SA80 A2 Front Hand Grip

#1
Has anybody ever used the m16/m4 or Steyr AUG that has a front hand grip fitted? what are the bennefits of the grips? Stability perhaps? Got a pic here
of a A2 fitted with a hand grip by HK. Possibly a future development? the picture was taken at a defence show in London a couple of years ago. Apparantly, its a more confortable and natural to hold the rifle in the standing, kneeling position with the grip fitted.
Another question, Regarding the LLM (Laser Light Module). Wouldnt it have made more sense to mount it directly above or below the barrel of the rifle as opposed to the side? If you are good with maths, you can work out the laser has to cross the path of the bullet on 2 differet axis ( X and Y) when mounted on the side, meaning that the laser will only be accurate within a very small range bracket. Any thoughts on either subjects anybody?
 
#2
I've met loads of RAF Regt who used to fit an LSW butt grip in the same place coz they thought it looked warry :roll:
 
#3
Malariadup said:
I've met loads of RAF Regt who used to fit an LSW butt grip in the same place coz they thought it looked warry :roll:
Presumably this was the reason they had hoods stitched onto their desert shirts :roll:

msr
 
#4
Malariadup said:
I've met loads of RAF Regt who used to fit an LSW butt grip in the same place coz they thought it looked warry :roll:
We used to do that in belfast with the SLR 7.62 (A mans weapon :lol: ) in the early 70's. Some of the Inf lads purchased their on single point sight as well. That was in the days when most SLR's only had iron sights.

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#5
Malariadup said:
I've met loads of RAF Regt who used to fit an LSW butt grip in the same place coz they thought it looked warry :roll:
We used to do that in belfast with the SLR 7.62 (A mans weapon :lol: ) in the early 70's. Some of the Inf lads purchased their on single point sight as well. That was in the days when most SLR's only had iron sights.

[align=center]THIS PICTURE SHOWS A SINGLE POINT SIGHT.NOT AN SLR[/align]
[align=center]
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#6
Conductor said:
Malariadup said:
I've met loads of RAF Regt who used to fit an LSW butt grip in the same place coz they thought it looked warry :roll:
We used to do that in belfast with the SLR 7.62 (A mans weapon :lol: ) in the early 70's. Some of the Inf lads purchased their on single point sight as well. That was in the days when most SLR's only had iron sights.

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Ahh....The SLR...Now THAT was a rifle!!!!All it needed was the folding stock & selective fire like the Argie version & you did'nt need the POS SA80!!
The foregrip on the A2 in the photo looks like it's a generic type for fitting extra's to it like torches,G/launchers ect.
Mind you,whats that nobble thing on the end ofe BFA???Never seen that before.
Spike
 
#7
The new improved BFA. Don't need the Combi tool to tighten it up now. The RAF Regt with Gucci foregrips? Is that so they are more comfortable walking round the perimeter?
 
#8
Spike7451 wrote:

Mind you,whats that nobble thing on the end ofe BFA???
I belive it's the new safe blank firing system job. Part of the system is the yellow magazines which are fitted to this rifle.
 
#10
spike7451 said:
Ahh....The SLR...Now THAT was a rifle!!!!All it needed was the folding stock & selective fire like the Argie version & you did'nt need the POS SA80!!
The foregrip on the A2 in the photo looks like it's a generic type for fitting extra's to it like torches,G/launchers ect.
Mind you,whats that nobble thing on the end ofe BFA???Never seen that before.
Spike
Opps, Sorry Spike, I never ment to misslead. The picture is of a single point sight. Not the SLR. Sorry :(
 
#11
The AUG foregrip is, in my humble opinion, horrible. If you have long arms like me (I hold the SLR when standing with my fingers on the ventilation slots), it is in completely the wrong place for anything. Folded forward it is too small to act as an effective foreend, leaving your fingers precariously close to a very hot barrel. It also wobbles, in both positions. Shooting prone when not resting on the magazine with it is also horrible. If I am fair, the whole weapon system is horrible -- that stupid folding foregrip just is the horrible icing on a horrible cake.

As for the laser devices, since they are only usable at very short range, any error induced by having the mounting off to the side is utterly irrelevant.
 
