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Roman Coin Hoard Discovered ... In Poland!?!

theoriginalphantom

MIA
Book Reviewer
Farmer looking for abandoned antlers stumbles upon largest ever haul of roman coins.

I think @Kirkz would have been happier with the antlers!


I wouldn't mind a few myself. I need to make some handles, and I suppose I now have time to attempt making another viking style comb. the last one didn't go well. it was more like a series of spikes on a dangerously flimsy handle
 
The expansion of eth Roman Empire was complex, they often tried to keep a layer of buffer states around around. Their loyalty maintained by a combination of bribery and military power.

Scotland is a fine example of that
Exactly.

My take on this, until such time as any further evidence comes to light, is that it is a haul acquired either as loot or a bribe from closer to the Roman frontier, then taken back to Poland.

The Romans, as Fang_Farrier observes, had complex processes for managing their frontiers. Barbarians closest to the frontiers got a hefty dose of both carrot and stick. They were allowed to trade at frontier posts - the Roman garrisons probably bought some of their food from them and the barbarians would also sell slaves, kidnapped from their neighbours, which saved the Romans bothering; their kings/chieftains were bribed heavily with gold, wine, slavegirls; and their young men were allowed to join the Roman army as auxiliaries, do all the dirty work and a fair bit of dying for the glory of Rome, become civilised, then retire home as the wealthiest bloke in the village. (Exactly the Gurkha model, by no coincidence at all thanks to the classical education of the British imperial management team.)

Only ever went wrong when a German noble learned his trade just a bit too well, went home and then gave the Romans a kicking; Arminius, who destroyed Varus' three legions, was just such a former Romanised German officer. Same again during the Batavian rebellion in AD69 led by a one-eyed German gwar ex-officer, which included the capture of the Romans' Rhine fleet whilst the admiral was off shagging his mistress one night; that probably made for an interesting explanation to the emperor...

Equally, the stick ranged from individual kings, perceived by Rome to being a bit too successful, getting invited to dinner by a Roman general to get murdered over the entrée, or, if they were lucky, merely bundled off to enforced retirement in a luxury villa in southern Spain. More often, the Romans would just go for a genocidal womble over the Rhine and Danube to massacre everyone they could find within thirty or fifty miles of the frontier. This was the favoured tactic with the Caledonians, for example. Hadrian's Wall was not so much to keep the buggers out of the Empire, more to stop them getting any sheep, pigs, cattle, or cartloads of metal back into Scotland should they have the cheek to nip over the wall one night for a bit of recreational thieving. One particular find in the Rhine was a cargo of looted pots, pans, and other assorted metalwork which is reckoned to have been the cargo of a raiders' raft or boat, lost trying to get the loot back over the river, either because of poor watermanship or because a Roman patrol boat caught them in mid-stream. Conversion to Christianity did not stop the emperor Constantine from throwing two German kings to the lions for a combination of light entertainment and robust diplomacy.

The one problem the Romans never solved was that whilst they could bribe/scare the tribes nearest to the frontiers to behave most of the time, those deeper in the hinterland were less easy to influence. They got very jealous of the perceived wealth of the frontier tribes, and would be tempted to come and get a share, either duffing up the frontier tribes to nick their accumulated bribes, or even raiding the Romans then trying to scarper back home and leave the locals to get massacred by the punitive response. The first times that we have any mention in Roman records of tribes such as the Vandals and Lombards, who would later take over bits of the former empire, is when they were doing just such long distance raiding from deep inside Germania (ie Germany, Bohemia and Poland).
 
Other than that there were apparently no other dateable coins or valuables from later periods found at the site.

They were found spread out over a field so the original burial location has been lost. Did they find anything else from the roman period there?
 
Agreed, but had been in decline since the 2nd C AD, and Lublin is a long way north-east through the German forest.

From Wiki - 'The Roman Empire reached its greatest geographical extent under Trajan (r. 98–117), who ruled a prosperous state that stretched from Armenia to the Atlantic.'

