the brass saying "clean it, clean it, clean it" but the reality is that you could do with a piece of gear that isn't going to jam the first time a Lynx jockey decides to do a low fly past.

First thing our CO did was break the old SLR's out (they were still around) and they didn't give us a problem. Soon as we found a few discarded AK's (and yes I know you can't compare the AK and the SA80, but at least you couldn't get the AK to jam) we comadered these and kept them as "in vehicle" weapons.
 
#19
"I used an SA80 in the Gulf".  
Quantify "used".
"vehicle weapon"?
Hmmmm, land rover or DROPS?

And just how many platoon attacks did you do in Gulf War 1?

Having just read a post op report for that reason, no mention of problems in my regiment.  Or maybe they spent the first 72 hours of the ground war with a pull-through in their hands.  It did however slag the "aged" fleet of 432s which have obviously been replaced.....

As I said, a lot of whingeing from people who are badly educated in training, or those who think it's warry not to have a sling on your rifle.
 
#20
"...First thing our CO did was break the old SLR's out (they were still around) ..."

mmm...now this isn't having a go, and I know that I live so far back that I send my laundry forwards (and I've never been in a firefight in my life! And my personal weapon is a Browning 9mm - now there's a fine piece of kit if you have an annoying breeze blowing paper around your desk!!), but...

I've seen no pictures of any troops in the Gulf War 1 carrying SLRs, and I find it amazing that a unit transporting equipment into theatre had the space/permission to ship twice the number of weapons they needed, including a (already withdrawn from service) weapon per man. I also pity the poor QM who had to aim off and carry all that extra 7.62mm. Not to mention the Armourer who had to find all his old SLR kit and carry that around too.

Did you really 'break out' SLRs? How many? What type of unit were you?

(and no, you can't compare the AK with a professional infantry rifle - the AK is an assault weapon designed for poorly trained conscript armies to spray bullets around at distances of under 100m. It's what you buy when you don't have professionally trained infantry soldiers with marksmanship skills capable of engaging the enemy at distances of over 300m).
 

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