Russian Troop Movements Reported Near Ukraine

When Will Russia Invade Ukraine

  • Wed 16th Feb

    Votes: 19 6.7%
  • Before 22nd Feb

    Votes: 54 19.1%
  • By St David's Day (1 March)

    Votes: 90 31.9%
  • By St Georges Day (23 April)

    Votes: 21 7.4%
  • By August

    Votes: 9 3.2%
  • By Christmas

    Votes: 6 2.1%
  • Some time in 2023

    Votes: 15 5.3%
  • Before Hell Freezes Over

    Votes: 68 24.1%

  • Total voters
    282

Dread

LE
If it’s an SU25, they look a complete bag o sh*te, but they tend to be able to fly when required.

I’ll give Russian aircraft their dues. When they’re not being shot down or being flown into the ground by drunk pilots, they’re surprisingly reliable, if not agricultural, in their operation.

You know you’re flying careers going nowhere though when you have to swap flying in some sh*t hole in Africa to having to bale out the Russian Air Force.

Russian domestically produced aircraft are, without exception, shyte.

Their military aircraft burn through engines like no tomorrow (they simply don't have the technology to make the turbine blades required, among many other failings), and in comparison with their NATO opponents, have utterly bonk radar and targeting systems.

Their civilian aircraft are even worse. How do I know this? Go travelling with a Fortune 500 or FTSE 200 company in Central Asia and the CIS regions: apart from Aeroflot, nearly every domestic carrier is not approved for employees to travel on (and doing so would render their corporate travel insurance policy invalid). Why? Because they crash.

Pished up pilots are the least of your problems: maintenance done with Chinese parts or Russian parts held together with Chinese made gaffer tape - if maintenance has been done at all, low quality fuels, wrong grades of lubricant being used, etc. Not a recipe for a long life.
 
The jet is around 14,000 deg C although that will degrade with distance after an initial 70cm which is the rough limit for burning through armour - hence a 70cm standoff / slat armour will make it fairly useless.

It will easily overcome a tank's roof armour. The temp inside the turret will rapidly soar to several hundred degrees. So even if a bag charge or cartridge isn't 'hit' by the jet, the temp rise will be critical. Humans don't respond well to breathing air at those temperatures.

Choose top attack every time, unless it's a BMP or sommat.

I should point out that an Abraham's wouldn't fare much better from top-attack ?
It isn't the heat that generally kills, it's the spalling and overpressure. The heat flash from the HEAT penetration is sudden and will certainly cause nasty surface burns, but it is too fast to cause breathing issues (assuming that the victim isn't breathing in at the time of the flash).

Sometimes the spalling produces fragments so fine that you get a 'custard powder'/dust explosion, and sometimes you have ammunition, hydraulic fluids or other flammable material that produces explosions r secondary burning, but the HEAT jet itself is only going to kill some poor sod sat in the way.
 

Jacl

LE
It isn't the heat that generally kills, it's the spalling and overpressure. The heat flash from the HEAT penetration is sudden and will certainly cause nasty surface burns, but it is too fast to cause breathing issues (assuming that the victim isn't breathing in at the time of the flash).

Sometimes the spalling produces fragments so fine that you get a 'custard powder'/dust explosion, and sometimes you have ammunition, hydraulic fluids or other flammable material that produces explosions r secondary burning, but the HEAT jet itself is only going to kill some poor sod sat in the way.
Reading that makes Loofkars preference for infantry more understandable.
 
Russian domestically produced aircraft are, without exception, shyte.

Their military aircraft burn through engines like no tomorrow (they simply don't have the technology to make the turbine blades required, among many other failings), and in comparison with their NATO opponents, have utterly bonk radar and targeting systems.

Their civilian aircraft are even worse. How do I know this? Go travelling with a Fortune 500 or FTSE 200 company in Central Asia and the CIS regions: apart from Aeroflot, nearly every domestic carrier is not approved for employees to travel on (and doing so would render their corporate travel insurance policy invalid). Why? Because they crash.