View attachment 461604
and it was Hadrian who thus limited it. He succeeded Trajan. Lublin Looks smack in the middle of Sarmatian lands according to my Muirs and that's right next to Dacia. I STR that Sarmatia was tributary to Rome and that it's Horsemen were sent to Northern Britain as was the custom with the Roman Armies of posting forces away from home which may give us something to go on. New Universal encyclopaedia does seem to indicate that they were conquered by the Goths. So there's the faint possibility that was a Sarmation Officer( soldier's) cache who served in Britain in the first place and then went home.
The Dacian Wars (101–102, 105–106) were two military campaigns fought between the Roman Empire and Dacia during Emperor Trajan's rule. The conflicts were triggered by the constant Dacian threat on the Danubian province of Moesia and also by the increasing need for resources of the economy of the Empire. From Wikki
 
and it was Hadrian who thus limited it. He succeeded Trajan. Lublin Looks smack in the middle of Sarmatian lands according to my Muirs and that's right next to Dacia. I STR that Sarmatia was tributary to Rome and that it's Horsemen were sent to Northern Britain as was the custom with the Roman Armies of posting forces away from home which may give us something to go on. New Universal encyclopaedia does seem to indicate that they were conquered by the Goths. So there's the faint possibility that was a Sarmation Officer( soldier's) cache who served in Britain in the first place and then went home.
The Dacian Wars (101–102, 105–106) were two military campaigns fought between the Roman Empire and Dacia during Emperor Trajan's rule. The conflicts were triggered by the constant Dacian threat on the Danubian province of Moesia and also by the increasing need for resources of the economy of the Empire. From Wikki

Dunno. Not all Dacians were in the Roman province of Dacia, coins date from as late as the early 3nd C AD and as for 'smack in the middle', I guess it depends on which map you're using. Lublin is about 200km NW of Lviv.

a6e37fbb3e4ba4cce70429f72f24e753_XL.jpg


 
Dunno. Not all Dacians were in the Roman province of Dacia, coins date from as late as the early 3nd C AD and as for 'smack in the middle', I guess it depends on which map you're using. Lublin is about 200km NW of Lviv.

View attachment 461705

According to the NUE, Sarmatia had once been from the Black sea to the Baltic and Muirs in the Roman period shows a vast place so I agree that some places were generically associated. Lublin is roughly in line south of Koenigsberg but the point I was making is that the Dacian Wars were attributable to Trajan and to all intents an purposes Romans did not penetrate into what is now Poland, but they well have had political clout from the Eastern part of the Empire. I appreciate my Muirs is a bit dated now and so is the NUE. But I don't like depending purely on modern interpretations. i,e the hoard may have nothing to do with the Goths, they may have missed it completely and it may be earlier, hence the pertinent question how was it stratified by @ stacker 1
 
A I appreciate my Muirs is a bit dated now and so is the NUE. But I don't like depending purely on modern interpretations. i,e the hoard may have nothing to do with the Goths, they may have missed it completely and it may be earlier, hence the pertinent question how was it stratified by @ stacker 1

As the hoard is reported from the article to have been scattered across a ploughed field, there is no stratification. As there appears to be no other contextual finding with it, all that can be said with certainty is that it was lost some time after the last dateable coin. From the article, that's some time during the reign of Septimus Severus, so potentially not before 211AD, the last year of his reign. Unless the Polish archaeologist has a particular liking for them, I have no idea why he would announce a connection to the Vandals as the inhabitants of the vicinity of Lublin rather than the Sarmatians.
 
