Russian Troop Movements Reported Near Ukraine

Do you mean pres.Poroshenko who used tanks, fighter-jets, heavy shellings to murder the protestors in Donbass?
He used the legitimate military of Ukraine to try and re-establish the legal borders of the country after Moscow’s propaganda had created an issue and Moscow’s troops had invaded the area to provide more weapons and support to a hostile minority of armed militias. These were not “protesters” in any sense of the word.
 
The coup in Kiev in 2014 was instigated by Ukrainian oligarchs with active support of Washington and moral support from the EU.
Ukrainian politics is in fact a big game of Oligarchs. Pres.Yanukovich was elected with support of Donetsk based oligarchs including the richest one in Ukraine - mr.Akhmetov. But other numerous oligarchs were unhappy with it. Paid mobsters, militants were used to stage riots in the capital. The main slogan was wonderful - against corruption (that is something permanent in Ukraine). But as a result corruption continue to blossom. Salaries of officials are fantastically high (especially for such a poor country as Ukraine). For example the minister of energetics mr. Vitrenko in 2020 earned $1,500,000 per month.
So give Ukraine new and new loans that will vaning in the financial black hole.
Btw, pres. Yanukovich agreed to leave his post in autumn 2014 but nevertheless he was forcibly and unlawfully removed.
Muscovite propaganda narrative that as usual distorts the accurate historical record, which indicates that the Ukrainian people rejected Muscovite interference in their country.
 
It happened during WW2 when tens thousands of Crimean Tatars joined German forces with arms in hands. Stalin responded with complete deportation/ In war time it was a logical solution.
A logical solution? For Moscow, maybe mass extermination of whole strata of ethnic and social “undesirables” and forced and brutal population transfer of multitudes may be seen as logical.

Why is it that millions of people under the rule of Moscow (including ethnic Russians), rejected that rule as soon as they could?
 
A logical solution? For Moscow, maybe mass extermination of whole strata of ethnic and social “undesirables” and forced and brutal population transfer of multitudes may be seen as logical.

Are you saying that is wrong?

If so, the chapter in my prime ministerial manifesto entitled 'travellers and gypsies' may need rewriting.
 
Muscovite propaganda narrative that as usual distorts the accurate historical record, which indicates that the Ukrainian people rejected Muscovite interference in their country.
Apart from the ones currently fighting to ensure they can be part of Russia instead.

Apart from the ones who didn't, Ukrainians unanimously rejected Russia, yes.
 
I'm not a native English speaker. However, support could be moral, informational, diplomatic, propagandist. So 'back a coup' and 'stage a coup' are different terms.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
The whole gist of your argument in this thread (and others) is wrong.
 
So do you support maidan style removal of a president in the USA for example? Maybe at time it would be logical to remove mr.Blair from power using Maidan style riots?
Please don't use double standards. Something that is unacceptable in the West should be unacceptable in Ukraine.
Double standards? You apply this reasoning? Moscow accusing the West of double standards! Now that is pure effrontery!
 
So, another 'fellow traveller' identified.
Not really.

Ukraine has historically been one of those flash points in the world.

historically always under the Russian Sphere of Influence. Identified as the breadbasket of Europe in the 30s and ‘acquired’ for that reason on the 40s.

There’s been very little shift in the power struggle in Europe over centuries.
 
And where does it say that they preferred to be ripped away from Ukraine by force and annexed by Moscow?
You wrote that
There was no support for the incorporation of Crimea into Muscovite Russia until Moscow manufactured that support and enforced it by invasion and occupation.
I hope you agree that there were strong pro-Russian feelings in Crimea before 2014. Of course it would be hard to expect that Ukrainian polling agency would hold a question
Do you wish Crimea to join Russia?
And anyway positive answer to such a question would be not safe.
Crimea had much more in common with Russia than with Ukraine. It was 100% Russian speaking region with pro-Russian feelings and pro-russian geopolitical orientation.

Anyway Kiev could propose to hold a new referendum. Though its result is pretty obvious.
 
Apart from the ones currently fighting to ensure they can be part of Russia instead.

Apart from the ones who didn't, Ukrainians unanimously rejected Russia, yes.
Not unanimously, but uniformly across all regions when the USSR split up. Moscow later manufactured the separatist issue.
 
Not unanimously, but uniformly across all regions when the USSR split up. Moscow later manufactured the separatist issue.
Russia generally likes to have a buffer zone around its borders.

it’s because European country’s wishing to acquire land tend to go into Russia and leave it in a frightful mess.

Russians see areas of Eastern Europe and other areas surrounding its borders as their channel. And area where a foe will suffer.
 
Not really.

Ukraine has historically been one of those flash points in the world.

historically always under the Russian Sphere of Influence. Identified as the breadbasket of Europe in the 30s and ‘acquired’ for that reason on the 40s.

There’s been very little shift in the power struggle in Europe over centuries.
No. For all the reasons I have explained in previous posts on this thread and others.
Russia generally likes to have a buffer zone around its borders.

it’s because European country’s wishing to acquire land tend to go into Russia and leave it in a frightful mess.

Russians see areas of Eastern Europe and other areas surrounding its borders as their channel. And area where a foe will suffer.
You could also have written the same lame excuses for Germany instead of for Russia.
Edited to add: “in the past”.
 
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Russia generally likes to have a buffer zone around its borders.

it’s because European country’s wishing to acquire land tend to go into Russia and leave it in a frightful mess.

Russians see areas of Eastern Europe and other areas surrounding its borders as their channel. And area where a foe will suffer.
Oh, well that's alright then, for Ukraine to be used as the playground for bullies?
 

JCC

LE
Well I care seeing as though my relativelive there.

I care enough about your relatives not to want to see them dying in some quarrel over what colour flag flys down at the local police barracks.

And maybe you should care too seeing as though it could potentially affect the UK. Hitler didn’t stop at the Sudetenland.

Russia/Putin doesn't have enough money to invade Western Europe nor the ability to hold it nor would that action offer Russia any benefit.
 
No. For all the reasons I have explained in previous posts on this thread and others.

You could also have written the same lame excuses for Germany instead of for Russia.
I could’ve written that for Germany. After all, the map of The EU looks surprisingly like that of Germany.

It was the Kaisers Chancellor, Bethman Hollwegg who questioned why Germany would want to wage war for control of Europe when she could control Europe economically instead. Germany’s always been screwed over by lack of natural resources such as ‘minerals, oil and gas and wheat’ which surprisingly the Ukraine is a big provider of.
 
I could’ve written that for Germany. After all, the map of The EU looks surprisingly like that of Germany.

It was the Kaisers Chancellor, Bethman Hollwegg who questioned why Germany would want to wage war for control of Europe when she could control Europe economically instead. Germany’s always been screwed over by lack of natural resources such as ‘minerals, oil and gas and wheat’ which surprisingly the Ukraine is a big provider of.
Free association for mutual economic and political benefit is not the control of Germany over Europe.
 

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