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Russian Surveillance Aircraft lost at sea off Syria

The mentioned article in Kommersant gives description of the tragedy from point of view of Russian MoD
Минобо объявило виня
Time is Moscow time

It should be said that all movements of Israeli (and other) aircrafts are being monitored from Russian bases and warships.

Note that Latakia is on the Western part of Syria.



Russian MoD claims that Israel aircrafts didn't return to their bases immediately but remained near Syrian coast.
At what point in this fairy story did Russian forces detect missile launches from a French Naval vessel?
 
Of course it was a lie. How can anyone be expected to believe a Russian MOD chronology when they announce stuff like this.

So, @KGB_resident, why is the detection of missile launches from a French Naval vessel missing from the chronology? What is the explanation for the announcement that they were detected? If this was an error, how can anyone believe anything else in the chronology?
 
What actually is the argument here? I have tried reading the thread but what exactly is being suggested? A deliberate act and not and accident? That the Israelis somehow orchestrated it? Or was the West?
It is a very good question.
I believe that the Israelis didn't plan to harm interests of Russian military in any way. They didn't plan to hide behind Russian plane. One F-16 could approach to Il-20 but it was highly likely a decision made by the pilot. Generally speaking it was indeed a tragic accident.
The Israelis informed Russian side too late and didn't tell about exact place of the attack. There is a logical explanation. They suspected that the information could be transferred to the Syrians.
I also believe that the Israelis tried to say half-truth. They still don't accept any responsibility. So Moscow has to do something to prevent repetition of similar cases in the future.
 
It is a very good question.
I believe that the Israelis didn't plan to harm interests of Russian military in any way. They didn't plan to hide behind Russian plane. One F-16 could approach to Il-20 but it was highly likely a decision made by the pilot. Generally speaking it was indeed a tragic accident.
The Israelis informed Russian side too late and didn't tell about exact place of the attack. There is a logical explanation. They suspected that the information could be transferred to the Syrians.
I also believe that the Israelis tried to say half-truth. They still don't accept any responsibility. So Moscow has to do something to prevent repetition of similar cases in the future.
They don't accept any responsibility, Liar, because they didn't press the button on the SA system after the last Israeli aircraft was miles away.
To repeat for the permanently dishonest-the Syrians shot down a Russian aircraft.
Not the Israelis.
 
So, I am an old romantic.
You do not deny being a lying propagandist baboon for the war criminal Putin.
Which of us is worse?
I'm ready to recognize that I'm worse than you but it would be impolite because such a confession would indirectly describe your excellency as a bad person while you are awfully awesome.
 
So, @KGB_resident, why is the detection of missile launches from a French Naval vessel missing from the chronology?
I have no idea. Were there any launches? Were there any reports, allegations about them?
What is the explanation for the announcement that they were detected? If this was an error, how can anyone believe anything else in the chronology?
What announcement do you mean?
 
I'm ready to recognize that I'm worse than you but it would be impolite because such a confession would indirectly describe your excellency as a bad person while you are awfully awesome.
Flattery from a liar is worthless.
As are you, once again evading my simple accusation.
You are a liar.
Deny it.
If you dare.
 
I have no idea. Were there any launches? Were there any reports, allegations about them?

What announcement do you mean?
As if you didn’t know, I am referring to the announcement by the the Russian MOD that missile launches were detected from a French Naval vessel. This is reported in the linked article on the very first post on this thread.

I take it that amnesiac KGB is on shift right now.
 
As if you didn’t know, I am referring to the announcement by the the Russian MOD that missile launches were detected from a French Naval vessel. This is reported in the linked article on the very first post on this thread.

I take it that amnesiac KGB is on shift right now.
No, just another liar, who hadn't read the HOTO notes.
 
As if you didn’t know, I am referring to the announcement by the the Russian MOD that missile launches were detected from a French Naval vessel. This is reported in the linked article on the very first post on this thread.

I take it that amnesiac KGB is on shift right now.
Initially some mass media reported about claims allegedly made by Russian MoD about CM launches from French warship. The French side denies any involvement into downing of Il-20. But I haven't seen denial of the very fact of the launches. It is quite possible that the French launched some cruise missiles.
Also it is possible that mass media reported about unconfirmed claims, about allegations presented as claims. It is possible that there was a mistake made by Russian intelligence..
Anyway apparently the French are not connected to the catastrophe. Thus it was not mentioned in the time-line.
 