Pished up pilots are the least of your problems: maintenance done with Chinese parts or Russian parts held together with Chinese made gaffer tape - if maintenance has been done at all, low quality fuels, wrong grades of lubricant being used, etc. Not a recipe for a long life.
We sold several neane jet engines to Russia in 46/7 on the condition that they were not used in military jets. Hence the mig15 neane powered. Before that Russian engineer's were invited to see jets being built at RR and Dehaviland. They wore special shoes with soft crape soles to pick up meal particles from milling machines to analyse the structure of the metals. All at the invitation of labour party minister's. No change there then.
N.b. I knew someone who worked at RR then and he said every one knew what the ruskies were up to and several senior engineer's tried to stop the visit and sale but we're over ruled and sidelined for promotion.
 
The jet is around 14,000 deg C although that will degrade with distance after an initial 70cm which is the rough limit for burning through armour - hence a 70cm standoff / slat armour will make it fairly useless.

It will easily overcome a tank's roof armour. The temp inside the turret will rapidly soar to several hundred degrees. So even if a bag charge or cartridge isn't 'hit' by the jet, the temp rise will be critical. Humans don't respond well to breathing air at those temperatures.

Choose top attack every time, unless it's a BMP or sommat.

I should point out that an Abraham's wouldn't fare much better from top-attack ?
Abrams.
 

Dwarf

LE
Book Reviewer
Russian domestically produced aircraft are, without exception, shyte.

Their military aircraft burn through engines like no tomorrow (they simply don't have the technology to make the turbine blades required, among many other failings), and in comparison with their NATO opponents, have utterly bonk radar and targeting systems.

Their civilian aircraft are even worse. How do I know this? Go travelling with a Fortune 500 or FTSE 200 company in Central Asia and the CIS regions: apart from Aeroflot, nearly every domestic carrier is not approved for employees to travel on (and doing so would render their corporate travel insurance policy invalid). Why? Because they crash.

Pished up pilots are the least of your problems: maintenance done with Chinese parts or Russian parts held together with Chinese made gaffer tape - if maintenance has been done at all, low quality fuels, wrong grades of lubricant being used, etc. Not a recipe for a long life.
Uh, huh. Spain lost 62 squaddos because the government chartered the cheapest aircraft which piled in. It took them over a decade to accept resposibility and the minister in a decent country/government would have resigned immediately.

Not a deviation (I hope) just backing up info.
 

Dread

LE
I had a flick through oryx the other day. Russian losses aren’t as big as I thought they’d be, especially for artillery and SAM systems. There’s huge amounts of trucks in there.

I know that logistics trucks are a good target to hit and often easier to hit, but I’d have thought the Ukrainians would’ve made a bigger impact on Russian artillery. Then again, Russian artillery is probably surrounded by SHORAD and if you’ve got a tank or IFV coming towards you, needs must.

After the initial losses of Ru artillery to Ua infantry and armour, and the abandonment of entire batteries of equipment in a few instances, the Russians have remembered that arty is their most valuable asset, and have accordingly pulled it back out of range of most Ua arty and other conventional forces. The Ru inability to engage depth Ua targets (schools, hospitals, retirement homes, etc.) with their 2S1 and other close support arty has meant the Ru have had to burn through their stocks of cruise missiles and conventional ballistic missiles.

This forces the Ua army to send its own arty to the front line in a 'raid': purposefully not to engage in the immediate battle 4 - 5 km in front of them, but to wait to engage the enemy arty some 20 - 30km distant. It takes extra resources to plan, supply, and protect the Ua arty to ensure it can escape Ru counter-battery fire, as well avoid the attentions of Ru recce, and their Ru air force.

Edit to add to the last point: it also makes BDA extremely difficult unless there is a friendly drone catching the action.
 