As the hoard is reported from the article to have been scattered across a ploughed field, there is no stratification. As there appears to be no other contextual finding with it, all that can be said with certainty is that it was lost some time after the last dateable coin. From the article, that's some time during the reign of Septimus Severus, so potentially not before 211AD, the last year of his reign. Unless the Polish archaeologist has a particular liking for them, I have no idea why he would announce a connection to the Vandals as the inhabitants of the vicinity of Lublin rather than the Sarmatians.
Well I have to agree, but then it sounds rather like an off the cuff report. Perhaps it’s a driver for a dig In the area. We have been surprised before and found Roman or some such where there is no evidence prior.
 
Another Roman Era find from the fringes of the Empire. I guess they could be described as 'mines' (as in mining - hole in the ground), as a 'booby trap' field sounds a bit strange if you're trying to grab the imagination (and headline).

BELT1-696x522.jpg

Image Credit : Museum Lolland-Falster

'Archaeologists from the Museum Lolland-Falster have discovered a large 770-metre-long defensive earthwork belt that dates from around the Roman Iron Age near Rødbyhavn on Lolland, Denmark.

'The Roman Iron Age is a period from AD 100-400 that is used to describe the hold that the Roman Empire had begun to exert on the Germanic tribes of Northern Europe in Denmark, Norway, and Scandinavia. During this period, there was an influx of trade between the northern tribes and the Roman Empire, with the import of various high-status items such as vessels, bronze images, glass items, and weapons. By the 5-6th centuries, the Roman Empire was ransacked by the Germanic tribes, bringing an end to the Roman Iron Age and the start of the Germanic Iron Age (also called the Vendel Era or the Merovinger Age).

'Archaeologists have so far detected 770-metres of the defensive belt, but they believe that this is just part of a larger fortified line that ran from the island’s wetlands to the coast measuring up to 1400 metres. Described as a minefield, the area studied contains at least 10,000 holes that held sharpened spikes with the aim to delay any advancing armies. A similar technique was used by the Roman military, often referred to in historical documents as “the lily”. Roman soldiers would sink foot long iron hooks into the ground, a technique Caesar himself used successfully during his campaigns against the Gauls.'


 
In my soon to be written Phd , I aim to demonstrate that the Romans couldn't advance any further than Poland because the rail gauges were different , were reliant on horse drawn transport and chariots and didn't have suitable winter clothing .
 
In my soon to be written Phd , I aim to demonstrate that the Romans couldn't advance any further than Poland because the rail gauges were different , were reliant on horse drawn transport and chariots and didn't have suitable winter clothing .

I predict a 'D' grade for your crayon-written thesis.
 
Another Roman Era find from the fringes of the Empire. I guess they could be described as 'mines' (as in mining - hole in the ground), as a 'booby trap' field sounds a bit strange if you're trying to grab the imagination (and headline).

View attachment 477308
Image Credit : Museum Lolland-Falster

'Archaeologists from the Museum Lolland-Falster have discovered a large 770-metre-long defensive earthwork belt that dates from around the Roman Iron Age near Rødbyhavn on Lolland, Denmark.

'The Roman Iron Age is a period from AD 100-400 that is used to describe the hold that the Roman Empire had begun to exert on the Germanic tribes of Northern Europe in Denmark, Norway, and Scandinavia. During this period, there was an influx of trade between the northern tribes and the Roman Empire, with the import of various high-status items such as vessels, bronze images, glass items, and weapons. By the 5-6th centuries, the Roman Empire was ransacked by the Germanic tribes, bringing an end to the Roman Iron Age and the start of the Germanic Iron Age (also called the Vendel Era or the Merovinger Age).

'Archaeologists have so far detected 770-metres of the defensive belt, but they believe that this is just part of a larger fortified line that ran from the island’s wetlands to the coast measuring up to 1400 metres. Described as a minefield, the area studied contains at least 10,000 holes that held sharpened spikes with the aim to delay any advancing armies. A similar technique was used by the Roman military, often referred to in historical documents as “the lily”. Roman soldiers would sink foot long iron hooks into the ground, a technique Caesar himself used successfully during his campaigns against the Gauls.'


Stupid place to build an earthwork in the middle of a farmers field.
 

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