#12
stoatman said:
As for the laser devices, since they are only usable at very short range, any error induced by having the mounting off to the side is utterly irrelevant.
Im not sure if the laser device you refer to is the single point sight of the 70's! The single point sight back then, was a scope that required the use ofboth eyes. One eye looking into the scope and the othe eye looking directly at the target.

In the scope you would only see a red dot and nothing else. With both eyes open, it would appear to the user that the target had a red dot on it. Once the dot was on target the shot was taken.

This was an optical illusion. The dot could not be seen by anyone else.
 
#13
stoatman said:
The AUG foregrip is, in my humble opinion, horrible. If you have long arms like me (I hold the SLR when standing with my fingers on the ventilation slots), it is in completely the wrong place for anything. Folded forward it is too small to act as an effective foreend, leaving your fingers precariously close to a very hot barrel.
And an even hotter gas plug :eek:
 
#14
Conductor said:
spike7451 said:
Ahh....The SLR...Now THAT was a rifle!!!!All it needed was the folding stock & selective fire like the Argie version & you did'nt need the POS SA80!!
The foregrip on the A2 in the photo looks like it's a generic type for fitting extra's to it like torches,G/launchers ect.
Mind you,whats that nobble thing on the end ofe BFA???Never seen that before.
Spike
Opps, Sorry Spike, I never ment to misslead. The picture is of a single point sight. Not the SLR. Sorry :(
Nah,I was just reminiscing about when we had real guns to play with (LMG,SMG,SLR....) not tonka toys! :lol:
 
#15
spike7451 said:
Nah,I was just reminiscing about when we had real guns to play with (LMG,SMG,SLR....) not tonka toys! :lol:


[align=center]:lol: Happy Days :lol: [/align]

Just for us:

[align=center]
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#16
They are only useful as a monopod. The front hand grip things stop you from aligning your left arm with the barrel of the weapon which any good sharp shooter will tell you is a must in the position and hold! Get a crepe bandage around the barel at the end of the front hand grip and rest the barrel in the V shape created by the two middle fingers of the left hand. grasp the weapon and pull it into the shoulder.

If you want evidence of this system not being as accuate as without. Look at the difference in your APWT scores when firing with a UGL attatched! The extra weight at the front should make things easier but the poncey handgrip sends it to sh1t
 
#17
Conductor said:
spike7451 said:
Nah,I was just reminiscing about when we had real guns to play with (LMG,SMG,SLR....) not tonka toys! :lol:


[align=center]:lol: Happy Days :lol: [/align]

Just for us:

[align=center]
[/align]
How dare you post a picture of an inferior metric FAL!

Try this one on for size:
 
#18
chungmeister said:
Wouldnt it have made more sense to mount it directly above or below the barrel of the rifle as opposed to the side? If you are good with maths, you can work out the laser has to cross the path of the bullet on 2 differet axis ( X and Y) when mounted on the side, meaning that the laser will only be accurate within a very small range bracket. Any thoughts on either subjects anybody?
True, but then laser aquisition is only intended to work over small distances (up to 50m??), where you can approximate the trajectory of the round to be flat. Other than that its SUSAT and "Watch my tracer!".

TB
 
#19
chungmeister said:
Has anybody ever used the m16/m4 or Steyr AUG that has a front hand grip fitted? what are the bennefits of the grips? Stability perhaps?
They are great for doing a 'Beirut unload' around a corner, but as Bad Crow points out, they do f-all for your marksmanship.

Got a pic here of a A2 fitted with a hand grip by HK.
The hand grip was a private venture by H&K and has not been taken up by MoD. The only A2s with Picatinny rails fitted are the new SA80 carbines.

Conductor said:
THIS PICTURE SHOWS A SINGLE POINT SIGHT.NOT AN SLR
Sorry, it doesn't. The picture is of a 'non-occluded collimator sight' (i.e. you can see through it), which most people just refer to as a 'red dot sight'.

The Singlepoint was an 'occluded collimator sight' (i.e. you can't see through it). Here's a picture:



But you got the description of how it works spot on.
 
#20
the old and bold once told me they had to bin there red dot sights as sein fein complined they were killing to many provs with them :)
 

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