RN surrenders to French & Spanish 200 years after Trafalgar

BuggerAll

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#1
I apologise in advance because I can't find a link - but it was widly reported on BBC radio and TV news this morning (28 Jun 05).

The Navy is staging a re-enactment of Trafalgar this evening. In order not to offend the French or the Spanish the 2 sides will be refered to as Red and Blue forces. The head of the Navy didn't want the commemorations to be truimphalist.

WTF is going on. I'm sure the French celebrate thier victories without worrying about what thier vanquished foe think. (OK I accept the slight flaw in this arguament - they don't have any victories or vanquished foe but....)

After hearing this mealy mouthed cr@p I just wondered why they are bothering at all.

Are we going to Celebrate (sorry 'comemorate') Waterloo in 10 years pretending that it wasn't a great victory?
 
#2
Admiral West (head of RN) was on the box this morning - "French are being very adult about this".

1. Turn up at someone's party with a ship bigger than theirs (OK, maybe our fault)

2. Insist that no mention is made of French defeat

3. Bring hundreds of fishing boats to clean out UK waters (a daily occurrence)

4. If everyone in EU disagrees with your President, throw teddy out of pram and say UK is being pathetic.


I can't find the link at the moment (historc sites are being over-subscribed), but a wee while back I came across photos from the 20's of Victory, HMS a.n.other, and the un bateau Française.

This last was IIRC Redoutable (French flagship as Trafalgar), and was captured, renamed, put out to grass, hulked, used as a boarding pontoon etc.

After WW2 it was offered to de Gaulle so he could do a restoration, we'd done Victory, the septics Constitution (et al). He turned it down - wonder why - so we scuttled/topedoed/bombed it in the channel.



The French are soooo adult about these things. Oh yeh ?

Edited to identify frogboat as HMS Implacable, formerly the DUGUAY TR0UIN. The Trincomalee mentioned is preserved in Hartlepool. Must visit it next time I feel the need to stretch the neck of any simians. Also Last photos
 
#3
If you`d ever been to the Waterloo site and museum you would`ve thought that Napoleon had won, the Duke of Wellington is hardly given a mention. Also saw a programme about some Brits re-locating to France and the locals were surprised to hear from their new neighbours that Britain was actually involved in the First World War. Anyway what do you expect, this is Britain, we have to apologise for being such an ogre in the past because of our weak kneed politicians and liberal media :evil:
 
#4
slick said:
If you`d ever been to the Waterloo site and museum you would`ve thought that Napoleon had won, the Duke of Wellington is hardly given a mention. Also saw a programme about some Brits re-locating to France and the locals were surprised to hear from their new neighbours that Britain was actually involved in the First World War. Anyway what do you expect, this is Britain, we have to apologise for being such an ogre in the past because of our weak kneed politicians and liberal media :evil:
and the French have doing what the Japos been doing for years, selectively editing school History books to slant things in the French's favour, remember Franch is quite as free and liberal as the UK, the French Criminal Justice system is a joke.
 
#5
Saw the Captain of FS Charles DeGaulle interviewed on TV last night. Indeed, very adult about the whole thing and gave full credit to Admiral Lord Nelson and spoke better English than some British Officers of the same rank. Likewise the French Admiral this morning though his English was not as bon. He said was looking forward to being inspected by HM The Queen. I bet his ships and their companies will be a credit to France.

The French like our Queen; she speaks excellent French (better than Bliar).
 
#6
Don't cr@p on the RN because their boss is mealy-mouthed and politically minded............I'm sure the Army does not think like their mouthpiece Jackson on a lot of matters!!!!!! He's not the Navy and Jackson is not the Army. Rant over
 
#7
But the Navy's boss does have a good record: court-martialled for losing classified documents relating to RN cuts while he was at MoD - documents ended up in the hands of the Daily Mail :) On the other side of the coin he was awarded IIRC the DSO after losing his ship (Ardent) in Bomb Alley in the Falklands. Jackson, oth, was one of two qualified to take over H's command, but Chaundler got it.
 
#8
....and it's good to see Her Maj's Forces on TV being commentated on by people haven't had a lot of exposure to this sort of thing.

This morning on BBC "... over there is HMS Illustrious with her 'Top Gun' style ramp........" :)
 

BuggerAll

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#9
Much as I loath the cheese eating surrendah monkeys I will have to correct 1 thing said above. Along the Western Front the Frogs are very on-side. More Union Flags on building than you see over here. The only part of the country that decent. I have no hesitation in recomending that you should visit Albert etc.

Socialism (CAP etc relaxed lifestyle etc) works in France because the rest of us pay for it. Oh and our Grandfathers paid for French liberty in a rather harder coin.

