RMPs: Coming to an "Alcohol Disorder Zone" near you!

#1
From the BBC website:

Drunk yobs facing military police

Military police have been drafted in to help the local force tackle drunken behaviour in a market town.
Members of the Royal Military Police (RMP) and the Ministry of Defence Police have have begun working with beat officers in Royston, Herts.

They are drafted in from Thursday evenings through to Sunday morning - the times when most drink-related disorder takes place.

The scheme started after three servicemen were assaulted and robbed.

I'm trying to do the best I can for the people locally - this gives that extra presence that people like to see

Chief Insp David Partridge

Chief Insp David Partridge, of Hertfordshire Police, said: "The Royal Military Police helped with those investigations and they did all the things we would normally do.

"Normally, I would have had to have struck off a couple of detectives to work on it.

"In the end I thought 'Here are some people trained to a high standard and there were mutual interests in resolving these issues'."

Mr Partridge decided to draw up a protocol putting the co-operation between the three forces on a formal and legal basis.

As a result MOD police can now patrol jointly with Hertfordshire Police in the town and join them in making arrests.

The RMP still patrol separately, but share radio frequencies and intelligence briefings with their colleagues.

One RMP officer and one member of the MOD police have been made available for regular patrols, but Hertfordshire Police are able to draw on further officers if there is a need and if they are free.

Positive feedback

The move comes as the government introduces tough new measures designed to crack down on drunken violence in the country's town and city centres.

Drinking bans, Alcohol Disorder Zones and new powers to shut pubs and clubs at the centre of trouble are all being proposed by the Home Office.

Mr Partridge said: "I'm trying to do the best I can for the people locally. This gives that extra presence that people like to see.

"It gives me more flexibility in how I can target my resources because I get a surplus at certain times.

"The feedback from the public and local councillors has been positive."
Deliberately not posted in the RMP forum, because I want to know what everybody else thinks.

V!
 
#2
Combined patrols were carried out in NI as part of process of getting RUC back on streets. Worked well. Such joint patrols also used to work well in foreign countries. When the world navies were building up in Gib for the Coronation, we would have patrols consisting os six or more nationalities - that was scary.
As for UK - will work until provost guy does cock up or looks as if he/she has cocked up. It will then get spun into major disaster by the meeja.
 
#3
This is being debated on "current affairs" chaps....
 
#4
More sport. looking forward to it.......
 
#5
Sticky legal wicket. RMP are not and do not have the powers of a constable, howecer much they like to think so.
 
#6
Suppose it saves money on hiring more 'Speshail Constables'

But as stated, they do not have powers of arrest over Civvies,
 

Auld-Yin

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#7
It is about time that a decent taxi service should be in place.
 
#8
Sabre said:
Suppose it saves money on hiring more 'Speshail Constables'

But as stated, they do not have powers of arrest over Civvies,
However, RMP can make a Citizens Arrest, just as can any other member of the British Public, whilst waiting for the Peelers to arrive.
 
#9
Barry_Trotter said:
Sabre said:
Suppose it saves money on hiring more 'Speshail Constables'

But as stated, they do not have powers of arrest over Civvies,
However, RMP can make a Citizens Arrest, just as can any other member of the British Public, whilst waiting for the Peelers to arrive.
Only for serious offences, Not for the like of Smoking a spliff or pissing in an alley.
 
#10
Civvies must be laughing.
RMP's round our way got called out to a fight involving 20-25 blokes. A mixture of squaddies & civvies. The RMP being very brave or very stupid sent 2 blokes. :lol:
The civvies just got into their car and took the piss. Apparently it was very funny to watch.

So in a civvy town they will probably get no respect at all.
In my day if 3 of our blokes had got jumped whilst out on the town the following week we would've took the whole squadron up their and taught them some respect.
 

Auld-Yin

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#11
RMP only sent 2 because they were waiting for TA reinforcements from Op Plod 2 to clear Chilwell.
 
#12
Doesn't the article say the RMP and Herts Police will be patrolling "jointly" (ie together)? The RMP will therefore be assisting a constable and problems regarding powers of arrest by RMP over civilians probably won't arise. Alternatively, they could swear-in the RMP as special constables (as happens in FI and Cyprus), which would give them full constabularly powers.

At the very least, as has already been mentioned, the RMP will have civilian powers of arrest, which effectively means they can arrest for any arrestable offence (eg theft, criminal damage, serious assaults and woundings, some public order offences and more serious offences generally). An ordinary person also has a general power of arrest for 'breach of the peace', which covers a multitude of situations.

However this scheme pans out, it's unlikely to fail from a legal standpoint.
 
#13
Its hard enough to get our Monkeys to turn up at a ruck in the local NAAFI. I suppose if we let them make out that they are real policemen they may take more of an interest.
 
#14
Oi Braindrain, If silly little toy soldiers could handle their beer like men and not boys then there would not be a need for the Monkey's to turn up and sort out their petty little handbag fights that they (you?) have would there?

As said before the RMP will exercise their powers of arrest as per the norm with servicemen, however, if called to assist by a civil police officer then they can assist in effecting an arrest with civvies also, due to the fact they (RMP) are Home Office trained in the baton and cuffs, they would be entitled to use them if the need arose. Hope this clears it up now.
 