Last edited:

TOPCAT99

Old-Salt
Any proof , documented of this ?


This is the first time I have ever heard of this. I have read , I think everything published about the FSSG .

Just asking as after being in the area of Anzio for the last , on , off 30 years and talking to old Italians as well as old Americans who used to visit .


There is of course documented proof of the huge Blond FSSG officer who would , talk? Ask German prisoners questions on the second floor of a house , if the answers were not to his liking , he would throw said German out the window . Go out bring him back upstairs and ask the question again. He had a good reputation for getting good Int.
I thought this was an old saying- about the Ghurkha who slit the throats of 2 sleeping Nazis - leaving the guy in the middle alone
when asked why he let the centre guy go- he replied " can you imagine the look on his face when he awoke!"
 
We sold several neane jet engines to Russia in 46/7 on the condition that they were not used in military jets. Hence the mig15 neane powered. Before that Russian engineer's were invited to see jets being built at RR and Dehaviland. They wore special shoes with soft crape soles to pick up meal particles from milling machines to analyse the structure of the metals. All at the invitation of labour party minister's. No change there then.
N.b. I knew someone who worked at RR then and he said every one knew what the ruskies were up to and several senior engineer's tried to stop the visit and sale but we're over ruled and sidelined for promotion.
The metallurgy was the give away. The jet engine was a centrifugal flow design that was already reaching it's limits compared to axial jets. - hence no centrifugal flow jets above 7000,lb thrust.
So as far as UK/RR was concerned it was a tech dead end.
 
In the culture here it's not suppression for the sake of it but to avoid having your nearest and dearest suffer anguishing worry about you while you're at the front.
What the chap in the video describes indeed sounds nightmarish.

Yup. Don't want to worry those at home so it's all a walk in the park.
 
Which was the case anyway

Around 500 foreign owned aircraft are leased to Russian companies, around 2/3 of them are owned by companies based in Ireland (worth up to €4.5 billion)


Whilst it looks like Dublin will take a huge hit financially I don't think it will. The Emerald Isle is used as a location for tax evasion by large US, and other, corporates - and individuals.

The fiddle used to be called the Double Irish and was a mechanism by which corporates could, much to the annoyance of their tax man, legitimately not be seen to make any taxable profits. The Double Irish was effectively abolished by tax reform, and then clever accountants replaced it with a scheme called the Single Malt. The Single malt was also replaced, but now there is doubtless something else in the works.

I think you will find that the vast majority of these leasing companies are in fact third party leasing companies set up by manufacturers. It allows them to look as if they are successfully selling lots of aircraft to third parties, and the third parties are doing the tax evasion rather than the respectable manufacturers.

 
1653417946653.png

A bit of light relief.
 
It isn't the heat that generally kills, it's the spalling and overpressure. The heat flash from the HEAT penetration is sudden and will certainly cause nasty surface burns, but it is too fast to cause breathing issues (assuming that the victim isn't breathing in at the time of the flash).

Sometimes the spalling produces fragments so fine that you get a 'custard powder'/dust explosion, and sometimes you have ammunition, hydraulic fluids or other flammable material that produces explosions r secondary burning, but the HEAT jet itself is only going to kill some poor sod sat in the way.

Grateful for the correction - every day's a schoolday.

I imagine even if the crew live... they wont be much use thereafter.
 
We sold several neane jet engines to Russia in 46/7 on the condition that they were not used in military jets. Hence the mig15 neane powered. Before that Russian engineer's were invited to see jets being built at RR and Dehaviland. They wore special shoes with soft crape soles to pick up meal particles from milling machines to analyse the structure of the metals. All at the invitation of labour party minister's. No change there then.
N.b. I knew someone who worked at RR then and he said every one knew what the ruskies were up to and several senior engineer's tried to stop the visit and sale but we're over ruled and sidelined for promotion.

Then labour wonder why many consider them untrustworthy.
 

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