Let's look at RT
Russian airspace control systems registered missile launches from a French frigate in the Mediterranean on Monday, the Russian Defense Ministry reported.
So it could be a mistake or indeed the French launched cruise missiles.
Paris denied “any involvement in [the] attack,” a French army spokesman said, as cited by AFP.
Note, that Paris doesn't deny that there were launches of cruise missiles. It denies involvement in the attack.
Paris doesn't deny and doesn't confirm launches of cruise missiles.
 
Initially some mass media reported about claims allegedly made by Russian MoD about CM launches from French warship. The French side denies any involvement into downing of Il-20. But I haven't seen denial of the very fact of the launches. It is quite possible that the French launched some cruise missiles.
Also it is possible that mass media reported about unconfirmed claims, about allegations presented as claims. It is possible that there was a mistake made by Russian intelligence..
Anyway apparently the French are not connected to the catastrophe. Thus it was not mentioned in the time-line.
Yes, it's not worth mentioning that the Russian military said. “Airspace control has recorded rocket launches from the French frigate 'Auvergne,'” .
 
Initially some mass media reported about claims allegedly made by Russian MoD about CM launches from French warship. The French side denies any involvement into downing of Il-20. But I haven't seen denial of the very fact of the launches. It is quite possible that the French launched some cruise missiles.
Also it is possible that mass media reported about unconfirmed claims, about allegations presented as claims. It is possible that there was a mistake made by Russian intelligence..
Anyway apparently the French are not connected to the catastrophe. Thus it was not mentioned in the time-line.
Initially it was. From blaming the French and Israeli’s, to blaming the Israeli’s. Rather than addressing the fundamental issue of ROEs and training:
 
Let's look at RT

So it could be a mistake or indeed the French launched cruise missiles.

Note, that Paris doesn't deny that there were launches of cruise missiles. It denies involvement in the attack.
So, you claim that either the Russian MOD made a mistake, or the Russian mass media have been told to suppress a story about the French launching cruise missiles at Latakia.

If the Russian MOD made a mistake in identifying missile launches from a French frigate, how can we be sure that they didn’t make a mistake on when or where they detected IDF F-16s? How can we be sure that anything on their chronology is accurate at all?

If however, the French have attacked Latakia with cruise missiles from a frigate, then that is a significant story. Why would the Russian media suppress this story? The only explanation could be that they were told to suppress it by the Russian Government. But why would the Russian Government suppress such a story? What are they afraid of?
 
So, you claim that either the Russian MOD made a mistake, or the Russian mass media have been told to suppress a story about the French launching cruise missiles at Latakia.

If the Russian MOD made a mistake in identifying missile launches from a French frigate, how can we be sure that they didn’t make a mistake on when or where they detected IDF F-16s? How can we be sure that anything on their chronology is accurate at all?

If however, the French have attacked Latakia with cruise missiles from a frigate, then that is a significant story. Why would the Russian media suppress this story? The only explanation could be that they were told to suppress it by the Russian Government. But why would the Russian Government suppress such a story? What are they afraid of?
I'll take a wild stab in the dark at, "The truth".

Which is that their ally, Syria, shot down their plane.

Simples, as the saying goes...
 
KGbs, again I'm forced to teach you Air Defence 101 - your claim to be ex PVO is looking more rediculous by the day....

Ultimate responsibility rests with the Fire Unit commander (AKA Engagement Controller) - He was Syrian
Ultimate responsibility for the safety of the COOT rests with the pilot - as in 'don't fly into Hot MEZs' and co-ordinate with your puppet's Air Defence' - He was Russian

What else is there to debate?
 
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Ultimate responsibility for the safety of the Coot rests with the pilot - as in 'don't fly into Hot MEZs'
Maybe his directional consultant was having a bad hair day. As in " don't worry Boss, were miles away from the MEZ, I think".
 
So, you claim that either the Russian MOD made a mistake, or the Russian mass media have been told to suppress a story about the French launching cruise missiles at Latakia.

If the Russian MOD made a mistake in identifying missile launches from a French frigate, how can we be sure that they didn’t make a mistake on when or where they detected IDF F-16s? How can we be sure that anything on their chronology is accurate at all?

If however, the French have attacked Latakia with cruise missiles from a frigate, then that is a significant story. Why would the Russian media suppress this story? The only explanation could be that they were told to suppress it by the Russian Government. But why would the Russian Government suppress such a story? What are they afraid of?
I can only guess. Initially the cause of the catastrophe was not known. So the claim could be just test ball to hear swift French denial. As for CM launches then it is not clear for me - did they took place or not? In theory the French could hit terrorists in Idlib.
Btw. 18 September all the day I was busy due to some family problems related to a Brother of my wife (veteran of the war in Afghanistan). I missed the statement of Russian MoD. I sincerely believed that version about CM launches was just initial allegation
 
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