Russian 471 non combat deaths.

Legs

ADC
Book Reviewer
#4
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
 
#5
Legs said:
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
Weeel...... if you included off duty deaths and went across all three services and included accidents on operations, but excluded purely non sudden deaths by natural causes, it might be more than 40. However, the suicide figure would be a much, much, lower proportion.
 
#6
Legs said:
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
I doubt it, do we have any deaths due to murder or neglect? I hope we don't have around 18-20 suicides :(
 
#7
Russia's defence ministry has confirmed a report saying the armed forces lost 471 service personnel to non-combat deaths in 2008, 30 more than in 2007.
It is indeed a big problem. About 40 were lost monthly. And it is in the army that has size 1.2 mln.
 
#8
WhiteHorse said:
Legs said:
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
I doubt it, do we have any deaths due to murder or neglect? I hope we don't have around 18-20 suicides :(
It is not the newest data, but...

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmhansrd/cm070301/text/70301w0018.htm

Mr. MacDougall: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence how many suicides there have been in the British Army since 2001. [123348]

Derek Twigg: Between 1 January 2001 and 31 December 2005, the latest date for which validated centrally-compiled data are available, there were 52 coroner-confirmed suicide and open verdict deaths among regular Army Service personnel. This figure does not include deaths due to violent or unnatural causes that are still awaiting a coroner’s verdict.
 
#9
But that covers a 5 year period Segey, not just one.
 
#10
TIGER-MONKEY said:
But that covers a 5 year period Segey, not just one.
Of course. Average number of suicides in the British armed forces is far lower that in the Russian army. It is (if I understand it corretly) something like 5 per 100,000 personnel per year (correct me if I'm wrong). The respective number for Russian army is 19. It is a huge difference.

Our American friends, alas, have a very high level of suicides.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...in-us-army-at-highest-in-26-years-461933.html

The Army recorded 17.3 suicides per 100,000 soldiers in 2006
http://www.voanews.com/english/arch...essionid=88308a2c43eadaf76f0a1b72732857787728

29 May 2008

The U.S. Army reported Thursday that the suicide rate among its soldiers continued to rise last year...
...
That is a rate of nearly 19 per 100,000 soldiers.
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/HEALTH/09/09/army.suicides/index.html

December 9, 2008
...
Army officials said that if the trend continues this year, it will pass the nation's suicide rate of 19.5 people per 100,000
As for the current level of suicides in the British Army then it is unavailable.
 
#11
I am skiving off work at the moment but will look for the RLC traffic accident report tomorrow. That gives some useful figures.

I think we still lose more Service personnel on the roads (on and off-duty)that we do on operations.

Our suicide figures are, IIRC, far lower than the comparable figures for civvie street. But they are still too high, IMHO.

Litotes
 
#12
Litotes said:
I am skiving off work at the moment but will look for the RLC traffic accident report tomorrow. That gives some useful figures.

I think we still lose more Service personnel on the roads (on and off-duty)that we do on operations.

Our suicide figures are, IIRC, far lower than the comparable figures for civvie street. But they are still too high, IMHO.

Litotes
5 years ago...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2004/aug/28/mentalhealth.politics

Soldiers aged under 20 are 1.7 times more likely to kill themselves than civilians of the same age, figures from the Ministry of Defence revealed last night.
...
The suicide rate for trained soldiers is 27 deaths in 100,000, compared with 17 in 100,000 for recruits.
I believe that now the situation is much better.

By the way the problems that Russian and British armies has are sometimes painfully similar

http://www.pipss.org/index46.html

In 1987, about the same time that Gorbachev’s glasnost policy drew official and public attention to dedovschchina in the Soviet armed forces, a series of revelations about regimental initiation rites in the British Army forced the MOD to place the problem of bullying high on its personnel management agenda. Senior officers and defence officials were shocked by reports of bizarre and vicious initiation ceremonies in the Army involving beatings, humiliation and sexual assaults taking place in prestigious regiments such as The Coldstream Guards and The King’s Own Scottish Borderers. Reports of these events soon reached the press in the UK and abroad5. Some of the occurrences appeared uncomfortably similar in brutality to reports of the worst excesses of dedovshchina starting to emerge from the Soviet military.
 
#13
#14
Yes but is it any higher that the percentage lost in the general population? Quick look at the UK national stats from 1991-2006 shows a range from 17-21 per 100,000 male and 6-7 per 100,000 female. That is probably broken down by age but couldnt be bothered to dig deeper.
But from that we can conclude that you are more likely to commit suicide as a general male member of the UK population than a Russian squaddie. That kinda figures I suppose. And now I'm really depressed :(
 
#15
The figures for suicides in the Russian Army are, frankly, unsurprising.
The practice of deliberately shipping peasant conscripts thousands of miles to the garrison furthest from their home, with no leave for two years, is hardly conducive to high morale.
Then factor in the six month training cycle, repeated four times in two years, with each intake being encouraged to brutalise all subordinate intakes, poor pay/accommodation/equipment/messing etc.
Even Troopski Job would be tempted to eat a bullet under that regime.
 
#16
WhiteHorse said:
I doubt it, do we have any deaths due to murder or neglect? (
Sorry to say but, oh yes we do, but thankfully in very small numbers on both counts.
 
#17
An ATR in Bridgend would probably make us the market leaders.
 
#18
Legs said:
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
Table shows figures and rates per 100, 000 personnel for 1998-2007 taken from DASA website. Graph on next page suggests Suicides & open verdict at inquest accounted for 3% deaths in 2007

DASA
 
#19
joe90x said:
Legs said:
So, (unless I've screwed up my maths) 0.04% of the Russian Army has died through Suicide, accident, negligence or murder in 2008.

I wonder how that compares to British Army - the same percentage should mean about 40 No-Operational deaths. Has anyone seen any figures?
Table shows figures and rates per 100, 000 personnel for 1998-2007 taken from DASA website. Graph on next page suggests Suicides & open verdict at inquest accounted for 3% deaths in 2007

DASA
Frankly speaking I believed that the level of non combat deaths in the Russian army is significantly higher that in the HM Armed Forces.

In Russia it is about 39 per 100,000. But in the UK the lastest data gives number 67 (=105-38).
 

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