Rifles Hot or Not - Show us yer kit!

What is interesting is that most of the dimensions seem to be in imperial! The thread on the end of the needle is 1BA (or as close as makes no difference) and the main screws all seems to be nominal inch fractions!

Certainly not metric, although perhaps as the Needle gun was used in the Franco Prussian war, this may not be surprising!
There's imperial threads on a surprising number of Continental arms - IIRC Vetterli threads are Imperial cos the man hiself had studied gunsmithing in the UK IIRC.
 
When he drags himself out of bed at lunchtime, show him these. It's a factory refurb L1A1 with a new barrel and new furniture, shot at 300m.

Off the bag, target rings are 10cm, 20cm, 30cm etc...

Then prone freehand, take 1. the 4 ring is 20cm wide, and the figure is about 45cm wide:

Take 2: same again
For the benefit of mathematical dinosaurs like me, what's that grouping translated into MOA?
 
For the benefit of mathematical dinosaurs like me, what's that grouping translated into MOA?
The tight 5 round group is about 1 2/3 MOA. It was only a 5 shot group though, and I'm not sure I could repeat it!!! But it really kills the idea that the hinged receiver is fundamentally flawed from the get-go, at least until it's shagged out.

Edit to add: the first group was about 4.25 MOA including the outlier at the top.
 
The tight 5 round group is about 1 2/3 MOA. It was only a 5 shot group though, and I'm not sure I could repeat it!!! But it really kills the idea that the hinged receiver is fundamentally flawed from the get-go, at least until it's shagged out.

Edit to add: the first group was about 4.25 MOA including the outlier at the top.
Thanks much, that about ties in with what I get out of mine. 100mtrs 5 shot groups of 1.5 MOA using Prvi Partizan.
300 mtrs a shade more.
I can remember from my early days in Bisley (early 70s) the experienced shooters refused to open the action to remove the working parts for cleaning, the barrel was cleaned from the muzzle and that was it. Because opening it up could upset the zero! In those days the rifles weren't that old or much used, certainly not the RAF issued SLRs.

My bold.
 
Thanks much, that about ties in with what I get out of mine. 100mtrs 5 shot groups of 1.5 MOA using Prvi Partizan.
300 mtrs a shade more.
I can remember from my early days in Bisley (early 70s) the experienced shooters refused to open the action to remove the working parts for cleaning, the barrel was cleaned from the muzzle and that was it. Because opening it up could upset the zero! In those days the rifles weren't that old or much used, certainly not the RAF issued SLRs.

My bold.
I suspect it's mostly psychological, but fundamentally opening it is one of those "no good can come of it" operations - either nothing happens, or something bad happens. I would do the same to be honest, just for never having to worry about it :)
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
I suspect it's mostly psychological, but fundamentally opening it is one of those "no good can come of it" operations - either nothing happens, or something bad happens. I would do the same to be honest, just for never having to worry about it :)
It was accepted practice amongst the shooting teams in those days, 2 weeks on the range with only a pull through each day and carbon removal from the gas system followed by a full clean at the end of the Bisley fortnight
 
I've just purchased a howa mini action with a heavy barrel in 6.5 Grendel and would like to put the rifle in to a chassis. I was thinking of the mdt oryx , has anyone had any experience with that system.
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itchy300

Old-Salt
Stuck in the house so I decided to covert the kids bedroom into a range. The board is placed at 3m and targets appear to be at the range written below. The targets are easy to patch up with drill rounds but it still allows my kid to play at brass chickens. Hours of fun :D

ETA rifle is a 1967 Ishapore 2A1 and the sword is a 1945 manufacturer I believe for lanchester SMG in RN service

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Stuck in the house so I decided to covert the kids bedroom into a range. The board is placed at 3m and targets appear to be at the range written below. The targets are easy to patch up with drill rounds but it still allows my kid to play at brass chickens. Hours of fun

View attachment 462197

View attachment 462198
If they get a bit bored, there's always bayonet drills with that donkey and elephant you can go for. Hopefully they won't cry to much when you skewer Eeyore with some cold steel!
 

4(T)

LE
Stuck in the house so I decided to covert the kids bedroom into a range. The board is placed at 3m and targets appear to be at the range written below. The targets are easy to patch up with drill rounds but it still allows my kid to play at brass chickens. Hours of fun :D

ETA rifle is a 1967 Ishapore 2A1 and the sword is a 1945 manufacturer I believe for lanchester SMG in RN service

View attachment 462197

View attachment 462198


I've been finding that the rounds go through the wall and into the neighbours' garden.

Wife can't hear the TV over the sound of gunshots.

.
 
Well it’s arrived. God knows when I will get to a range but it’s nice to have it. Cost a small fortune.

Am I mental paying that for a single shot? Probably, but it’s done now and whatever the alternative was, it was also a single shot.

View attachment 459223
looking forward to shooting it.
No not at all, it looks mint mate, single shot, so what, just look at how awesome it is.
 

HE117

LE
Well... I spent Easter carving my Butt!

It took me forever to sink the barrel and action into the stock, but I finally got there, and was able to fit the butt plate..

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Having got the action into the top of the stock, this then allows you to locate the trigger plate and sink it to the required depth... The action screw was already there, as this was the first thing I drilled in the stock blank....

