Row over plans to spend a fortune on two aircraft carriers

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by mazoldboy, May 3, 2007.

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  1. The two carriers were only brought by the government to keep the admiralty quiet while the fleet is dispanded. I Have strong doubts that there was ever any real intention to buy them.

  2. An aircraft carrier of that size represents an asset that needs a very considerable support group to protect it?

    IIRC the American Stike Groups for big carriers have destroyer squadron, guided missile cruisers/destroyers and the odd attack submarine or two stooging about plus oilers/supply ships.

    Where do they come from then? Or is that part of the cunning plan?
  3. The CVF concept is really as case of eyes bigger than tummy...the MOD hasn't got the appetite for this. Operating a carrier group requires a level of commitment and a human resources effort alone which makes the current arms plot look shabby. Where will all of these naval aviators come from? Or ground-crews, or ship crews or ships?

    Delusional at best, criminal at worst - this project is a complete nightmare.
  4. The £100bn figure is the total operating costs (IIRC including buying and operating all the aircraft) for the entire lifetime of the carrier - probably 50 years.
  5. This article is being a bit disingenuous about it costing £100bn.
  6. Well a USN CSG currently consists something like this:

    1 x CVN - 3,000 crew
    1 x Air Wing - 2,500
    1 x CG - 400
    2-3 x DDG - 350 each
    1 x SSN - 130
    1 x AOE - 2-300

    So total manning requirements in the region of 7,000

    The current strength of the RN, excluding RM, is about 30,000.
  7. The RNLI need all the help they can get and if Gordy, Des and Tony thinks its a good idea then I am alright with that.

    Total and utter head fcuk these people!!
  8. £100bn is a bit far fetched even for Big and Expensive Systems.

    The simple truth is you can't have a military on the cheap.

    Of course if this government actually cracked down on the amount of money wasted in the NHS and Social Welfare, then the government could afford it.

    However, that wouldn't be very popular with the dregs of society that are bleeding UK PLC dry on welfare...
  9. Also says crew size is 3000+ each. Quick check of Google says only 1800 bunks being planned, with 300 of them unused even with a full air group. (Although most Arrsers's would say this is due to sailor boys sharing beds anyway :wink: )

    Also misses the point that the aircraft can be based ashore.

    Nice piece of biased piss poor reporting.
  10. That would be a full battle group facing a naval threat. RN carrier would operate with one or two escorts and a support ship at a guess. Or on her own when on important jollies to Hong Kong / Bermuda / USA and the like.
  11. I beleive that the RN should ideally have 3 carriers, if one is in dry dock or gets sunk, at least you have got the flexibility provided by another 2 carriers.
    I also beleive they should be the catapult version, giving greater flexibility in aircraft types, and providing compatability with the USN.

    100 billion spent over 50 years does not seem, to much to me, for the surface fleets major offensive assets.
    Although it seems very odd that this government is cutting back on the rest of the Fleet, whilst still planning for 2 new carriers.
  12. Yes, but the RN crews hot bunk and work shifts. there may be 1800 beds but the potential is for 3600 crew.
  13. just a thought. is this story a plant by the labour party? Is it the first salvo in their justification for NOT buying the carriers? Build up public resentment at the cost, or at the very least apathy, then cancel the program. The goverment has already renaged on promises to the admiralty to buy 8 type 45s (now only 6 being bought). So another couple of boats to cancel and they will have 'sunk' the RN with barely a whisper from the Royal Navy.

    On a good note. My shares in Al Milliners PLC are at an all time high.


  14. RN surface ship crews don't hot bunk. In an emergency, yes, so could anyone. Food and water would be in short supply though, can't nip to the local market for resupply.

    Not sure if they still do on the black turd underwater thingies that glow in the dark.

    Automation means half the crew needed. CVF are around twice the size of the Invicible class, so the crew size will remain the same at about 1500.