RFA ARGUS replacement - what and when?

My newly promoted CPONS daughter is on there at the moment enjoying the cruising off north Scotland. Brings her total sea time up to about 6 weeks in 18 years service.
 
My newly promoted CPONS daughter is on there at the moment enjoying the cruising off north Scotland. Brings her total sea time up to about 6 weeks in 18 years service.
To be fair, when I was on, there were so many LNN and PONN’s with no good conduct badges on or Evan 1 sea day it was a laugh. Literally had no idea how to be naval like, though great at their medical roles I’ll add.


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Yokel

LE
If nothing else, this news story from Argus about her role during the recent Joint Warrior, serves as a reminder that a task group in contact with the enemy will need medical facilities:

RFA Argus - hospital exercise

Although the new Queen Elizabeth-class carriers have an impressive sick bay (including operating theatre) and surgical team (as well as the equivalent of a GPs’ surgery for day-to-day ailments), they are only designed to care for two seriously-ill patients for up to 72 hours.

The facilities on Argus – operating theatre, lab, CT scanner, intensive care unit and a ward – take treatment to the next level.

Despite her impressive facilities, Argus is not a hospital ship – there are strict definitions under international law – rather a primary casualty receiving ship; her medical team can treat serious battle injuries and stabilise them so they can be transferred to a hospital ashore to recuperate, recover and, if required, return to the front line.
 
Their red crossed Medvedev choppers don't carry miniguns.

the moustachiod casevac choppers in the usaf do. But no red cross.
“Pedro”
 
Yup. No red cross but door guns to the max.

DUSTOFF are flying ambulances so don't pack miniguns. But do fly red crosses.

It's interesting that the USAF and US Army have started flying a MERT style Chinook. Chin from the army, PJs from USAF.
Pedro’s have always had between two and three PJ’s, plus door gunners, they are pretty legit.

TRAP teams for the USMC arewhat the RM JPR lads are training to emulate for the RN.
There has been a lot of internal fighting about UK JPR, who “owns” it, who funds it etc, etc.
Wait and see when the director of SF, feels the RM are stepping onto areas that he can get more budget to do.
 
Pedro’s have always had between two and three PJ’s, plus door gunners, they are pretty legit.

TRAP teams for the USMC arewhat the RM JPR lads are training to emulate for the RN.
There has been a lot of internal fighting about UK JPR, who “owns” it, who funds it etc, etc.
Wait and see when the director of SF, feels the RM are stepping onto areas that he can get more budget to do.
The drawback is that the Fleet Cdr might call him out on his protectionism and invite him to meet his timelines.

Possibly.
 
They still release staff for disaster relief, charity work, etc.
No they don’t. Most of those that go to places like Nepal after the earthquakes (and I know a few) don’t work for the NHS, they work for agencies, or they use annual leave to do it. The NHS don’t have the staffing to allow people to wander off on exciting holidays when they choose.
 
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Yup. No red cross but door guns to the max.

DUSTOFF are flying ambulances so don't pack miniguns. But do fly red crosses.

It's interesting that the USAF and US Army have started flying a MERT style Chinook. Chin from the army, PJs from USAF.
Although airborne MERT is only any use if you’re sure that there is enough air superiority/ lack of MANPADS etc to reduce the chances of it getting shot down to very unlikely.

As they have at least one, if not two consultants on board plus ODP, ED nurse etc it’s not an asset that you want flying about in contested airspace. Most med planning now works on the principle that any MERT will be ground based and not on the back of a Chinook.
 
The drawback is that the Fleet Cdr might call him out on his protectionism and invite him to meet his timelines.

Possibly.
Undoubtedly, the only thing missing from the RN/RM plan is a truly dedicated JPR “cab”.
That also is the same issue facing the SF, hence the possible MH47F buy.
 
No they don’t. Most of those that go to places like Nepal after the earthquakes (and I know a few) don’t work for the NHS, they work for agencies, or they use annual leave to do it. The NHS don’t have the staffing to allow people to wander off on exciting holidays when they choose.
Funny old thing, I attended an urban warfare conference last week and the issue of medical personnel and medical services was discussed at length. The agency model has been successfully used in some places as a provider of last resort, but it is by no means universal. The NHS and NHS staff have played a significant role and will continue to do so. Suggesting that use of annual leave somehow negates this is an unusual idea.
 
Although airborne MERT is only any use if you’re sure that there is enough air superiority/ lack of MANPADS etc to reduce the chances of it getting shot down to very unlikely.

As they have at least one, if not two consultants on board plus ODP, ED nurse etc it’s not an asset that you want flying about in contested airspace. Most med planning now works on the principle that any MERT will be ground based and not on the back of a Chinook.
Maybe so.

The yanks have still developed the capacity. Not too sure of the medical capacity on board, seems to be some surgery capability.

Specifically around a USAF rescue squadron and a national guard medevac sqn.

If it's got any bearing a lot of the Pedro Blackhawk are getting old, their replacement is still years away.
 
Maybe so.

The yanks have still developed the capacity. Not too sure of the medical capacity on board, seems to be some surgery capability.

Specifically around a USAF rescue squadron and a national guard medevac sqn.

If it's got any bearing a lot of the Pedro Blackhawk are getting old, their replacement is still years away.
 
Funny old thing, I attended an urban warfare conference last week and the issue of medical personnel and medical services was discussed at length. The agency model has been successfully used in some places as a provider of last resort, but it is by no means universal. The NHS and NHS staff have played a significant role and will continue to do so. Suggesting that use of annual leave somehow negates this is an unusual idea.
Every NHS trust in the country (and private provider) is using significant amounts of agency nursing and there are something like 42000 FTE current nursing vacancies in the NHS alone. That’s over 10%. Agency use is universal in NHS Trusts and they’re not about to allow their staff to disappear on relatively long trips to work on a ship that has no direct benefit to them at all.

Going to Nepal for a fortnight is rather different from your concept of staffing up a long term commitment on a hospital ship.
 
A bit more advanced than i was led to believe, but still some work to be done.
The USAF set up for CSAR is different to ours, as is there idea of MERT.
MERT often deployed in very highly contested area of ops, had two over watch uglies, speed fail fast jets.
But most of all was the trust between ground combatants in TIC and the Aircrew.
 

Yokel

LE
Regarding the need to train aviators as aea, this story if of interest, although also suited to the Carrier thread.

Merlin crews earn their spurs...

The front-line Fleet Air Arm helicopter pilots, weapons experts and engineers of tomorrow are spending a month aboard HMS Queen Elizabeth in the North Sea to get used to living, working and flying at sea.

The trainees from 824 Naval Air Squadron normally earn their ‘sea legs’ on aviation training ship RFA Argus – very useful, but 40 years old, and with a rather cluttered flight deck which can only accommodate three helicopters simultaneously.


The aircrew can be trained synthetically, but what about the maintainers?
 
Link to Google News quote of FT article about the idea of using aid budget to buy hospital ship to be operated by RN , so the idea is still bubbling under.
 
Argus is a vital asset to NAS for training in the SCEXAs as well as a R3 PCRF. Not only that she can house a Sqn of Merlins and operate CH47s, operationally advantageous. She is equipped with an ops room with advance radar and EW systems meaning the ship can operate on the front line where she can best be utilised in all capacities... Currently deployed to the Caribbean.

There was talk of replacement and it was scrapped, instead an extending life refit. Options for PCRF is to have a shakeon style capability that can be placed on the Bay Class of required for R3 medical.
 

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