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With the trigger plate located, then the position of the trigger guard and associated screw can be spotted and fitted.. The guard screw had been in the middle of the wormy wood and the thread was rusted away.. To cure this, I cut off the original screw head, (with stamped number etc.. ) and Tig welded it to the thread of a new wood screw..
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Attention could now be turned to my Butt...!

You may have noticed that I positioned the Butt plate slightly to the right of the blank so as to give a little bit of cast off.. This may not be 100% historically correct, but as I am not a southpaw, it is my gun, and it makes the fit a bit more comfortable..! With the butt plate in position, I then can start to remove wood.

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I use a combination of spokeshaves, rasps and files to get the shape I want, based on the old stock profile. I decided to stick the old stock together with masking tape to restore the old profile and allow me to take measurements. To really shift wood at an angle, I use a cylindrical Surform file but you have to be careful not to split the grain at the edges..

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Once you have established the main lines, I find a half round bastard metal file is really good for shaping. You need to use a good sharp new one that has not been used for metal. I generally keep a progression of files going between projects.. they start off new on wood, then go to brass and finally end up on steel.

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OK.. that is as far as I will take it for the moment.. I will now start working on the forend stock leaving the wood around the action squared up until last so that I have somewhere to clamp it in the vice..

Edited to add... sorry about the colour cast on that final shot.. It makes the thing look like beech! It is much redder in reality. I have done a test piece with the grain fillers and oils that I intend to use, and the final colour is a good match for the original stock. I don't really want to use any dyes if I can avoid it, although I do use a bit of Alkanet root to improve the red tones! Looking at this picture, I am really pleased with the way the stock lies in the blank I found.. I did not want any fiddleback or feathering as this is a military piece, but I think I have got the grain running just where I want it!
 
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HE117

LE
A bit faster progress thank goodness..

Now working on the forward end of the stock...

Because this rifle has barrel bands and a nose cap, these define the profile of the forend stock. You start with the barrel channel which you dig out on the first phase when you bed in the barrel and action. Using the upper surface of the stock as the reference plane, you then need to shape the stock in stages, starting from the muzzle end..

The forend is something like a telescope, with each section getting bigger towards the action. Each section is defined by the fitting that sits at the widest part. The shape of the stock forward of the fitting is defined by the inner dimension as it has to pass over it. The shape of the stock behind the fitting is usually defined by the outer dimensions of the fitting, at least closely enough to get started..

So, to carve the stock, you first start with the muzzle cap which defines the distance between the barrel and the fitting. You basically carve down until it fits. The outside of the cap then gives you the starting dimensions for the next bit. You then take the next band, which should now fit over the wood under the end cap, and you then start working the band down the section, removing wood until the band is in it's correct position. You can then use the outside of the band as a guide to roughing down the next section.. rinse and repeat!

Rather than rasp or file down the excess wood at the sides of the blank, I use a Japanese Ryoba saw which has a cross cut blade on one side and a rip blade on the other to cut away the wood. These saws are brilliant and will slice fine sheets with ease and extreme accuracy. I can quite safely slice 1/8" x 11" slices with confidence. It takes a bit of practice to get use to using a pull saw, but I would never go back now..

Here is the first part of the fore end stock with the muzzle cap fitted, the first band being worked down the section, and the second band sitting where the first band will end up, but indicating what wood needs to come off the next section..
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You need to be a bit careful taking these dimensions off an old stock, as there is a good chance the old wood would have shrunk, or more likely been refinished and sanded down many times in the past. You need to think when taking measurements off an old stock and decide if they may have changed from the original!
 

HE117

LE
Final post on the Dreyse rebuild..

Just a few odds and ends to sort out, like the cleaning rod... but good to go!

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... just got to make the tooling for the ammo now!
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
I've just purchased a howa mini action with a heavy barrel in 6.5 Grendel and would like to put the rifle in to a chassis. I was thinking of the mdt oryx , has anyone had any experience with that system.View attachment 462838
I think that chassis rifles are a tad overated, ever since AI introduced its chassis stock in a traditional outline everyone has tried to best them. Frankly its an attractive looking rifle and if it shoots well enough I'd leave it alone.
 
I bought the rifle with out stock and acquired the stock because someone had one spare so looking at some options and just saw that the Oryx chassis was easily available. I only got the rifle a few week before the lock down that we have here in new Zealand and have put 40 rounds though it .it has a heavy barrel and looks a little snug.
 

HE117

LE
I think that chassis rifles are a tad overated, ever since AI introduced its chassis stock in a traditional outline everyone has tried to best them. Frankly its an attractive looking rifle and if it shoots well enough I'd leave it alone.
I would agree, particularly for civilian use.. The chassis concept is good for military rifles as it allows damage to be repaired by parts replacement without specialist stock fitting facilities, and the chassis will take much greater levels of punishment without loosing accuracy than you would need from a privately owned rifle.

The No4 T was a good sniper rifle more from the point of view of it's ruggedness than its precision! If you look at an SVD, it lies somewhere on the spectrum between a soldier's rifle and a target rifle..

Do not fall into the trap of assuming that a military sniper rifle's main characteristic is accuracy! The main characteristic is that it has to survive contact with rough soldiery..!
 

HE117

LE
Just putting this out there..


At least I can fire my Dreyse in UK.. just sayin!
 
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