Auld-Yin

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#15
Bit of a pointless argument M-M.

For the monkeys to catch anyone they HAVE to be pissed and find difficulty in walking. Anyone in the upright position and looking as though they can handle themselves are left alone.

Unless things have changed drastically over the centuries monkeys could not even catch a cold.
 
#16
Don't you just love a bit of jealousy? It is truly great and is good for the system. Just think if you had done better on you aptitude test then there could have been a slight chance that you too could have joined the elitist Redcaps!

I fully concur Auld Tin with your lack of confidence in the RMP, but I think that you need to be aware that the RMP have moved on a bit since you were in and they are no longer on horseback, which is not a good 'vehicle' for giving chase really, they now have a great mode of transport called CARS, isn't that just purely amazing, technology tsk! Of course it would be interesting to know whether you speak from having spent a FULL career in the Forces travelling the World and witnessing the RMP operate in different theatres or whether your knowledge base is as a result of a couple of years National service in UK. After all RMP do their real time job when they are on peace time and Ops, as oppose to open gates in peace time!

I don't quite know the relevance in them not being able to catch colds, has the cold been a naughty boy or committed a crime? Mmm don't know how becoming ill can reflect the work that the RMP achieve, answers on a postcard please.....

It is fair to say that there would be no need for the RMP to go round catching the little soldier boys if they could handle their booze and not show the entire British nation by acting like knuckle dragging individuals who look as though they are part of the lost Cro-Magnon race.

Rest assured though when soldier boy wants RMP he will come running........


Have a wonderful weekend :)
 
B

Biscuits_AB

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#17
Clear as mud to me. Why does being 'Home Office trained in the baton and cuffs' as you put it, give you the authority to use them against civvies? Does being 'Home Office trained in the batons and cuffs' grant you the powers of Constable? Can you refer us to some legislation that states that being 'Home Office trained in the baton and cuffs' means that you can arrest civilians or indeed use them to subdue a civilian, whether or not called upon to do so by a Constable?

I've noticed in a few of your posts that you like to use the expression 'Home Office trained'. Care to explain to us, who it would appear aren't 'Home Office trained' what that is?

PS - Cro-Magnon man wasn't a 'race'. But he was by far, more developed than the Neanderthal, who was a closer relative of the Monkey.
 
#18
Biscuit - Home Office Trained simply means it has been accrdited and recognised by the Home Office which in turn is the standard set/used for UK police forces. Regarding that particular course it means that the RMP are trained to the same National minimum standard required for the deployment of the baton and cuffs. The point I was highlighting that IF there was a need to use them on civvies then they could as they are trained to the same standard as the civpol. There is legislation that covers the use of the baton and falls within 'The Use of Force' doctrine 'A person may use as much force as is neccessary in the effecting of an arrest....blah blah blah...I wont bore you with it!

Read my post I did not say they were acting like someone from the Cro-Magnon race, I said 'who look as though they are part of the lost Cro-Magnon race' emphasis on the word look, thus suggesting that they look not act, apearance not intelligence, got it?

HOpe this helps, if not speak to someone who gives fcuk. :)
 
B

Biscuits_AB

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#20
Moon_Monkey said:
Biscuit - Home Office Trained simply means it has been accrdited and recognised by the Home Office which in turn is the standard set/used for UK police forces. Regarding that particular course it means that the RMP are trained to the same National minimum standard required for the deployment of the baton and cuffs. The point I was highlighting that IF there was a need to use them on civvies then they could as they are trained to the same standard as the civpol. There is legislation that covers the use of the baton and falls within 'The Use of Force' doctrine 'A person may use as much force as is neccessary in the effecting of an arrest....blah blah blah...I wont bore you with it!

Read my post I did not say they were acting like someone from the Cro-Magnon race, I said 'who look as though they are part of the lost Cro-Magnon race' emphasis on the word look, thus suggesting that they look not act, apearance not intelligence, got it?

HOpe this helps, if not speak to someone who gives fcuk. :)
Thanks for that. The 'blah, blah blah,' bit must be way over my head. I've never read it before in any legal publication. I assumed, wrongly it would appear, that you could point me in the direction of some legislation which states that you can use 'the baton and cuffs' as you call them, against a civilian. I do not believe that by merely working alongside a civilian police officer affords you the right to assault a citizen. Further, I do not believe that the Constable with you has the authority to give you the powers to assault anyone. If you do not posses the Powers of a Constable, then surely if you strike a civilian with 'the baton', you have assaulted him and/or if you secure a civilian in 'the cuffs' not only have you assaulted him, you have also unlawfully detained him?

I fully appreciate that if you were to witness a police officer being assaulted then you could 'using reasonable force' assist the police officer. Is this what you mean?

As a mere side issue, you stated that Cro-Magnon man was a race. I merely corrected you and said that he wasn't. I didn't refer to anything else, apparant or presumed.

Why is it that you feel the need to be rude in all of your posts whilst at the same time trying to bat for the RMP as being professional? You obviously don't 'give a f*ck', but I'm sure that your colleagues more than probably do. You're doing your cap badge no favours here. That is, if indeed you are RMP.
 

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