Rant nearly Over
 
#10
Another irritating thing is commentators prefixing HMS with 'the'. How can a ship be 'The' Her Majesty's Ship Endurance (or whichever)?

It's not just Trafalgar, of course. We should not forget the Battle of the Nile, or Copenhagen; other victories for Nelson over the Frogs.
 
#11
Reference Sir Alan's past, the then Commander West was awarded the DSC (not DSO Trackpen) after HMS Ardent was bombed from under him in 1982.

VB, as you know the press are 'kin useless at communicating matters martial/naval and so we are treated to 'the HMS'. RFAs become 'HMS' or worse; RAF. :wink:

Top Gun? Journos, huck spit. Did the carriers in Top Gay'un have ramps? 8O Journos always throw in a Spam/Hollywood point of reference. Makes it more real for the civilians. Unless the reference is to Special Forces: "Navy SEALS; the US equivalent of the SBS'. Equally wide of the mark.

Yesterday's Torygraph made three howlers in respect of the IFR. Page 5;

The largest vessel present will be the French carrier Charles de Gaulle at 223 ft long
Two hundred and twenty three feet FFS?

The Queen will review the gathered fleet from the Arctic survey ship
Endurance
Out by half the planet this time, not just a matter of confusing metres and feet; Antarctic.

Captain Richards believed..........
Who he? No reference or intro to Captain Richards in the lead up to his quote.

Journos. They think theirs is a profession. Keel haul them! Then flog them around the fleet.
 
#13
Anniversary of Trafalgar? I think not. Someone should check their history. No one on TV seems to have noticed that the battle occurred in October.
 
#14
AWOL wrote;
Anniversary of Trafalger? I think not. Someone should check their history. No one on TV seems to have noticed that the battle occurred in October.
I think they know that but at the rate the RN is being run down, there will be no ships or sailors left by October so the party is early.
 
#16
Personally I think the celebrations are a complete sham! I am an avid part time naval enthusiast and the thought of a slack handful of mainly modern ships cavorting about the sea around Portsmouth is completely taking the p*ss out of the whole affair. Having been a "Nelson Fan" for many years I am very disappointed with this June fiasco. Why on earth the celebrations couldn't have been geared arount the actual week of the battle in October god only knows. I was building myself into a frenzy about the celebrations but will now be quite content to celebrate the great victory off Cape Trafalgar in my own way on the actual date! I cannot believe this great nation has allowed itself to kow-tow such a miserable bunch of losers such as the French and Spanish. I feel sorry for the Officers, Ratings and Marines who are unfortunately being made to look a right bunch of cnuts! Don't worry lads it'll be the turn of the army soon.......................the 200th anniversary of the battle of Waterloo will be upon us! Apparently the charge of the Scots Greys will be simulated by a Sqn of Challengers with the Highlanders grimly hanging onto the kit stowage bins!
 

Mr Happy

LE
Moderator
#17
MrPVRd said:
Can we tell the Spams to tone down their July 4th celebrations? I find them most jingoistic and un-PC! :wink:
Quite.

On the French side wasn't their some liberation of Paris thing last year where the parade was led by an officer of some English Cav unit riding his horse Agincourt? - If my memory serves. I guess the Froggies bringing the biggest boat to the party seems fair and actually only our fault. Personally I'm quite happy that Britfor is on telly and in the public eye.
 
#18
I think that maybe we are being a little too magnanamous in victory. What a pity that we can't be celebrating the fact that this one battle effectivly facilitated the start of the British Empire. Or would mention of the glorious British Empire offend Mr Mugabe et al?
 
#19
Some yellow bellied *********,*** ****** was on the Jeremy Vine show today & said we should'nt waste money on commemorations like this,that the money should go to the poor,ect.Most of the comments were negative & this **** argued that the should be statues of Charles Dickens & other 'Greats' in the Mall instead of our military leaders.
If these liberal thinking,yellow bellied pacifist's get there way,all our comrades from whatever branch of service will fall by the wayside,never to be remembered by the future generations for the sacrifices they made.
Please god,save us from Europe!!!
Spike
 
#20
spike7451 said:
Some yellow bellied *********,*** ****** was on the Jeremy Vine show today & said we should'nt waste money on commemorations like this,that the money should go to the poor,ect.Most of the comments were negative & this **** argued that the should be statues of Charles Dickens & other 'Greats' in the Mall instead of our military leaders.
Yes, this chap was a bit of an apologist t*sser but, if you heard the beginning of the interview, you may have noted that he said that the funds would have been better spent on caring for soldiers with PTSD etc as provision for members and ex-members of the forces hadn't improved much since the fleet wasn't allowed to dock after Trafalgar because funds weren't available to pay the sailors.

He wasn't all bad ;)
 

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